Minidsp Flex Review (Audio DSP)

[Marc v E]

What DAC is in FLEX Eight(8)?

Now that is an interesting question because the specs are better in the flex 8. Iirc the flex 8 will be delivered from September (which should be any moment now) but nobody has received one yet.

 

[Виталий]

Now that is an interesting question because the specs are better in the flex 8. Iirc the flex 8 will be delivered from September (which should be any moment now) but nobody has received one yet.

They say that there are 2 DAC es9080.

 

[Merkurio]

Which would be a better option to use in a simple chain of desktop headphones or which would get better performance?

-Flex with digital outputs and a competent headphone DAC/Amp (DX3 Pro+, C200, DX7 Pro+, etc).
-Flex with balanced outputs and a balanced headphone amplifier (L50, A30 Pro, etc).

 

[staticV3]

@Merkurio the latter. No sound quality reduction compared to an external DAC and leaves you with more money to spend on a quality Amp.

 

[Merkurio]

@Merkurio the latter. No sound quality reduction compared to an external DAC and leaves you with more money to spend on a quality Amp.

In fact, the analog TRS version is $75 more expensive than the digital one.

 

[MCH]

But do you really need 4 channels? If not and you are on a budget there are probably other much cheaper options

 

[staticV3]

In fact, the analog TRS version is $75 more expensive than the digital one.

$75 doesn't buy you a 4.5Vrms Bal DAC with 115dB SINAD and Toslink or Spdif input.
For that money, the best you could do is a Toneboard probably

Edit:
To be fair, you could save a helluva lot of money by just using EQApo or eqmac or something and getting a Moondrop Dawn as DAC ($70, 4Vrms, 118dB SINAD), then spending the rest on a good Amp like the L30II

 

[Merkurio]

$75 doesn't buy you a 4.5Vrms Bal DAC with 115dB SINAD and Toslink or Spdif input.
For that money, the best you could do is a Toneboard probably

Edit:
To be fair, you could save a helluva lot of money by just using EQApo or eqmac or something and getting a Moondrop Dawn as DAC ($70, 4Vrms, 118dB SINAD), then spending the rest on a good Amp like the L30II

I agree, you need to spend almost the double for a Topping D10B without any connectivity besides the USB input.

As for the second point, I already use SoundSource for PEQ on Mac and it works like a dream, but the idea of having hardware DSP with Dirac capabilities (for an active monitors in the future) and even for some sort of connection with the Xbox Series X in the future is very tempting...

But do you really need 4 channels? If not and you are on a budget there are probably other much cheaper options

Not at this moment, but maybe in the future I appreciate that extra connectivity using studio monitors as desktop speakers.

 

[Merkurio]

Anyway, your recommendation about the Moondrop Dawn really caught my attention @staticV3, do you know if it's possible to connect it to a balanced amplifier (L50, A90, etc.) with something like this?:

It would be great to this kind of setup without a "bulky" cheap DAC like the D10B, since it's hidden behind the computer and without displaying the sample-rate (which I couldn't care less about).

 

[staticV3]

do you know if it's possible to connect it to a balanced amplifier (L50, A90, etc.) with something like this?:

Possible yes, but I would first contact Moondrop support and ask them if the pentaconn GND is connected to the Dawn's GND or if it's simply left disconnected.
You want your DAC and Amp to be grounded to each other.

 

[Merkurio]

Possible yes, but I would first contact Moondrop support and ask them if the pentaconn GND is connected to the Dawn's GND or if it's simply left disconnected.
You want your DAC and Amp to be grounded to each other.

Thank you, as usual!

If it's not grounded, wouldn't the A90's "lift" option help?

 

[staticV3]

If it's not grounded, wouldn't the A90's "lift" option help?

The common GND between DAC and Amp is there to prevent a ground potential from frying the DAC's output or the Amp's input.
It was discussed in more detail here.
I don't think the ground lift switch would help here

 

[Merkurio]

The common GND between DAC and Amp is there to prevent a ground potential from frying the DAC's output or the Amp's input.
It was discussed in more detail here.
I don't think the ground lift switch would help here

Got it!

I've already asked Moondrop about the GND connection between the 4.4 connector and the device itself for use with an external balanced amplifier, as you indicated.

End of the off-topic...

 

[MCH]

Not at this moment, but maybe in the future I appreciate that extra connectivity using studio monitors as desktop speakers.

Still in that case, you don't really need 4 channels. My advice (if you are really on a budget). Buy a normal 2 channel dac/hp amp and see later when you want to add something else. Of course your decision there are many happy owners of flex here

 

[Merkurio]

Still in that case, you don't really need 4 channels. My advice (if you are really on a budget). Buy a normal 2 channel dac/hp amp and see later when you want to add something else. Of course your decision there are many happy owners of flex here

In fact, that's exactly what I just did.

Following the advice of @staticV3, I purchased the Moondrop Dawn (although the 3.5 version with 2V output) with a L30 II and I think it was the best possible decision for my current needs, fueling by my intention to buy a DCA Aeon 2 in a few months.

BTW, Moondrop replied me through their official store on AliExpress and told me that the 4.4 version of the Dawn works properly with balanced amplifiers, the representative told me that one of the technicians tried it with the SMSL SP400 without any problems.

 

[juliangst]

Have you calculated how much it would cost you to order from minidsp direct these days? My country -in EU- has a relatively low VAT and it would be ca 700eur after taxes fees etc. I think audiophonics price is quite good now (you get local support + 2 years warranty instead of one for probably less than 50 eur more...)

I changed my mind and don't want to get the minidsp anymore. It's just too expensive in the EU for the feautures it has.
A Topping DM7 with a Raspberry Pi or PC can do more powerful DSP things, has 8 channels and is 150€ less expensive. I hope they'll come up with a 4 or 6 channel version of the DM7 for even less money

 

[Marc v E]

I changed my mind and don't want to get the minidsp anymore. It's just too expensive in the EU for the feautures it has.
A Topping DM7 with a Raspberry Pi or PC can do more powerful DSP things, has 8 channels and is 150€ less expensive. I hope they'll come up with a 4 or 6 channel version of the DM7 for even less money

Going by experience I would say to my past "me" that buying the right equipment at an early stage might seem a big sum if money, but it is less than buying a product and upgrading over time. .....I have lots of dacs to sell...note to self: sell them.

My advice to you based on the above is to buy the minidsp with the future use of subs in mind.

 

[euge_lee]

Not that I could audibly tell a difference either way but... from a theoretical perspective... if I use Roon to send my MiniDSP Flex 96kHz upsampled audio rather than native 44.1... would that "alleviate" the MiniDSP from having to upsample internally before doing DSP? Or does the MiniDSP simple process EVERYTHING even if it comes in at its native sampling rate?

Is there a way we can "measure" this? If @amirm was to use Roon upsampled vs native into the MiniDSP... could his measurement tools perhaps "see the difference" somehow?

Again, not that it really matters sonically to me, but since I have Roon and it's just a couple clicks to upsample... I'm quite curious.

 

[antcollinet]

Not that I could audibly tell a difference either way but... from a theoretical perspective... if I use Roon to send my MiniDSP Flex 96kHz upsampled audio rather than native 44.1... would that "alleviate" the MiniDSP from having to upsample internally before doing DSP? Or does the MiniDSP simple process EVERYTHING even if it comes in at its native sampling rate?

Is there a way we can "measure" this? If @amirm was to use Roon upsampled vs native into the MiniDSP... could his measurement tools perhaps "see the difference" somehow?

Again, not that it really matters sonically to me, but since I have Roon and it's just a couple clicks to upsample... I'm quite curious.

Upsampling processes if done proplerly are "perfect" (In that they don't introduce any artefacts into the signal). So if both Roon and the Mini DSP are doing it properly (which I would expect) there will be no difference wherever you do it.

 

[voodooless]

would that "alleviate" the MiniDSP from having to upsample internally before doing DSP? Or does the MiniDSP simple process EVERYTHING even if it comes in at its native sampling rate?

Since the clock source of the external data is unknown, the DSP usually has its own clock domain, so there will always be resampling involved. No point in letting Roon do it for you. In fact, it's said that resampling to the same rate may actually be worse than differing sample rates, but I haven't seen any concrete evidence of this.