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NAD M10 Streaming Amplifier Review
- Thread starter amirm
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It looks like DLBC will be rolled out soon
Apple will also fall to the sky soon
But then maybe they finally grew some conscience and decided to deliver what they promised years ago.
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keith_h
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I have today added two Fosi V3 monos to the M10 V1 which replaces the integrated nCore amplification. This deals with the non existent gain issue with the V1 which NAD didn't absolutely fix in the V2.
What this means is I had to turn the sub up a bit to compensate. First impression is that it sounds great, drives my speakers much louder. I am using a Harmon curve with 6db bass boost and the default sensitivity setting on the Fosi which may be -31. A slip of the finger drives the volume up to insane levels. At normal listening levels this sounds as it did before which is to say perfectly fine for me.
Is there actually any sonic difference? None I could obviously detect, it still sounds great. Therefore was it worth doing? Yes I think so since now I know plus I get a bit more grunt noting this is likely the difference in gain from the preamp to the monos, compared to the "gain algorithm) in the V1 which I felt was conservative given the specs of the amp and the results when driving my speakers. Note that nCore is whats said to be powering Levinsons Maria amplifiers from his new company Daniel Hertz so if its good enough for him then its probably OK. And if I can't hear any difference between the onboard nCore amps and outboard Fosi amps, I guess that means they are good enough at least for me.
What this means is I had to turn the sub up a bit to compensate. First impression is that it sounds great, drives my speakers much louder. I am using a Harmon curve with 6db bass boost and the default sensitivity setting on the Fosi which may be -31. A slip of the finger drives the volume up to insane levels. At normal listening levels this sounds as it did before which is to say perfectly fine for me.
Is there actually any sonic difference? None I could obviously detect, it still sounds great. Therefore was it worth doing? Yes I think so since now I know plus I get a bit more grunt noting this is likely the difference in gain from the preamp to the monos, compared to the "gain algorithm) in the V1 which I felt was conservative given the specs of the amp and the results when driving my speakers. Note that nCore is whats said to be powering Levinsons Maria amplifiers from his new company Daniel Hertz so if its good enough for him then its probably OK. And if I can't hear any difference between the onboard nCore amps and outboard Fosi amps, I guess that means they are good enough at least for me.
keith_h
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Actually that's a pretty good hack now I think about it. First I've heard of it but I'll sure give it a go.
Adding the monos was not intended to compensate, merely an experiment. Thought process went like this. Late one night some time ago... hmmm, NAD C298? But wait, Eigentacht can be acquired much cheaper. VTV? I contacted Warren but meanwhile I'm spammed with V3 mono reviews that look mostly positive and for how much??
And here we are. It's tickled my curiosity for about $300. And it came with a pair of Muse02 op amps although I doubt I'll go there.
But now I need to create a new DIRAC curve... excuse me.
Did anyone ever tried to connect a USB Device with more than 15.000 music files? I realized when doing that that the M10 V2 gets extremely slow nearly being unusable. As example, when I touch display the action is executed after around 30s. Same is with using the app.
Only remote control works immediately.
Only remote control works immediately.
keith_h
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Short answer to your question is "no", never used a USB device. But in the spirit of helpfulness might I ask if its setup as a library and if so what happens when you reindex and then optimize artwork?
I'm using a NAS with a lot of music and its instantaneous. I've digitised my whole CD collection of decades for a start and I imagine there are many tens of thousands of files.
It is with optimizing and without, no difference. Might be a bug, or HW cant handle.
Even with network share from NAS it was identical. I have a wild mix of formats there, maybe thats an issue?
Whatever, I found now a workaround. I created 3 folders with each 5k files. Then I added these 3 network folders seperately and now it works again like a charm.
I just need to chose one of the folders first ...
Even with network share from NAS it was identical. I have a wild mix of formats there, maybe thats an issue?
Whatever, I found now a workaround. I created 3 folders with each 5k files. Then I added these 3 network folders seperately and now it works again like a charm.
I just need to chose one of the folders first ...
keith_h
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But now I need to create a new DIRAC curve... excuse me.
Tomorrow’s job, cable management and a new Dirac curve. Meanwhile I’m curious to see how these amps stack up sonically with Eigentacht amps.
I know nothing else was to be expected from NAD support but I still tried my luck and emailed them about DLBC coming or not to the NAD M10 V2 and here is the canned answer:
Unfortunately, at this time, this feature is not supported. However, rest assured that we will forward this request to our Quality Assurance Team and the BluOS Development Lab for their consideration as a future update. We are constantly working to improve the experience based on customer feedback and sincerely appreciate it.
Unfortunately, at this time, this feature is not supported. However, rest assured that we will forward this request to our Quality Assurance Team and the BluOS Development Lab for their consideration as a future update. We are constantly working to improve the experience based on customer feedback and sincerely appreciate it.
keith_h
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Lol sure they will. Their support is notoriously terrible.
keith_h
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I've now run Dirac over the new setup, M10 V1 + NAD sub with Fosi V3 mono outboard amps. Sub is crossed over at 120hz which with the speakers (PSB Imagine mini wall mounted) has been the golden combination for some time now. These speakers have titanium tweeters and resolve a lot of detail. I've been dropping the upper frequencies to calm it down somewhat because there is way more detail than before.
An aside using DL 3.4.4 as the latest version has a bug where it won't install the filter.
First impressions though, the FOSI amps provide more resolution, greater clarity than the onboard nCore amps and there is more power than any reasonable person may need, in this room anyway. SPL of 95db is easily achievable with plenty to go which is ridiculous. I've just plugged them in with an RCA cable from Amazon. I've not bothered with tinkering with the sensitivity, I'm unlikely to get an XLR cable and I'm very unlikely to install the muse op amps. Its been pretty good from the get go with no messing about.
With a good recording its remarkable. With any sort of recording that's been compressed, it punishes it terribly. Anyway now optimising the curve for low level listening.
Sounds great, very pleased with how its working out.
Tracks I've been using to tune. In particular give Richard Clapton's after midnight a hit out.
An aside using DL 3.4.4 as the latest version has a bug where it won't install the filter.
First impressions though, the FOSI amps provide more resolution, greater clarity than the onboard nCore amps and there is more power than any reasonable person may need, in this room anyway. SPL of 95db is easily achievable with plenty to go which is ridiculous. I've just plugged them in with an RCA cable from Amazon. I've not bothered with tinkering with the sensitivity, I'm unlikely to get an XLR cable and I'm very unlikely to install the muse op amps. Its been pretty good from the get go with no messing about.
With a good recording its remarkable. With any sort of recording that's been compressed, it punishes it terribly. Anyway now optimising the curve for low level listening.
Sounds great, very pleased with how its working out.
Tracks I've been using to tune. In particular give Richard Clapton's after midnight a hit out.
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keith_h
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After further fine tuning it now looks like this. The stock NAD curve has been applied with the bass uplifted a little so that everything is there in the right proportions and in particular the bass is not overpowering. Amps are set to 31db gain (out of the box, never touched them), sub is set to its default gain position and the onboard M10 crossover is set to 120Hz. In this configuration it works well for low level listening as well as lets say normal listening in the 70-75db range. Its a small room, I rarely go beyond that. Although it will easily achieve 90-95db that level of performance is academic only.
DL 3.9.7 was used, the later version still won't upload a profile. This device is using two Fosi V3 mono's and an NAD sub series 200 sub in conjunction with wall mounted PSB Imagine Mini speakers close to the ceiling. It sounds great in a fairly small room. With each iteration of upgrades over the years (Yamaha amps, NAD M10 and now M10+Fosi) the speakers reveal more and more detail. While sound quality was always very good with the M10 on its own now with the V3 amps + Dirac, its even better again.
For anyone wondering about the low frequency curtain at 180Hz, adjusting it closer to 120Hz made no audible difference so I've left it as DL suggested.
DL 3.9.7 was used, the later version still won't upload a profile. This device is using two Fosi V3 mono's and an NAD sub series 200 sub in conjunction with wall mounted PSB Imagine Mini speakers close to the ceiling. It sounds great in a fairly small room. With each iteration of upgrades over the years (Yamaha amps, NAD M10 and now M10+Fosi) the speakers reveal more and more detail. While sound quality was always very good with the M10 on its own now with the V3 amps + Dirac, its even better again.
For anyone wondering about the low frequency curtain at 180Hz, adjusting it closer to 120Hz made no audible difference so I've left it as DL suggested.
I still don't quite understand your experience with NAD inbuilt amp. I have medium efficiency speakers and sub and I can drive it louder than my ears can handle with metal and pop. With classical and soundtrack there isn't much reserve left after Dirac but it is just enough for live levels.
Also, Fosis can't have (and I really mean can't, not an opinion) more detail than nCore. Having to adjust eq after changing an amp is not something that should be a thing.
I mean I'm happy it works for you but something is a bit odd here.
Also, Fosis can't have (and I really mean can't, not an opinion) more detail than nCore. Having to adjust eq after changing an amp is not something that should be a thing.
I mean I'm happy it works for you but something is a bit odd here.
M10 didn't work for me in a big room with high efficiency speakers either. Just have to wring it's neck for volume. I have done a lot better in the same room with a topping D90, pre 90 and PA5 amplifier. My Fosi V3 mono's are due in next week. I have a Fosi ZA3 thats paired with the topping stack and the same speakers in the same room that's even more aggressive than the PA5 but I can hear the high frequency rise that the V3 mono is supposed to eliminate. Still have the M10 I may give it a run again with the fosi mono amps.
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