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My speakers sound better than my headphones...

cinemakinoeye

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My biggest issue with headphones is the lack of HRTF. I've been intrigued with head tracking and HRTF simulation from the likes of Smyth Realizer but I've never actually tried it.
I also have this issue. I love listening with speakers, but I can't aways listen with them. One way I've dealt with my headphone issues is to use CanOpener Studio by Goodhertz, a crossfeed plug-in for MacOS and Windows (available on a free trial basis) when I'm listening to headphones with my desktop Mac as the source. CanOpener does a nice job with most recording and you can save a variety of presets to address different issues. Some room simulation plug-ins I've tried add unpleasant reverberation, but CanOpener does not. They offer good documentation on their site.

I use Audio Hijack from Rogue Amoeba on MacOS to place the plug-in in between Apple Music Output and USB DAC data stream.

See also the Headphone Correction & Spatialization thread.
 

Peterinvan

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My reference headphones are LCD-XC (2019). Superb bass, sound stage and imaging.
However in my den I use my KEF LS50W and SVS1000 sub when I have the house to myself. I use Roon EQ to suit my ears.

The feel of the lower bass in your body is what you can't get with headphones.
Billie Eilish tracks wrap you in a cocoon of bass, with Finneas' masterful mixing pinpointing all the multiple overlaid tracks.
Imaging on the speakers is very accurate. Betters the Audezes.
 

cinemakinoeye

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My reference headphones are LCD-XC (2019). Superb bass, sound stage and imaging.
However in my den I use my KEF LS50W and SVS1000 sub when I have the house to myself. I use Roon EQ to suit my ears.

The feel of the lower bass in your body is what you can't get with headphones.
Billie Eilish tracks wrap you in a cocoon of bass, with Finneas' masterful mixing pinpointing all the multiple overlaid tracks.
Imaging on the speakers is very accurate. Betters the Audezes.
Have you tried headphones supplemented with your subwoofer?
 

Peterinvan

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Have you tried headphones supplemented with your subwoofer?
Interesting... I would have to find a way to drive the sub with the speakers turned off. KEF volume drives the sub-out
I'm going to see if I can use line out from my DAP while listening to the LCD-XC
 

Peterinvan

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Interesting... I would have to find a way to drive the sub with the speakers turned off. KEF volume drives the sub-out
I'm going to see if I can use line out from my DAP while listening to the LCD-XC
No luck with DAP line out to sub at the same time as 4.4mm balanced out to headphones.
 

Tim Link

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I also have this issue. I love listening with speakers, but I can't aways listen with them. One way I've dealt with my headphone issues is to use CanOpener Studio by Goodhertz, a crossfeed plug-in for MacOS and Windows (available on a free trial basis) when I'm listening to headphones with my desktop Mac as the source. CanOpener does a nice job with most recording and you can save a variety of presets to address different issues. Some room simulation plug-ins I've tried add unpleasant reverberation, but CanOpener does not. They offer good documentation on their site.

I use Audio Hijack from Rogue Amoeba on MacOS to place the plug-in in between Apple Music Output and USB DAC data stream.

See also the Headphone Correction & Spatialization thread.
Thanks for the info and the link to that thread. I already have a Mac with Audio Hijack installed so I'm half way there. I'm using EQ for my Grado headphones and it makes a big difference. I'll have to look more closely at the diffuse field curve.
 

cinemakinoeye

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No luck with DAP line out to sub at the same time as 4.4mm balanced out to headphones.
Hopefully you find a way to try it sometime. It's a realm of experience different from speakers or headphones, far more immersive, since headphones can't provide the physical sensation of a properly tuned subwoofer on the body. On the other hand, it defeates one of the reasons for wearing headphones, keeping things quiet for others in the same household.
 

Peterinvan

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Hopefully you find a way to try it sometime. It's a realm of experience different from speakers or headphones, far more immersive, since headphones can't provide the physical sensation of a properly tuned subwoofer on the body. On the other hand, it defeates one of the reasons for wearing headphones, keeping things quiet for others in the same household.
Got it! Line out to sub from HiFi M8 amp with LCD-XC out from balanced XLR4. Nice! Thanks for the suggestion
 

weesch

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Wow, that guy on the video and the song need some serious Xanax. I'm speechless.
hi ! don't worry it's done on purpose (Ian Curtis + Billy Idol)
but you know ...eating micro plastic makes you crazy like a "plastic man" ah ah ah !
but the sound is good ! isn't it ?
best regards
weesch
 
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Peterinvan

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Got it! Line out to sub from HiFi M8 amp with LCD-XC out from balanced XLR4. Nice! Thanks for the suggestion
After some listening, I still prefer the LS50W speakers + SVS100 sub to the LCD-XC + sub. Bigger sound stage. more ambiance, and overall listening pleasure.
 

BoredErica

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My understanding is most people generally prefer speakers over headphones sonically, assuming both are quite good. Ignoring cost, aesthetics, convinience, etc.
 

bo_knows

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For a curious cat, what is the best way to find out how and why?

Here are some of the specifics...
  • Headphones: NAS (Roon Core) -> iMac (Roon Bridge) -> iFi NEO iDSD (DAC and Amp) -> Sennheiser HD660S
  • Speakers: NAS (Roon Core) -> Pi 4 (RoPieee) -> Gustard X16 (DAC) -> Teac AX-505 (Amp) -> PSB Alpha T20
  • Listening Material: Frédéric (Mazurkas, Nocturnes, Waltzes) - DSD64
To me, the strings of the harp sound more natural on the speakers. I have always thought those PSBs are the weakest link in my system.

I doubt a DAC can make much difference. Could it be that strings just sound better on speakers?

I cannot do a volume-matched test because the output devices are so different. Obviously, I cannot do a blind test because I can easily feel if I am wearing something on my head.

Actually, I usually have the volume set such that my headphones sound louder. In fact, I can hear more recording imperfections on my headphones. Very strange.
I have the same headphones and I can tell that my KEF speakers are much brighter. That being said, I highly doubt that male or female voices sound better on your speakers than on the headphones. IMHO, this is where Sennheiser shine. Also, the detail retrieval in the bass and studio ambiance will be more noticeable via headphones (no room interaction). As a matter of fact, I use headphones to evaluate how my speakers are interacting with the room and the effectiveness of my room treatments.
 

mdunjic

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Good speakers should sound better than headphones, in every way. Wish I heard that differently, life would be so much easier.
My preference has always neen speakers, rather than headphones (have Grado 325, Sennheiser HD650, AKG K72s and Hifiman Sundaras right now) … but my main hifi setup always wins … use headphones only when I am warned not to bother the rest of my family :)
 
D

Deleted member 23982

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i also think soundstage is what makes speakers "better" you just cant get rid of the "in your head" feeling of headphones ( tho i heared of very expensive ones that tackle this one )

and like said before the bass feeling in your body, as the whole room is "shaking" are probably the 2 obvious ones, specially since 20-40hz can be reproduced by headpones BUT its just very hard to just "hear" those frequencys, you can certainly feel them tho, and in my opinion this gives the music a whole new "dimension" compared to headphones
 

Spkrdctr

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My preference has always neen speakers, rather than headphones (have Grado 325, Sennheiser HD650, AKG K72s and Hifiman Sundaras right now) … but my main hifi setup always wins … use headphones only when I am warned not to bother the rest of my family :)
You are a very wise person. Headphones can sound nice, but in the demanding movie watching role they leave a lot to be desired. They even sell belly vibrators for people to try and get the speaker/sub bass effect with headphones. I'm NOT wearing a belly vibrator! Well, to be honest they would not make one to fit me. I'm a 3% top tier weight class guy. I went to Sea World once and they tried to get me in the tank with Shamu the killer whale. Something about me being his long lost relative........:rolleyes: I put up quite a fight though.
 
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_Dekker

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For many years my opinion was that headphones were the way to go: always the same frequency characteristic no matter where you are. This was confirmed even more when I upgraded to the HD800s from Sennheiser. I found them to be absolutely awesome, especially for the openness of the sound they are also known for.
BUT: I never had a really good speaker setup. I didn't know that actually, I thought my B&W speakers were great but in my living room I tend to sit in different places and this does not help.
In my working room where I sit in one place (better for EQ) I had these M-Audio CX monitors and they sounded more or less the same as the HD800s but with the HD800s being more revealing regarding details in the music and low also end.
So enter the whole lock down situation: now I find myself working at home in my work room for over a year with no hint of a change coming. So I decided to treat myself to a pair of Genelec 8040B's after reading a lot through the tests Amir performed.
And boy this changed it all: I am sometimes forced to use the HD800s due to sleeping kids and now this feels almost like punishment. For the rest I simply don't want to use them anymore.
In comparison the Genelecs sound amazingly open with a stage in front of you that includes depth and width I have never heard before. It invites me to listen to every song I have heard before in my life to discover new things. I can say they are even more revealing than the HD800s regarding details. And the bass (flat to 35Hz in my tiny room) is just awesome.
Often I find I myself closing my eyes to just listen.
Btw all setups (incl headphones) I have are EQ-ed and I also have some room treatment in my working room.
Due to this experience I discovered that next to frequency response and EQ-ing, a good loudspeaker directivity should be just as important to get proper results.
 

itz_all_about_the_music

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Have you tried headphones supplemented with your subwoofer?
I'm surprised this subject never got much traction/interest.

Good headphones do take me to the live recording space, but often (program dependent) it's not convincing without the sensation of air moving in the room. Most of us have experienced a live performance of the 1812 Overture complete with cannon fire. But to have all (controlled amounts) of that energy absorbed ONLY by our eardrums? That would be an incomplete experience.

I sometimes wonder if "the headphones generation" (i.e., younger gen who live on foot, on public transport, in their shared living spaces without a capable hi-fi system, limited to cans playback) know what they're missing.
 

_thelaughingman

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I sometimes wonder if "the headphones generation" (i.e., younger gen who live on foot, on public transport, in their shared living spaces without a capable hi-fi system, limited to cans playback) know what they're missing.
Wow, that generalization of a whole swath of people comes off very ignorant. I don't think many people of this generation can even afford to live without the sky high rents and other hyper inflated costs to dabble in Hifi the way you have.
 

sq225917

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i hate thieaudio oracle, sony met ex800st, fiio fh9 and stax headphones, even with peq none of them match my ns1000m for timbre, accuracy and dynamics, not even close
 
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