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Monoprice HTP-1 Home Theater Processor Review

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What I don't listen to is shouting and demands. You need to provide proper justification for what you are asking. Saying you don't care about what we measure and I should do this and that to satisfy you in a non-constructive tone, gets you the hand.
If you consider my tone non-constructive or that I shouted or made demands I don't know what to tell you other than sorry you feel that way. I never said I don't care about what you measure...just that the presentation leaves a lot to be desired for those of us that aren't Electrical/Audio engineers. It could be very possible that all AVP's/AVR's manufactured in the past 5 years suck with regards to audio performance but the HTP-1 sucks less. That would be valuable information for someone currently in the market for a AVP with a $2-4k budget. However, the only thing you've made easy to see is that it doesn't perform as well as electronics with a fraction of the feature set at a fraction of the cost and that it doesn't perform well under your test conditions, which I still have no idea how transferable they are to real world use.
 
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I use Dirac myself and it works well. Do we expect it to not work all of a sudden in the same room with HTP-1?
Not about that Amir, but *if* there is degradation over using it from a measurements perspective? I understand there would more variables at play (and could expose one to more questions of how one executed Dirac) but EQ implementation is additional layer on top of original input. Thoughts?
 

amirm

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That's what I thought we wanted to do. I have to think about how we tease out how the pipeline is working. Let me noodle on it. :)
 
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I review what members send me to test. I don't put my hand out there for companies to loan me gear. If you want something else tested, then send it to me. If you don't have it but someone else has, then ask them to send it to me. Otherwise, the data we have is the data we have.

As to bashing the industry, that is my job when they don't do their job. A $4,000 piece of equipment that doesn't have a single measurement? Are you kidding me? You want me to kiss them for doing us that favor? This industry needs shaking up to build properly engineered gear. You don't want to be part of that, then again, move along. I am not here to do cursory testing and grade on a curve. I know what it takes to do things right. I am not going to close my eyes and lie to you all and make it like it is an impossible thing to spit out 4 volts out of a DAC.

When I first started testing 2-channel gear and found equipment that didn't perform, there were a lot of protests like yours and Marc's. But then companies took notice and in span of a year, we started to get far, far improved products. This, from the same companies that were kicking and screaming, blaming my tests for not being good, me being their enemy, etc., etc. Without the type of testing I am bringing, nothing will improve.

You are providing an incredibly valuable service. It amazes me that so many people on this thread don't understand your goals.
 
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If you consider my tone non-constructive or that I shouted or made demands I don't know what to tell you other than sorry you feel that way. I never said I don't care about what you measure...just that the presentation leaves a lot to be desired for those of us that aren't Electrical/Audio engineers. It could be very possible that all AVP's/AVR's manufactured in the past 5 years suck with regards to audio performance but the HTP-1 sucks less. That would be valuable information for someone currently in the market for a AVP with a $2-4k budget. However, the only thing you've made easy to see is that it doesn't perform as well as electronics with a fraction of the feature set at a fraction of the cost and that it doesn't perform well under your test conditions, which I still have no idea how transferable they are to real world use.
Is this the sort of vocabulary that you prefer? It becomes clear that it will be hard provide information to you in the form and at the level you expect.

This site presents the measured data. YOU need to actually think for yourself and develop answers that fit your needs. Why do you expect to be spoon fed? Do the rest of us for some reason owe you that? It is amazing when someone says they can't figure something out and then demands an answer instead of doing further investigation and finding the answer themselves.
 

Thomas savage

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If you consider my tone non-constructive or that I shouted or made demands I don't know what to tell you other than sorry you feel that way. I never said I don't care about what you measure...just that the presentation leaves a lot to be desired for those of us that aren't Electrical/Audio engineers. It could be very possible that all AVP's/AVR's manufactured in the past 5 years suck with regards to audio performance but the HTP-1 sucks less. That would be valuable information for someone currently in the market for a AVP with a $2-4k budget. However, the only thing you've made easy to see is that it doesn't perform as well as electronics with a fraction of the feature set at a fraction of the cost and that it doesn't perform well under your test conditions, which I still have no idea how transferable they are to real world use.
I sympathise, It can be challenging when you read information that by its nature has the potential to be excluding as is the case with some of the measurement data.

We do our best as a community to bridge the gap and to provide a gateway to learning but if you simplify things too much you can end up in dangerous waters .

We are just analysing audio performance, currently most if not all of these AV multichannel things are crappy , likely this is a industry thing , why bother with real performance when you shift units based of marketing and other headlines . So Amirm is not giving them any quarter just because they are a home theater processor, should he lower his standards for them so they can continue being lazy ?

Ultimately I'm sorry you have not got the answers you wanted from our review here and subsequent thread , there's always ' what hifi ' or a million other places that might give you the answers you want .

Thank you for signing up and expressing your perspective. Happy shopping !

Ps. I'd buy a relatively cheap processor and wait a year or so as iv a feeling some better performing ones might be round the corner.

Oh and , your welcome.
 
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Is this the sort of vocabulary that you prefer? It becomes clear that it will be hard provide information to you in the form and at the level you expect.
Is ad hominem really necessary?

This site presents the measured data. YOU need to actually think for yourself and develop answers that fit your needs. Why do you expect to be spoon fed? Do the rest of us for some reason owe you that? It is amazing when someone says they can't figure something out and then demands an answer instead of doing further investigation and finding the answer themselves.
If the reviews were just "measured data" I don't think there would be as much conflict over the results.

Amir has indicated that he is open for criticism and that is what he has received. He can do with that as he pleases.

I do agree that the review is generally useless to the average consumer in the current AVR/AVP market, but that doesn't appear to be the target audience for these reviews anyway. If you want to compare receiver/processor to receiver/processor you need to be able to parse the data on your own since Amir has made it clear that isn't his goal/interest (he holds all audio equipment to the same standard, no segmentation).
 
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Ps. I'd buy a relatively cheap processor and wait a year or so as iv a feeling some better performing ones might be round the corner.

Oh and , your welcome.
I consider myself a pretty patient person but I'm tired of hearing waiting is the best answer. It's a wonder anyone of us has bought any kind of logo'd processor. How long have people been waiting for HDMI 2.1? There's always something better around the corner when it comes to AV gear.
 
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.
I do agree that the review is generally useless to the average consumer in the current AVR/AVP market, but that doesn't appear to be the target audience for these reviews anyway.
Who is the review of value to? Folks that like to see colorful charts and graphs so they can gawk about how inferior of a design it is and how they could do a better job building it with their eyes closed? I'll admit I've only become familiar with ASR in the past six months so it's possible my expectations were misaligned.
 
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lUtimately I'm sorry you have not got the answers you wanted from our review here and subsequent thread , there's always ' what hifi ' or a million other places that might give you the answers you want
I would love it if there was another review of the HTP-1 that included measurement data but this is the extent of what's available. Now that supply seems to have caught up with demand I expect more reviews will be coming but it'll likely be some time before we see them published and we're still talking about a boutique brand AVP that sells for $4k.
 
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Is this the sort of vocabulary that you prefer? It becomes clear that it will be hard provide information to you in the form and at the level you expect.
'Sucks' vs 'sucks less' is not necessarily the vocabulary I'm looking for. However, 'sucks' seems to be a fair term to use when paraphrasing Amir's general opinion of the audio performance of the multichannel processors and receivers that have come across his test bench recently. There's plenty of adjectives out there that I could of used but that was the first that came to mind.
 
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Costas EAR

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Maybe so but this unit isn't providing that at the lowest possible price, either.
Can you find another av processor, cheaper than monoprice, with just the following 3:

16 outputs with XLR
Dirac live
Roon ready

Please, let me know.

If you cannot find one, well, monoprice is the cheapest possible solution. ;)

And if you can't find one, you should change your statement to the opposite one.
 

Sancus

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Can you find another av processor, cheaper than monoprice, with just the following 3:
Nah, I've been over this a zillion times in exhaustive detail. If you don't agree with my posts, that's fine, but my statement is correct and does not need to be changed.
 

BDWoody

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I do agree that the review is generally useless to the average consumer in the current AVR/AVP market, but that doesn't appear to be the target audience for these reviews anyway.
Who is the review of value to? Folks that like to see colorful charts and graphs so they can gawk about how inferior of a design it is and how they could do a better job building it with their eyes closed? I'll admit I've only become familiar with ASR in the past six months so it's possible my expectations were misaligned.
I would say the average consumer of these products heads to Best Buy and looks for something with lots of impressive sounding numbers, none of which they understand, and buys what's on sale, or recommended by the teenager at his after school job.

Above that would be those who consider themselves more educated in audio...possibly claiming the title of 'audiophile' because they study Stereophile and obsess over their speaker cables.

Above that, would be those who are more interested in fundamental design and execution, as measured by any number of objective tests which will reveal much more than someone else saying they really like it. Most of those who stop by here regularly are more in the third group, and it has saved us a lot of money and stress.

For those who complain about the review while simultaneously stating that you don't really understand much of it, I would suggest either taking the time to learn what all that stuff means, or stop trying to tell those of us who DO care (I AM the consumer of this product, and wanted it to be competent after all) that we just need to give it a listen...

This unit does not meet stated specs. If the average consumer doesn't care about that, maybe they've been convinced it doesn't matter for too long.
 

Costas EAR

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Which again returns to the number of channels and logos being paramount. I don't think anyone is denying that if you are planning an installation for a full 16ch setup... then you will obviously have a much smaller number of options available to you. However, you are also likely to be building a theater where the total budget is well into 5 figures (presuming you're correctly spending the lion's share on speakers) and possibly low 6 figures. In that case, what is the compelling reason for saving $2K-6K by going with the HTP-1?
It's always overestimated the total cost of a decent immersive multichannel setup...

Yes, it is expensive, but not necessarily 6 figures.

Neumann 80's are incredible speakers and the cost of 11 of them is quite low.
Also the cost of 4 Neumann sub's is quite low.

An immersive setup with these Neumann speakers, will be more than satisfying, i suppose a breathtaking experience, if you have a well treated room.

You can also try even cheaper active speakers than these Neumann's, for example the adam a7x or even fluid audio coaxial 8" active speakers.

You can find 11 decent speakers at a quite low budget, much lower than a pair of JBL M2, maybe even lower than just one M2, isn't that great? And Dr Floyd Toole's suggestions include that if you are using many speakers, they don't have to be as excellent as they need to be, if they are only two of them available, in a good old stereo setup. ;)

I wonder if that statement is valid to electronics associated with multichannel setups, and i strongly suspect from my experience that it does. ;)

If you try to get the JBL processor instead of monoprice, so that you can use the digital outputs of all 16 channels, which is a very good idea, you have to add the cost of 16 channels of DAC's, don't forget this.
So, the difference in cost is quite noticeable, i suppose it will cost more than double the cost of the monoprice option.

This means, that indeed the monoprice is very cheap for what it is offering. I can understand that many of you see the 4.000 category as "the out of budget" dream, of maybe you set this price by definition to "high end audio", but this is not the case.


I wonder if any improvements can be heard in a blind ABX test between a multichannel processor with SINAD of 100db to a 90db one.

Or one with 110db SINAD compared to 90db.
I am quite confident that sinad of 90 to 100 is not audible in a stereo setup.

I am also quite confident that anything higher than sinad of 80 is not audible in a multichannel setup, listening at reference level, which (i am also quite confident to state) is the optimum hearing spl level, for the highest possible perceived fidelity of the recorded material.

I know I can do better.
I seriously doubt that statement.
Many really experienced engineers in so many companies cannot do better, and you can?
I respect deeply your experience and your knowledge, but the fact is that you never tryied to build an avr with all these included capabilities in such a low cost, and IMHO it is incredibly low for all that is included, in the same sense that a 9$ dac and a $100 active speaker can be so really good at such a low price. ;)

Your measurements, indeed may become a starting point for improvements in these tested machines, and this is the best outcome we can expect.
 
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Better still, Denon and Marantz is unmatched and their rock solid ability to implement trouble free eARC, which for me, is quite difficult for most pre/pro manufacturers to get right in terms of TV compatibility, and most importantly, eARC is essential for all AVRs plugging directly into the latest flagship TVs. The world is going towards less components not more, and so with that in mind, TVs with integrated streaming services (Netflix, Disney Plus, etc.) require eARC capable receivers.
The eARC implementation in the HTP-1 is, in my personal experience, perfect. The CEC works great too. And the sound quality is brilliant.
 

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If you try to get the JBL processor instead of monoprice, so that you can use the digital outputs of all 16 channels, which is a very good idea, you have to add the cost of 16 channels of DAC's, don't forget this.
So, the difference in cost is quite noticeable, i suppose it will cost more than double the cost of the monoprice option.
For my use, I won't be needing to add anything to the price for the DAC's, because my speakers (JBL 70xP's) have digital inputs in addition to analog.
As the move towards powered speakers continues, having them with built in DAC's and some degree of processing is becoming more common, not less. I'd think the move towards a digital only out is what we are all waiting for. Unfortunately, HDCP issues have gotten in the way of that, but with hdmi 2.1 let's hope some of those barriers are more easily dealt with.
 

Costas EAR

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Everyone in this forum, i am quite pleased to find out that seem to respect deeply Dr Floyd Toole's suggestions, in all aspects of audio.

All? Maybe sometimes excluding just one, the one regarding the proved and undeniable multiple benefits of the multichannel immersive setup, which is quite obvious if you read his book, and of course it is stated even in this forum:

254414_eb744c3893a750aace995d20dbd5b5ed.jpg


Of course, part of these suggestions is based not only on science, but it is also strengthened with listening experience and validation.

Listening validation of the findings is quite crucial in so many aspects of audio, and for many reasons, and IMHO not to find the best listening impression's, but mainly for the need to validate the usefulness of measurements, because some things can be measured quite easily, but they are not audible, so in these cases what's the point of measuring other than for the shake of stacking useless science books? Certainly, there's no point for consumers, and let me remind you the fact of audibility of distortion, jitter in the digital domain, higher resolution of digital audio, etc.. and please do not forget cables. Power cables, much more expensive than a car.
Yes, we can measure power cables, but what's the point?

I suppose that measurements for multichannel avr's are quite complex, and some really very easy listening findings (for example this marantz avr is just rubbish compared to this nad or this anthem or emotiva avr) but the provided technical specifications, or even the measurements from ASR doesn't help at all.:(

I am a guy of measurements and pdf's, i spit on listening impression's, even mine.
But i am in the awkward position to state that higher sinad numbers and output voltages and thd measurements of these av processors, doesn't really mean anything in real life. Yes, it is a proof of excellent engineering. So?

I just point to the need of other, more sophisticated ways of measuring the performance of an immersive setup and the components it is made of.

I suspect that complex measurements provided by reproducing immersive recorded material in BD audio tracks with Dolby Atmos flag, including sweeps, tones, pink noise, etc, after full calibration and setting a reasonable target curve, is the way to go.
Every speaker should be measured separately, but also all of them together. It is crucial to find out how well they can recreate all together the one simple object, in an object oriented immersive setup, in the same way a tone of 1kHz is measured in a DAC (and something similar to multitone measuring, which "translates" to multiple objects in 3D space).

Trinnov's 3D microphone is quite different from the plain single capsule microphones used by other manufacturers. I think Trinnov knows better.

These are my thoughts, and even if i don't think that a higher sinad number is needed, or even 4Vrms outputs, of course i evaluate every possible measurement i can get, and i deeply respect what Amir is doing here.

I only hope that better ways of complex measurements are discovered, so that a higher score in measurements really point to a better sounding avr, as is the case with a simple 2 channel DAC. ;)
 
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