MOTU UltraLite-mk5 Review (Audio Interface)

[Trell]

Which one?

He didn’t write which MOTU it was, but here is his thread. He got a second hand RME Fireface 400 released in 2006 but had to buy a FireWire card to use it.

Are there any 8 channel audio interfaces that work as a 7.1 device natively in windows?

Hello guys, This has been bugging me for a while, and I've already returned devices from UA and Motu because their tech support lied to me. I'm looking for an audio interface that has at least 6, but ideally 8 or more analogue outputs, that will appear in windows as a true multichannel device...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[anphex]

I asked again today.
NONE of their devices support surround windows playback devices.
I am dumbfounded.
Can someone explain to me why it's so hard to implement this when you already have insanely elaborate drivers?

 

[Trell]

I asked again today.
NONE of their devices support surround windows playback devices.
I am dumbfounded.
Can someone explain to me why it's so hard to implement this when you already have insanely elaborate drivers?

For some reason MOTU decided not to, and my guess is for cost reasons. RME writes their own drivers and support surround windows playback, though.

 

[mdsimon2]

I asked again today.
NONE of their devices support surround windows playback devices.
I am dumbfounded.
Can someone explain to me why it's so hard to implement this when you already have insanely elaborate drivers?

A possible solution would be to use a raspberry pi in USB gadget mode to bridge between your PC and the Mk5. Although I assume you also want to use the Mk5 for the mic inputs and I am not sure how that would work in practice, I think the gadget can also transfer audio from the Pi to the PC but not sure. Probably easiest to get an older Mac mini to be honest.

Michael

 

[Nspace]

I asked again today.
NONE of their devices support surround windows playback devices.
I am dumbfounded.
Can someone explain to me why it's so hard to implement this when you already have insanely elaborate drivers?

Is this what you call "surround windows playback devices".

How to turn on spatial sound in Windows - Microsoft Support

Turn on spatial sound in Windows.

support.microsoft.com

Then why not use ASIO instead? Honest question, I'd like to learn.

 

[anphex]

Is this what you call "surround windows playback devices".

How to turn on spatial sound in Windows - Microsoft Support

Turn on spatial sound in Windows.

support.microsoft.com

Then why not use ASIO instead? Honest question, I'd like to learn.

ASIO would bypass Equalizer APO which I use for FIR room calibration.
Edit: Oh, an no, spatial audio is a totally different (and pointless imho) thing. What I mean is a windows "device" that recognizes all available channels in ONE selectable device where you can adjust the amount of channels you want. For example, the Antelope Orion has up to 24 channels over USB 3.0 which is insane. But it is also expensive af.

 

[Nspace]

ASIO would bypass Equalizer APO which I use for FIR room calibration.
Edit: Oh, an no, spatial audio is a totally different (and pointless imho) thing. What I mean is a windows "device" that recognizes all available channels in ONE selectable device where you can adjust the amount of channels you want.

OK, so basically you are trying your hardware to fit this https://equalizerapo.com/ "Equalizer APO is an open-source graphical equalizer for Microsoft Windows. Equalizer APO was developed by Jonas Thedering and is freely available to download" app...

Whereas you could go the ASIO route with https://ddmf.eu/virtual-audio-stream/ + https://virtualaudiostream.com/ (there are more software like this) and you could even add a professional FIR EQ plugin, speakers or multichannel management software from several renowned firms.
Those won't be free to download, the DDMF integrated solution costs $99, but you may improve and adapt it for future needs.

Facing the need or 8 high quality OUTs, many of us in this thread have chosen to go MOTU Ultralite mk5, in my case with excellent results. I'd suggest you expand your search of the software side as complement to the radically better audio hardware we are already able to get at these prices nowadays

 

[Nspace]

About speaker management software, there is this one by DigitalBrain-Instruments
Now for $76 ($109 regularly) Win & Mac
Up to 32 bit 96 kHz.
Perfect Motu Mk5 companion.

With:

• 4 STEREO INPUTS (matrix-able)
• 4 STEREO OUTPUTS (matrix-able)
• BUILT-IN BRICKWALL LIMITER
• 4th ORDER LINKWITZ-RILEY CROSSOVER
• 3rd ORDER BUTTERWORTH CROSSOVER
• 2 WAY & 3 WAY CROSSOVER MODES
• MATRIX MODE
• 5-BAND PARAMETRIC EQ, LPF, HPF ON EACH INPUT CHANNEL
• OUTPUT DELAY COMPENSATION
• 2 LOAD UP TO 4 VST/AU PLUGINS ON EACH OUTPUT
• BUILT-IN RECORDING
• MIDI. CONTROL DSP MANAGER USING YOUR MIDI DEVICE
• SAVE & RECALL PRESETS
• KEYBOARD SHORTCUTS

Check the User Guide

 

[Music1969]

Does anyone have SINAD vs frequency plot, for the ADC (not DAC) ?

 

[Music1969]

This should be a decent ADC for measurements yes?

Mic input with 1M ohm input impedance and 0.8Vrms minimum gain and THD+N of -111dB is decent

Or -113dB for the line inputs

No Cosmos ADC or RME ADI-2/4 level but still great value for price ?

 

[Music1969]

@VintageFlanker @staticV3

I have a DIY DAC with 4000 ohm output impedance (transformers).

Is 20k ohm ADC input impedance (line inputs) ok with this, for measurements?

Ratio of 5 is ok? Any meaningful difference vs the often discussed ratio of 8 or 10?

The mic input has 1M ohm input impedance, line in 20k ohm input impedance

 

[staticV3]

Is 20k ohm ADC input impedance (line inputs) ok with this, for measurements?

Depends on what you want to measure and how your DIY DAC handles such loads. Since it's DIY, only you can answer that.

 

[Music1969]

Depends on what you want to measure and how your DIY DAC handles such loads. Since it's DIY, only you can answer that.

Well I didnt design or build it. Someone else did.

What measurements would be affected by a ratio of 5, as opposed to ratio of 8 or 10 ?

And why?

 

[staticV3]

What measurements would be affected by a ratio of 5, as opposed to ratio of 8 or 10 ?

Definitely output voltage, possibly THD, THD+N, IMD.

And why?

Output voltage due to Ohm's law, the rest possibly due to current limiting.

 

[Music1969]

Definitely output voltage, possibly THD, THD+N, IMD.


Output voltage due to Ohm's law, the rest possibly due to current limiting.

I guess this Motu will provide answers

The mic input has 1M ohm input impedance, line in 20k ohm input impedance

Small difference between THD+N for both inputs

 

[solderdude]

Well I didnt design or build it. Someone else did.

What measurements would be affected by a ratio of 5, as opposed to ratio of 8 or 10 ?

And why?

Most likely HF peaking.
Usually, with output transformers (line level) the actual load resistance determines the flatness of the frequency response.
It would be my guess that the output R is not 4k but the recommended load resistance is 4k.

 

[Music1969]

It would be my guess that the output R is not 4k but the recommended load resistance is 4k.

I actually measured the voltage drop across 4.35kohm resistor

Using formulas you shared with me long time ago (thanks!)

Vopen = 1.120 Vac at 100 Hz

Resistor = 4350 ohm

Vload = 0.576 Vac at 100 Hz

Vratio = Vload / Vopen = 0.514285714

Rratio = (1 - 0.514285714 ) / ( 0.514285714 ) = 0.944444446

Rout = 0.944444446 * 4350 = 4108.333338032

 

[Music1969]

Most likely HF peaking.

So if I do FR response measurement and don't see any HF issues, then ratio of 5 is practically not an issue ?

I guess can look at HF in SINAD vs frequency plot using @pkane cool program

 

[solderdude]

So if I do FR response measurement and don't see any HF issues, then ratio of 5 is practically not an issue ?

Yes.
It is even possible a 4k load (source and load the same) could be even more linear.

Indeed a sweep would be the best way to find the ideal and 'good enough' load.

 

[Music1969]

How can I tell the minimum input sensitivity of the front TRS line input - in Vrms ?

Max level input = +20dBu = 7.7Vrms

Minimum?? Any hints from the specs below ?