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NC500 vs NC1200 vs Purifi for Revel F226Be's

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Short-time lurker but deep-diver down-the-rabbit hole first time poster here,

I recently purchased the Revel F226Be's as my first set of speakers which are rated at the following:

Recommended amplifier power range 50 – 200 Watts RMS
Nominal impedance 8 ohms
Sensitivity (2.83V/1m) 90 dB

I was dead set on the Purifi 400s but after speaking with Apollon Audio, he has pushed me towards the NC500 or NC1200 after showing me this video. Summary of the video is that we actually need more power than our speakers recommended power range. Obviously Apollon is very educated far far far beyond me but this is very confusing a new information to me especially because I was sold that the F226Be's are fairly easy to drive based off reviews.

Do you believe that the NC500 or NC1200 will help the F226Be's sound better than Purifi amp? Why or why not? Also, due to the speakers only being rated for 200 WRMS maximum, is there a risk of blowing out my speakers with the NC500 versus the Purifi?
This is from the recent review over at Audioholics, might help in your decision making:

"Revel specifies both speakers as 8 ohms for nominal impedance. That may be true by their calculations, but much of the impedance for both speakers lay quite a bit lower than 8 ohms. The entirety of the mid-bass and upper bass regions hover around 5 ohms, and there is a pretty steep phase angle at the port tuning frequency of both speakers which also occurs at 5 ohms. This is not a particularly difficult electrical load but it is not so benign as a thoroughly 8-ohm speaker either. I wouldn’t run these speakers on an entry-level AVR, but my guess is that not many people who buy speakers in this price range are going to run their speakers on a $300 AVR, so I don’t think this will ever be a problem. I measured sensitivity for the F226Be at 88.0dB for 2.83v at 1 meter with the C426Be at 90.8dB for 2.83v at 1 meter. "
 

Fancypants

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Ah true. I wasn't thinking about this but I am also planning to using powered subwoofers for lower frequencies so this makes me think the Purifi really will not be worked that hard at my listening levels.

Hi there! I just got myself a pair of f226be speakers, I’m driving them off my Denon x3700h receiver. Did you find that the external amps improved the quality of the speakers? I’m not looking to go incredibly loud, but don’t want to leave any performance on the table if 105 wps is not sufficient, which is similar to your Yahama AVR.

I was looking at THIS monoprice 200w two channel amp.
 
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iw655321

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Hi there! I just got myself a pair of f226be speakers, I’m driving them off my Denon x3700h receiver. Did you find that the external amps improved the quality of the speakers? I’m not looking to go incredibly loud, but don’t want to leave any performance on the table if 105 wps is not sufficient, which is similar to your Yahama AVR.

Hah, I am in the exact same boat. F226Be's arriving next week, initially to be driven by the x3700h, but contemplating something more.
 

walt99

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Hah, I am in the exact same boat. F226Be's arriving next week, initially to be driven by the x3700h, but contemplating something more.
Just as a point of ref I'm getting my new system setup which includes a set of F328be's. Ran them off an old 5 channel Rotel (RB985/100w/ch) and a Anthem MRX740 (140w/ch) with no issues. Have settled on the AHB2 as the final amp to drive them which is 100w/ch/8ohm. Big room used for both music and HT, I don't find a need for anymore power than the single AHB2 (which sounds better than the others). Love the sound and build quality of the Benchmark. This is an end game system for me so my philosophy is buy once cry once, this new system should outlive me!
 
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radix

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc
 

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc

I'm using an STR power amp (400 into 8ohm) to drive a pair of 228bes currently, also supported by two subs. They sound wonderful, but I've used other quality amps and the SQ (to my ears) has not changed. You're hearing the speakers and the room, not the amp, assuming you have sufficient power for your situation. I've used bridged AHB2s (385 watts/channel into 8ohms btw), a McIntosh MC 312 stereo amp and a pair of March P701 monoblocs (NC1200 based).
I would encourage you to choose an amp with at least 200 watts into 8ohm and then base your choice on performance (see the chart here at ASR), cost, esthetics, build quality, warranty, customer service, and resale value. The Mac and Benchmark check all those boxes but your best bang for the buck would be a pair of P701s from March Audio. They have tremendous power reserve and all the advantages of class D, i.e. small footprint, highly efficient and relatively cool running. Mine do get quite warm but never hot. The AHB2s barely get warm.
Another very handy source of amplifier performance info is:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZlTOYxmPs938gqHjtDABkWS-MApu7uJjzIGnJ2Elm6Y/edit#gid=0
And if you're like me, doing the research, finding a retailer, checking the tracking number every day and finally the arrival and setup :) - That's a large part of the fun.
 

Matias

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc
There is just a new sale for a stereo amp based on NCore NC1200:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hypex-nc1200-stereo-amp.25555/
 

radix

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BrokenEnglishGuy

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I'm using an STR power amp (400 into 8ohm) to drive a pair of 228bes currently, also supported by two subs. They sound wonderful, but I've used other quality amps and the SQ (to my ears) has not changed. You're hearing the speakers and the room, not the amp, assuming you have sufficient power for your situation. I've used bridged AHB2s (385 watts/channel into 8ohms btw), a McIntosh MC 312 stereo amp and a pair of March P701 monoblocs (NC1200 based).
I would encourage you to choose an amp with at least 200 watts into 8ohm and then base your choice on performance (see the chart here at ASR), cost, esthetics, build quality, warranty, customer service, and resale value. The Mac and Benchmark check all those boxes but your best bang for the buck would be a pair of P701s from March Audio. They have tremendous power reserve and all the advantages of class D, i.e. small footprint, highly efficient and relatively cool running. Mine do get quite warm but never hot. The AHB2s barely get warm.
Another very handy source of amplifier performance info is:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZlTOYxmPs938gqHjtDABkWS-MApu7uJjzIGnJ2Elm6Y/edit#gid=0
And if you're like me, doing the research, finding a retailer, checking the tracking number every day and finally the arrival and setup :) - That's a large part of the fun.
why do you wanna that much power at 8ohm? you need the power at low impedances, not high..

---
With the purifi you have more than enough... you don't have the revel salon 2 or a big tank like that...
 

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why do you wanna that much power at 8ohm? you need the power at low impedances, not high..

---
With the purifi you have more than enough... you don't have the revel salon 2 or a big tank like that...

I was merely quoting basic power output for the amps, they of course put out even more power at lower impedance. As I stated 200 watts/8 ohms is likely plenty for most listeners. However, the subject of "how much power" is complex and not appropriate for this thread. Erin has recently created a YouTube video on the subject that is excellent and covers all the bases.
 

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Great spreadsheet! I was putting that together by hand for a few amps based on the data here on ASR. There's a used McIntosh 452 in my area that I was also thinking of, though it's really big! I'll check out those other suggestions too.

Marc
Happy Hunting :)
 

radix

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When looking at that spreadsheet, as I got down to the > 0.01% THD, I expected to see things like "Radio Shack DIY 2N2222 Amp" not $10,000 "hifi" stuff.

I took the data and plotted $/watt vs SINAD. There's really no correlation between price and noise. Note that the X-axis is log scale! The data labels are out of order (I'm not much of a google docs guy). I took the colors from how the spreadsheet had them.

chart.png


BTW, the cheapest (in $/watt terms) "blue" got is the Hypex NCore NC502MP. The most expensive "red" dot is the Balanced Audio Technology VK-56SE.

Marc

P.S. Copy of spreadsheet
 

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When looking at that spreadsheet, as I got down to the > 0.01% THD, I expected to see things like "Radio Shack DIY 2N2222 Amp" not $10,000 "hifi" stuff.

I took the data and plotted $/watt vs SINAD. There's really no correlation between price and noise. Note that the X-axis is log scale! The data labels are out of order (I'm not much of a google docs guy). I took the colors from how the spreadsheet had them.

View attachment 145778

BTW, the cheapest (in $/watt terms) "blue" got is the Hypex NCore NC502MP. The most expensive "red" dot is the Balanced Audio Technology VK-56SE.

Marc

P.S. Copy of spreadsheet

Welcome to ASR
 

Matias

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When looking at that spreadsheet, as I got down to the > 0.01% THD, I expected to see things like "Radio Shack DIY 2N2222 Amp" not $10,000 "hifi" stuff.

I took the data and plotted $/watt vs SINAD. There's really no correlation between price and noise. Note that the X-axis is log scale! The data labels are out of order (I'm not much of a google docs guy). I took the colors from how the spreadsheet had them.

View attachment 145778

BTW, the cheapest (in $/watt terms) "blue" got is the Hypex NCore NC502MP. The most expensive "red" dot is the Balanced Audio Technology VK-56SE.

Marc

P.S. Copy of spreadsheet
Check the 2nd tab of the spreadsheet as there are already charts and recommendations.
 

amper42

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc

If you're trying to decide on an amp, I would suggest measuring the volume you enjoy listening at with a sound level meter. For me, I typically don't exceed 75-80dB in a normal listening session and under 70dB would be normal for soothing music while talking with someone on concentrating on other tasks.

I'm running the Revel 328Be with Purifi amp. It fills the 24' x 28' room at 75dB with my RME ADI-2 DAC FS volume at -29. That leaves a HUGE amount of power untapped. I can't imagine the need for more power. Those who think the Purifi isn't enough for the F228Be or F328Be probably haven't actually tried it? It's certainly more than I need and the sound is crystal clear.
 

MaxBuck

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc
I own R11s, and I'm powering them with an NAD C298 based on the Purifi Eigentakt design. Today I played a Copland piece with probably the most extreme dynamic range I've ever encountered in a recording: SPLs ranged from 50 to 104 dbA at the listening point. Absolutely clean on both ends.
 

BrokenEnglishGuy

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I have the KEF R7 with the purifi EVAL-1, the volume seems to be unlimited... very very loud, i don't even wanna see how much loud it will be because seems to be for a high level DR music or a party... i don't know..
 

abdo123

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Hello all. I realize this is an old thread, but I wonder how the different amp choices worked out? I'm thinking of the F228Be or KEF R11 and want to know what to drive them with. Both are 90dB sensitivity at 8 ohm nominal. I'm looking at Benchmark monoblocks (200wpc @ 8), or should I go with an NC1200, which is cheaper (even for 2 monoblocks!) and a lot more power. I'll likely have 2x subs too.

I don't crank the volume a lot, but I want to have decent headroom.

Thanks,
Marc

how far will you be sitting from the speakers?
 

radix

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how far will you be sitting from the speakers?

About 8'/2.5m. The room is pretty big, maybe 400 ft2 / 37 m2. So for normal listening, it's not a big distance to fill, but sometimes I will want to fill the whole room.

Marc
 

abdo123

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About 8'/2.5m. The room is pretty big, maybe 400 ft2 / 37 m2. So for normal listening, it's not a big distance to fill, but sometimes I will want to fill the whole room.

Marc

well according to my calculations 200W @ 8 Ohm should be enough to produce 105 dBSPL peaks at your listening distance. Which is the reference level for cinema and movies.

https://www.crownaudio.com/en-US/tools/calculators#amp_power_required

now anything more than 200W can be used as headroom for EQ and room correction.

basically you're good with anything that produces clean peak power at 200W and anything extra is a plus.
 
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