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Monoprice HTP-1 Home Theater Processor Review

markus

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The NAD T 778 looks perfect. 9-channels of amplification equals my Pioneer receiver so I can continue bi-amplifying my front speakers. Unfortunately the NAD T 758 V3's measurements were dismal.

Martin

You do realize measurements do NOT look dismal when MV is below -6dB? Not sure why Amir continued measuring at 0dB although he had seen that this will drive the unit into distortion.
 

Costas EAR

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NAD until -6db is really excellent in real life.
So much better than any marantz or Yamaha (no dirac) that there is no meaning for comparison.
Above -6dB's, the speakers typically produce so much more distortion, that there is no meaning...
You just have to match the sensitivity of the amps or active speakers, to reach the desired spl's at -6dB's on the nad. That's all.
 

Dj7675

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Agreed, measurements of the Outlaw wouldn't matter in this instance because the miniDSP would be the limiting factor. Removing the miniDSP DDRC-88A from my chain and moving to the HTP-1 resulted in audible improvement.

I think for multichannel processors where Dirac is top priority, and it should be as I don't consider Audyssey in the same league, the only options to consider right now are NAD AVRs or the HTP-1, or wait and see how the upcoming JBLs perform. I'm not aware of any options in between the NAD and the HTP-1; Arcam and Emotiva processors still seem to be buggy and/or missing Dirac, and the multichannel miniDSP always requires an extra A-D/D-A conversion.

Edit: Maybe the upcoming NAD T778 will be the best offering in between the current NADs and the HTP-1. Hopefully it will get measured.
I like Dirac too. I have two systems with it (living room and 2 channel system). I have had the Dirac (NAD T758) in our theater room too. Switched back to Audyssey XT32 there. I'm limiting correction to about 500hz via the Audyssey xt32 app. I have dual subs (Rythmik L12) and I find Audyssey actually does really well with under 500hz. If a person is limiting correction from 300-500hz, I wonder if Dirac is actually better. I'm just not sure. If doing full correction, 20hz-20khz, I would think it probably is. However, I think it is worth the effort to eventually take a closer look comparing xt32 vs dirac (limited correction and also full correction). Maybe someday a more in depth look at the by @amirm would be worth the effort (which would require a lot i would imagine).
 

digicidal

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Your perspective of home theater costs and what matters is of course a perfectly valid position to take but I've bolded where my view and I suspect many others differ. I don't recall reading anyone considering the HTP-1 primarily for a dedicated, balanced output, prepro. They are buying it primarily for 16-channels and Dirac, for home theater use. What they also want is fuss free, solid operation (especially with HDMI) as others have noted, not perpetual problem solving. They also get Auro-3D and Roon if they care about those. Given Emotiva's challenges, the combination of these factors makes HTP-1 the most affordable aka cheapest entry point so far for this. Whether customers should buy before promised features are available is certainly debatable, but the platform also plans to offer Dirac BM, an upgrade path to HDMI 2.1 and possibly DTS-X Pro.

$4k is a significant amount of money for many making a jump to this level. I am often amazed how much some buyers seem to over extend themselves financially when making consumer electronics purchases (emergency fund be damned ;)), so an extra 50% or $2k is a serious increase in price for them. That $2k could buy 15 channels of amplification (3x Outlaw 5000), or go a long way towards say an Epson 5050 projector or LG OLED, or 6x Ascend Audio speakers or 4x 12" subs from Ascend. Also many only incrementally change their equipment due to budget constraints, so each step has to be affordable for them.

Just my 2c.
Fair enough, but (for me at least) if you feel you need a full 16 channel setup... you've largely left the realm of "inexpensive home theater" already. I do hope for their sake that the HTP-1 truly is "fuss free, solid operation" - but with a decently significant departure from their standard fare... I'm not entirely convinced that Monoprice is the go-to brand in that regard (certainly no more so than Outlaw or Emotiva). Naturally I haven't owned a processor from them yet - this being the opening act - but the offerings from the other two promised the same and delivered far less. I tried the Outlaw 975 prior to the Marantz and found it lacking in both features and functionality (esp. in HDMI handshaking). Reliability was the real Achilles heel however... and was what prompted me to get the Marantz.

I guess there are some for whom 16 channels is a requirement, but $2K is still a primary concern. I'm definitely not one of them however (in either case). I don't require 16 channels, nor am I likely ever to... but I would definitely like all balanced outputs with flexible assignment, Dirac, and the knowledge that if I ever do want to run more than a 7.4 setup in my theater... I don't have to replace the processor again to do it. Getting that with no-compromise DAC and preamp performance is just the icing on the cake in a sense. If I can have it all without having to drop $14K-20K on the Bryston or Trinnov or Focal... then I'm definitely interested. Would I rather save another $2K? Of course! On the other hand if superior sound and build quality is merely another $2K away... then I'd much rather pay that.

It's admittedly all speculation until/if JBL actually gets the SDP-55 out the door for ~$6K - but if I have to bet on a brand regarding build quality, sound quality, and reliability... I'm probably going to be on JBL vs. Monoprice. JMHO
 

RichB

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I like Dirac too. I have two systems with it (living room and 2 channel system). I have had the Dirac (NAD T758) in our theater room too. Switched back to Audyssey XT32 there. I'm limiting correction to about 500hz via the Audyssey xt32 app. I have dual subs (Rythmik L12) and I find Audyssey actually does really well with under 500hz. If a person is limiting correction from 300-500hz, I wonder if Dirac is actually better. I'm just not sure. If doing full correction, 20hz-20khz, I would think it probably is. However, I think it is worth the effort to eventually take a closer look comparing xt32 vs dirac (limited correction and also full correction). Maybe someday a more in depth look at the by @amirm would be worth the effort (which would require a lot i would imagine).

If REW could be automated to measure and upload PEQ filters, it would solve most issues.

- Rich
 

Dj7675

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I like this idea. Does your RMC1 import REW filters?
 

RichB

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I like this idea. Does your RMC1 import REW filters?
It is said to have that capability but I have not tried it.

- Rich
 

raistlin65

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I like Dirac too. I have two systems with it (living room and 2 channel system). I have had the Dirac (NAD T758) in our theater room too. Switched back to Audyssey XT32 there. I'm limiting correction to about 500hz via the Audyssey xt32 app. I have dual subs (Rythmik L12) and I find Audyssey actually does really well with under 500hz. If a person is limiting correction from 300-500hz, I wonder if Dirac is actually better. I'm just not sure. If doing full correction, 20hz-20khz, I would think it probably is. However, I think it is worth the effort to eventually take a closer look comparing xt32 vs dirac (limited correction and also full correction). Maybe someday a more in depth look at the by @amirm would be worth the effort (which would require a lot i would imagine).

This is good to hear. I have been wanting to upgrade my Denon X4200W because I want the Audyssey Editor app for XT32. But I've also been toying with the idea of getting Dirac Live. I don't think I need correction above 500hz, so I'm not convinced it's worth spending the money for me for a receiver with Dirac Live.
 

Martin

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I typically listen to movies at between 0 and -9dB on my Pioneer that’ll put out 90 watts all channels driven. I’m concerned an NAD running 80 watts per channel at -6dB May not be loud enough. My front three speakers are 98dB sensitive Klipsch’s.

Martin
 

SynthesisCinema

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I typically listen to movies at between 0 and -9dB on my Pioneer that’ll put out 90 watts all channels driven. I’m concerned an NAD running 80 watts per channel at -6dB May not be loud enough. My front three speakers are 98dB sensitive Klipsch’s.

Martin

The Klipsch sensitivity is not comparable to other speakers, see Audioholics review of RP-8000F for the real measured sensitivity and explanation.

T758 V3 bench test:

Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 100.6 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 86.0 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 66.3 watts

Into 4 ohms, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 139.9 watts

In few forums T758 V3 has been shut down after running speakers that dip 4ohm or lower to very loud levels, one were B&Ws and other i can´t remember.
 
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digicidal

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RC systems do exactly that; how would REW do it differently/better?
By not charging you anything in the way of licensing?
By allowing complete customization of the filter prior to applying it?
By allowing a variety of measurement methods, positions and/or microphones rather than just the proprietary ones?

Beyond those... I'm not sure.
 

database

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I like Dirac too. I have two systems with it (living room and 2 channel system). I have had the Dirac (NAD T758) in our theater room too. Switched back to Audyssey XT32 there. I'm limiting correction to about 500hz via the Audyssey xt32 app. I have dual subs (Rythmik L12) and I find Audyssey actually does really well with under 500hz. If a person is limiting correction from 300-500hz, I wonder if Dirac is actually better. I'm just not sure. If doing full correction, 20hz-20khz, I would think it probably is. However, I think it is worth the effort to eventually take a closer look comparing xt32 vs dirac (limited correction and also full correction). Maybe someday a more in depth look at the by @amirm would be worth the effort (which would require a lot i would imagine).

It's interesting that you mention that you weren't sure if you could tell the difference under 500 Hz. I found that the bass region was actually where Dirac's benefits over Audyssey were most apparent in my experience. Dirac cleans up bass and makes it sound tight and have impact, while Audyssey sounded bloated and boomy to me in comparison. I suspect that this difference is due to Dirac's emphasis on timing and impulse response correction as opposed to Audyssey only correcting frequency response.

For that matter, exporting REW filters to match a target curve and correct frequency response using a miniDSP is something I've done before, and I've gotten the bass with it to sound as good as Audyssey, but not Dirac. Again, I think it's important to be careful not to get too fixated on only frequency response -- that's something I learned while working with Dirac for several years. If frequency response was the most important thing, you could take a single microphone measurement with Dirac, rather than taking several microphone measurements over a wide area of positions (as Dirac recommends), and the result of the single mic measurement Dirac calibration will definitely have smoother frequency response than the full calibration. But no one would say that a single mic measurement Dirac calibration sounds better than a properly done calibration taken with several mic positions over a wide area. Dirac performs best when you give it as much data as possible to give it sufficient information about your room, even though the resulting frequency response may not end up perfect.

It's important to note that these apparent differences in bass between Dirac and Audyssey were most noticeable to me in music, where a bass guitar may be constantly present throughout a song and have textures and layers of details to its sound. In movies, if there is an explosion occurring and my subwoofers are shaking my whole house, I am never thinking, I wish this explosion sounded more nuanced. Even a subwoofer that sounds boomy for music can sound just fine for LFE content in movies, as long as the subwoofer is not being pushed to its limits.

Still, optimizing for music always makes movies sound better too, since movies always contain soundtracks. But if movies are the focus rather than music then I think the sound quality of voices are a top priority, and this is another area where I have never achieved the level of clarity of voices I've gotten with Dirac while using Audyssey. This is also an area that showcases the benefits of running Dirac full-range. I'm aware of the position some have that EQ should be avoided above the room's Schroeder frequency, but human voice frequencies extend as high as 10 kHz (from 's's and 't's, for example). My speakers, Ascend Sierra RAAL Towers, were designed to sound neutral, but they sound slightly bright when placed in my room, so female voices can sound slightly harsh, and the sibiliance from these high frequencies can sound grating and unnatural. Customizing the Dirac target curve and giving it a rolloff in the high frequencies, designed specifically to what sounded correct in my room, was absolutely necessary to get male and female voices to sound crisp, clear, natural, and life-like.

Obviously these are just the experiences and opinion of one person, so folks are free to interpret them however they like. But unless a proper study with a large enough sample size is ever done, these personal experiences are about the best we can do for now.
 
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database

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I typically listen to movies at between 0 and -9dB on my Pioneer that’ll put out 90 watts all channels driven. I’m concerned an NAD running 80 watts per channel at -6dB May not be loud enough. My front three speakers are 98dB sensitive Klipsch’s.

Martin
I think external amps would be your best bet in that scenario.
 

Noah Katz

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Ah; I thought that it was being posed as a fix for RC issues, not an alternative.


By not charging you anything in the way of licensing?
By allowing complete customization of the filter prior to applying it?
By allowing a variety of measurement methods, positions and/or microphones rather than just the proprietary ones?

Beyond those... I'm not sure.
 

Noah Katz

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I typically listen to movies at between 0 and -9dB on my Pioneer that’ll put out 90 watts all channels driven. I’m concerned an NAD running 80 watts per channel at -6dB May not be loud enough. My front three speakers are 98dB sensitive Klipsch’s.

How loud do you listen?

98dB + 80W = 117 dB, and that's for just one speaker.
 
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A/V Analysis

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Dante is good, but isn't AVB better? It transmits sound and image and there are no problems with latency.
Dante is becoming the de facto implementation. I have performed measurements on a system (PA) utilizing Dante and there was no excessive latency to speak of. According to Audinate most Dante devices add only 1ms of propagation delay.
https://www.audinate.com/faq/aes67-or-avb-competing-protocol-dante
Audinate does not see networking protocols as competing technologies. Neither AES67 nor AVB are competitive equivalents to Dante. AES67 and AVB are both a collection of standards, which are not actual implementations. Dante is a commercially supported solution, and more than just a standard. It is important to emphasize that AES67 will be incorporated as an option within Dante, rather than an alternative to it. Our OEMs recognize the benefit we provide to enable them to develop their products quickly and benefit from our expertise.

Rumor is that Trinnov will be adding Dante/AES67 support (they already support 16 channels via AES3 on the Altitude 32). It seems very likely that with JBL already confirming support in the Arcam based SDP-35 & SDP-55. It makes sense that the flagship, Trinnov A32 based SDP-75 will as well.
 

Sancus

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Dante is becoming the de facto implementation. I have performed measurements on a system (PA) utilizing Dante and there was no excessive latency to speak of. According to Audinate most Dante devices add only 1ms of propagation delay.
https://www.audinate.com/faq/aes67-or-avb-competing-protocol-dante

Something I haven't seen much information on is full processing latency. Did you ever test or do you know the audio latency the HTP-1 adds with Dirac enabled? And similar information for other AVRs?

For most content it isn't extremely important, but it is for games. For example I've read that various miniDSP units have latency from 13-23ms. Is it similar for most Dirac-enabled AVRs or do they vary?
 

apgood

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Dante is becoming the de facto implementation. I have performed measurements on a system (PA) utilizing Dante and there was no excessive latency to speak of. According to Audinate most Dante devices add only 1ms of propagation delay.
https://www.audinate.com/faq/aes67-or-avb-competing-protocol-dante


Rumor is that Trinnov will be adding Dante/AES67 support (they already support 16 channels via AES3 on the Altitude 32). It seems very likely that with JBL already confirming support in the Arcam based SDP-35 & SDP-55. It makes sense that the flagship, Trinnov A32 based SDP-75 will as well.

Stormaudio has also announced a AES67 module (16in / 32out) for the MK2 processors that they have on the roadmap for this year (Q3 2020 I believe). Not sure whether will be compatible with MK1 or MK1.5 ISP's, but have logged a question with Stormaudio asking since personally I'm interested in this for my setup.
 
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