Myth or reality? Volume control in Windows

[NorthSky]

With Microsoft we can purchase apps with better Volume Controls.
That is the beauty of Microsoft ... we don't have to get stuck with inferior features such as a simple volume control...floating point or not, dither applied or not.

With Apple, Macs, and air pads; are you guys reading and hearing similar issues with their implemented volume controls?

Hey, it's only an objective perspective.

 

[amirm]

Unless something has changed recently, Apple's MacOS and itunes have similar issues. And similar solution (in the form of third-party apps and plug-ins for itunes).

 

[Blumlein 88]

Below is an excerpt from the jriver wiki about volume control in their media center.


The precision offered by Media Center's 64bit audio engine is billions of times greater than the best hardware can utilize. In other words, it is bit-perfect on all known hardware.

To demonstrate the incredible precision of 64bit audio, imagine applying 100 million random volume changes (huge changes from -100 to 100 dB), and then applying those same 100 million volume changes again in the opposite direction.

Amazingly, you will have the exact same signal at 32bit after 200 million huge volume changes as when you started.

In other words, this incredible number of changes results in a bit-perfect output at 32bit, which is the highest hardware output bitdepth (most high-end hardware is 24bit).

This also means one volume change or a series of 100 million volume changes that add up to the same net result is bit-identical.

Seems to me like well done software volume control is just fine. The only advantage I see from physical volume controls is lowering level that way lowers noise levels from upstream of the volume control. Depending upon whether you have a well gain staged system this may or may not matter.

OTOH, Apple and MS and others don't seem too persnickety about good volume control or so it seems to an end user(me).

 

[NorthSky]

How's the volume control on this one:

 

[bennetng]

Shared mode is affected by CAudioLimiter APO as well.
https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ma...audiometerinformation-and-full-scale-signals/

 

[Soniclife]

Shared mode is affected by CAudioLimiter APO as well.
https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ma...audiometerinformation-and-full-scale-signals/

That's from a long time ago, might be fixed now.

 

[bennetng]

Don't know about others, but not on my win7 x64 machine. I attached a 32-bit float wavpack file with +11.5dBFS peak, try to play it at correct volume (-11.5dB or lower) using WASAPI exclusive/ASIO vs WASAPI shared/MME.

 

[punkriot]

If we are talking about WASAPI exclusive mode, what is the difference between event and push mode? Which one is better in regards to overall system performance and to sound quality (or maybe there is no difference, it is just but perfect signal).
I am asking because for the first time I had some compatibility issues between Surface Pro 4, Meridian Explorer 2 and foobar2000. With default settings in the event mode hi resolution audio was distorted and played 2 or 4 times faster. I had to modify hardware buffer settings and set it to below 20 ms to fix the issue. On other machines I was not able to replicate this.

 

[Soniclife]

From https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,111120.0.html

"Event and push differ in who is responsible to decide that more data is needed on the buffers.
Event based implementation has a callback method that is called by the driver/API when it has determined that more data is needed (usually, this is triggered when a previously prepared buffer is about to be played).
Push based implementation has a loop in its own thread which asks repetitively to the driver if it is ready to receive a new buffer (which is also related to the previous buffer going to be played)."​

Event has better design elegance if the drivers work properly at both ends, they should both sound the same, if there are no bugs.

 

[punkriot]

Thanks @Soniclife , so if all works as expected go for event mode. If there are problems, push mode as a fallback. Clear.

 

[amirm]

Thanks @Soniclife , so if all works as expected go for event mode. If there are problems, push mode as a fallback. Clear.

Indeed. I have had to do the same thing you did with some devices having to put them in push mode to work reliably.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Indeed. I have had to do the same thing you did with some devices having to put them in push mode to work reliably.

I have run into the same thing a few times myself.

 

[Duckeenie]

When using Musicbee in WASAPI exclusive mode on Windows 10 1903 and topping drivers the volume control in Windows is still operable. This seems counter intuitive?

 

[datrumole]

I am actually shocked about the whole focus on "creativity" just the same for visuals. Alas, there is next to nothing in the OS to indicate they have done anything significant there either.

I will test the volume control too and see where it stands today as I have the latest update on my computer.

did this report ever come out? curious as i use windows as my main volume control to my (now known to be crappy since i found your review) udac8

 

[Tup3x]

Using Windows' voluem control doesn't necessarily mean that Windows handles it. I'm not 100% sure what happens when runnign Sound BlasterX AE-5 in shared mode but at least in exclusive mode (and ASIO) the Windows volume control is mapped to DAC so it will work in every situation. Windows is not doing it since it's handled by the hardware. It's hardware & driver dependant what happens when you adjust Windows' volume.

 

[ReaderZ]

When using Musicbee in WASAPI exclusive mode on Windows 10 1903 and topping drivers the volume control in Windows is still operable. This seems counter intuitive?

Same here with Tidal exclusive mode, Tidal in exclusive mode even with volume enabled still use windows vol instead of app vol for normalization.

I am not too concerned, as I want volume normalization feature which means it won't be bit perfect output to DAC, just wonder why Tidal trust windows volume control more than its own build in vol control.

 

[PingWine]

In that case unfortunately there is no way to bypass Windows audio processing. You would need a different player like Roon, Foobar2000, etc. to access WASAPI/ASIO.

I know I'm only 3 years late on this thread but couldn't you just use ASIOBridge to use ASIO for everything you do with your PC?

Edit: Apparently somebody else answered too haha