Moondrop Chu II IEM Review

[Stokdoof]

This shows again the superiority of Chinese engineering making affordable products that comply to specs I want. I think European high(low) end audio companies should be very scared, asking extreme high prices for product that I do not trust anymore.

 

[b7676]

The Feaulle H570 tips really bump up the fun on this set.
Very easy to wear while moving.
You will need to remove the screw on filters and wash them with solvent to unclog every few hundred hours.
The DSP usbc cable is reliable in not producing clicks or pops.
Think low distortion DT990.

 

[mc.god]

I wonder if there is any other difference with the I (even cheaper) besides the detachable cable.

It's not just the cable, more like the difference between 7Hz Zero and 7Hz Zero 2

@amirm Nice review as always.

By any chance did you get the Moondrop Chu II DSP ? As I found the little DSP tweaks and the 3 slightly different 'tuning' available Moondrop App worked well with the Chu II DSP.

This USB-C w/DAC + DSP Parametric EQ/App version is interesting. For $24 U.S. you can try Amir's tweak built right into the iem. Technology is amazing.

 

[InfiniteJester]

IEMs are a solved problem and the solution requires just one simple dynamic driver. There is no reason to pay more than $20ish for an IEM, unless you want an actually useful special feature like the crazy isolation of my ER2XR (and I can't really think of any other case). Otherwise you're paying for jewelry, and I don't know about you but I don't watch myself in the mirror while I listen to music. Cheapness also means that if you try one that you can't get to fit you well, no great loss.

You are oversimplifying.

These cheap IEMs with a single DD don't sound as good as the MP145 with its planar drivers.

I don't know why. I don't know how to measure that sense of spaciousness and ease, but I'm confident that I would be able to distinguish it in any blind test.

The Zero:2s, the Chus, the Nuos, all of them sound too intimate and muddy with complex tracks. They don't offer a "solved" experience yet.

More expensive multidrivers do seem senseless compared to the MP145, though.

 

[AdamG]

Here are the Manufacturer Specifications:

 

[GGroch]

You are oversimplifying.

.......I don't know why. I don't know how to measure that sense of spaciousness and ease, but I'm confident that I would be able to distinguish it in any blind test.

The Zero:2s, the Chus, the Nuos, all of them sound too intimate and muddy with complex tracks. They don't offer a "solved" experience yet.

More expensive multidrivers do seem senseless compared to the MP145, though.

Describing sound using terms like spaciousness, ease, intimate, solved, & senseless make me more confident that brains and biases are an inalienable component of perception.

 

[InfiniteJester]

Describing sound using terms like spaciousness, ease, intimate, solved, & senseless make me more confident that brains and biases are an inalienable component of perception.

Do you think that soundstage is not real?

If it is placebo, why do I prefer these IEMs that cost around 100€ over the ones I own that cost six times more?

The MP145 sound like speakers in a room with a little bit of crossover and reverb.

The other ones sound unnatural, in my head, even if EQ'd to the same target and with the same DSPs on.

I don't know how to measure soundstage, but I'm confident that it will be measured.

Until then, metaphors and vague language is the only way in which I can allude to the sensation.

 

[Billy Budapest]

Describing sound using terms like spaciousness, ease, intimate, solved, & senseless make me more confident that brains and biases are an inalienable component of perception.

Agreed, except that use of the words “solved problem” usually applies to measurement. I would consider “in-ear transducer performance vs. price” to be a solved problem.

What I am looking forward to is the application of AI to DSP, where someone can explain in plain language how they want the sound to be adjusted (like saying “more spacious, but also warm, but not too much shaved off the top” and then the EQ/DSP program can apply a setting that will accomplish this. Or if the setting doesn’t fulfill what the user was looking for, the program can learn from the user by redoing the setting).

 

[GGroch]

Do you think that soundstage is not real?

Soundstage...the perception or illusion of space/location/depth is certainly real. I can understand how live performances and recordings can vary in soundstage.

Speakers depending on spread pattern and positioning also differ. I have difficulty understanding how IEMs can have soundstage. That is, if they have better/worse soundstage how exactly do they accomplish it. This post by JAE lays the issue out well. The clues our ears/brains use to localize sound are not available to IEMs. I am open to learning more.

Do you think cognitive bias is real?
We cannot be "confident that I can distinguish it in any blind test" until we do a blind test.

 

[Jeromeof]

This USB-C w/DAC + DSP Parametric EQ/App version is interesting. For $24 U.S. you can try Amir's tweak built right into the iem. Technology is amazing.

Totally agree, for those interested there were my comparison measurements of the Chu II with 2 of the presets available within the Moondrop App for the Chu II DSP (without even getting into the ability to customise the PEQ filters within the App):

I thought the 'basshead' profile tries to solve a few of this issues that @amirm EQ is also targeting.

 

[InfiniteJester]

Do you think cognitive bias is real?

Hardly. Most research on them seems to be made up, with new scandals arising every day.

https://carcinisation.com/2023/08/22/against-automaticity/

If they are real, they surely are far less strong in their effect than previously thought.

 

[Oso Polar]

The Zero:2s, the Chus, the Nuos, all of them sound too intimate

You can try TRUTHEAR x Crinacle Zero (Blue - I didn't try Red), to me they sound very spacious and open (certainly more than 7Hz Zero 2). On the other hand both easily beat Sennheiser HD600, this is like the most intimate headphone ever...

 

[Dzhaughn]

If it is placebo, why do I prefer these IEMs that cost around 100€ over the ones I own that cost six times more?

The fit.

 

[Dzhaughn]

Hardly. Most research on them seems to be made up, with new scandals arising every day.

https://carcinisation.com/2023/08/22/against-automaticity/

If they are real, they surely are far less strong in their effect than previously thought.

There are many bunk studies in psychology. But the advertising industry begs to differ with your position.

 

[shuppatsu]

There are many bunk studies in psychology. But the advertising industry begs to differ with your position.

So would the pharmaceutical company industry, though I suppose there could be a perverse incentive to have the major players endorse the high costs of drug approval to keep the upstarts out of the field. But given that every drug goes through double blind studies, we have mountains and mountains of empirical data showing that people report improvement even while given sugar pills. I know about the replication crisis but has it really extended down to the placebo effect?

 

[SteveL]

You are oversimplifying.

These cheap IEMs with a single DD don't sound as good as the MP145 with its planar drivers.

I don't know why. I don't know how to measure that sense of spaciousness and ease, but I'm confident that I would be able to distinguish it in any blind test.

The Zero:2s, the Chus, the Nuos, all of them sound too intimate and muddy with complex tracks. They don't offer a "solved" experience yet.

More expensive multidrivers do seem senseless compared to the MP145, though.

Says who? Based on what blind testing?

 

[SteveL]

Do you think that soundstage is not real?

If it is placebo, why do I prefer these IEMs that cost around 100€ over the ones I own that cost six times more?

The MP145 sound like speakers in a room with a little bit of crossover and reverb.

The other ones sound unnatural, in my head, even if EQ'd to the same target and with the same DSPs on.

I don't know how to measure soundstage, but I'm confident that it will be measured.

Until then, metaphors and vague language is the only way in which I can allude to the sensation.

Listening to an excellent recording on the Cleveland Orchestra's label with my Salnotes Zero sounds to me very much like what I hear in my subscription seat in Severance Hall. There's an orchestra some distance in front of my head. Reflected sound contributes to reverb but I do not perceive it in the hall as coming from other directions.

 

[InfiniteJester]

So would the pharmaceutical company industry, though I suppose there could be a perverse incentive to have the major players endorse the high costs of drug approval to keep the upstarts out of the field. But given that every drug goes through double blind studies, we have mountains and mountains of empirical data showing that people report improvement even while given sugar pills. I know about the replication crisis but has it really extended down to the placebo effect?

If you read the article or the latest literature on the topic, you will see that placebo effect has been mainly disproven as a real phenomenon beyond regression to the mean.

 

[Frank2]

I have difficulty understanding how IEMs can have soundstage. That is, if they have better/worse soundstage how exactly do they accomplish it. This post by JAE lays the issue out well. The clues our ears/brains use to localize sound are not available to IEMs. I am open to learning more.

My theory (personal speculation) is that the resolution of a driver plays a crucial role. Very subtle echo and reverb effects can lead to the impression of "soundstage" and not all drivers are equal in terms of their ability to flesh out these little details in the music.
Why? Because any driver stores and needs to get rid of mechanical energy and hence any driver will exhibit damping. These mechanical effects cause a kind of 'masking', akin to the masking that occurs in human hearing. The subtle echoes and reverbs that accompany the primary tones in music can be more, or less masked, depending on the driver, and this will lead to more, or less perception of soundstage.

 

[SteveL]

If you read the article or the latest literature on the topic, you will see that placebo effect has been mainly disproven as a real phenomenon beyond regression to the mean.

The placebo effect on subjective perception like that of pain, which is less reliable than was once believed but is far from being nonexistent, is only a small subset of the ways in which our subjective impressions can be mistaken or can be actively fooled. That's why science is a lot harder than making stuff up.