It looks too plain and doesn't have much visual character, so unfortunately, I think it's a speaker that's hard to sell even for ’professional’ use. Many of today's self claimed professionals are just a bunch of uneducated snobs.
Thanks for the info. Makes sense, just never thought of it that way, however with DSP activated I guess there’d be no other way.Correct.
With both the Genelec and Mesanovic reviewed here, the internal DACs are always active and cannot be bypassed.
With digital input, the signal chain is
Source->[DSP->DAC->Amp->Drivers]
whereas with Analog in it's
Source->DAC->[ADC->DSP->DAC->Amp->Drivers].
[ ] being the speaker
As you can see, all that using an external DAC is achieving is adding an unnecessary D->A and A->D conversion to the chain.
These may well be audibly transparent, but objectively, those additional conversions will degrade signal fidelity somewhat.
Have you tried something like church organ music or large philharmonic orchestra? Is there a trace of "real sound", then?Mesanovic CDM65 Listening Tests
The familiar sound of a neutral speaker immediately came across the moment I queued my first female track. What also came was clean bass which I am not used to when testing small speakers with such tracks. Switching to bass heavy music, brought out the real power. Impressively, the cabinet was not transmitting hardly any vibrations. Typically I have to work fair bit to isolate these when performing my listening tests but with CDM65, I didn't have to.
Switching to my track with very low bass response, resulted in fair amount of output but with mild level of distortion -- precisely as the 96 dBSPL measurements showed. So laws of physics are not violated, just bent.
After this, I felt like just laying back in my chair and listen! The fidelity was incredible despite the fact that I perform my tests with just a single speaker!
So without knowing what test tracks i used you know that they were not real sound? Some skill and presumptuous attitude you have there....Have you tried something like church organ music or large philharmonic orchestra? Is there a trace of "real sound", then?
To add to that, if one seeks deep bass reproduction at higher SPL levels, small monitors are simply not the right solution. The debate around low-frequency distortion in small speakers feels somewhat... unrealistic, for lack of a better term.As I noted in my review, deep bass distortion is audible but requires special test track that reveals it. Typical content doesn't go that low, or if it does, it is not revealing due to masking.
Exactly and if you are looking for SPL of around 100 dB (as mentioned in the thread), let's say 100 dB (or more) for a longer time, then you should investigate PA speakers. That is what they are designed to deliver.To add to that, if one seeks deep bass reproduction at higher SPL levels, small monitors are simply not the right solution. The debate around low-frequency distortion in small speakers feels somewhat... unrealistic, for lack of a better term.
It’s really good though.I did that. But it's not small and it's not cheap.![]()
There is an Ascilab assembles thread, probably better to pose the question there.How are the AsciLab purifi active models going, and what amps are they using exactly.
I asked if you tried recordings of church organ music or large philharmonic orchestra, for a good reason, and you have not replied, instead you suggested something on my attitude. The reason why I ask is that I never heard a satisfactory sound of this kind of music from similar small speakers, though they have had flat frequency response and controlled directivity. The big organ or orchestral body is missing. Tracy Chapman would be good, though.So without knowing what test tracks i used you know that they were not real sound? Some skill and presumptuous attitude you have there....
And for me, it wouldn't even need a sub.Probably does not need an EQ![]()
Didn't you forget a zero? Or do you mean second hand?At $2649 each for the Mesanovic it's over priced.
I can buy a pair of Revel F228Be for $702 more and have a speaker system with a fantastic low end (no bass distortion) that also looks fantastic. The Mesanovic makes the Revel F228Be look like a value play.![]()
Awesome build! The side woofers can only cancel rear radiation down to the crossover point of the front firing midbass driver. To cancel lower bass frequencies you would need additional woofers at the rear of the cabinet, which is what the Kii does. You could also make the front firing midbass driver cardioid with a resistive port on the cabinet sides of calculated area and acoustic impedance (Rayls). This can be determined given specific parameters of the driver. The cardioid pattern would behave down to the crossover point (usually around 100-150Hz like the Dutch 8c). You could then place side firing subwoofers behind the resistive port along with rear firing subwoofers and use this for low bass cardioid calcellation via DSP like the Kii. This design would combine the design principles of the Kii and Dutch 8c, but would turn out to be a really deep cabinet!As I own a set of KH150 and built a passive Speaker that works very similar to the mesanovic (thread here on ASR but needs an update) I can may add a few comments.
My self made speakers like the mesanovic use a much more shallow Waveguide and for far field listening it sounds more neutral and less dark (then KH150). That is in far field and without EQ.
In my Design the side woofers only run parallel to the front 6,5" woofer to cancel the rear and some side low frequency and I too struggle with rear radiation canceling like you see in the Klippe measurements of mesanovic in cardioid mode.(the side woofers would have to be closer to the front for this to work). The rear wall reflections of the rear firing frequencies that are not canceled Properly (the strong 180° sideband) may provide a bit of unwanted comb filtering that will bring out parts of the midrange too much if the speaker is near a wall.
Mesanovic uses a smaller front woofer of the same series but does not do cardioid down into the bass range (which may actually be the better solution - my solution was to use a sub for the bass that stands next to the wall but that means more external components).
We tested all of these speakers you see in the pictures against each other and I am pretty sure that without specific room correction used the mesanovic would have won this competition if they were there (because of the cleaner midrange when close to a wall).
I don't know for anyone else but I myself would very likely prefer the mesanovic to a set of KH150 on most cases (and would probably add a sub).
Still the KH150 is a superb near field monitor at its price point and the bass is extremely clean up to Very high volumes. I wished they used a more shallow Waveguide though.
Thanks, I thought a lot about Trying other versions of cardioid (most likely side slot type) but there is also room for improvement on my design and I may rebuild it slightly altered with a better matched Waveguide and as an active speaker instead of Full passive crossover.Awesome build! The side woofers can only cancel rear radiation down to the crossover point of the front firing midbass driver. To cancel lower bass frequencies you would need additional woofers at the rear of the cabinet, which is what the Kii does. You could also make the front firing midbass driver cardioid with a resistive port on the cabinet sides of calculated area and acoustic impedance (Rayls). This can be determined given specific parameters of the driver. The cardioid pattern would behave down to the crossover point (usually around 100-150Hz like the Dutch 8c). You could then place side firing subwoofers behind the resistive port along with rear firing subwoofers and use this for low bass cardioid calcellation via DSP like the Kii. This design would combine the design principles of the Kii and Dutch 8c, but would turn out to be a really deep cabinet!
A good starting point for resistive port cardioids would be slots that have a total area equal to roughly 65% of driver Sd with a Nomex high temperature felt of 0.050" inch thickness at the port opening. The felt should be sandwiched between or adhered to perforated metal to make it stiff or you can 3D print the ports. This combo will give you about 10dB attenuation at 90 degrees down to 100Hz where you would want to crossover to subs. The acoustic impedance of the material is critical to achieve the desired attenuation and should be measured for airflow resistivity, but that can often be hard to do for DIY projects. Several companies make materials of specific acoustic impedance but you would have to do the math to know which value you require. The felt meets the specs for 5-6" drivers/chamber volumes and is readily available at McMaster-Carr.Thanks, I thought a lot about Trying other versions of cardioid (most likely side slot type) but there is also room for improvement on my design and I may rebuild it slightly altered with a better matched Waveguide and as an active speaker instead of Full passive crossover.
I'd just like to highlight this comment - a manufacturer that gives specific technical advice on DIY, especially when it would theoretically compete with their product, shows confidence (in their product and expertise) and good faith toward the community.A good starting point for resistive port cardioids would be slots that have a total area equal to roughly 65% of driver Sd with a Nomex high temperature felt of 0.050" inch thickness at the port opening. The felt should be sandwiched between or adhered to perforated metal to make it stiff or you can 3D print the ports. This combo will give you about 10dB attenuation at 90 degrees down to 100Hz where you would want to crossover to subs. The acoustic impedance of the material is critical to achieve the desired attenuation and should be measured for airflow resistivity, but that can often be hard to do for DIY projects. Several companies make materials of specific acoustic impedance but you would have to do the math to know which value you require. The felt meets the specs for 5-6" drivers/chamber volumes and is readily available at McMaster-Carr.
YS-Processing.Exactly and if you are looking for SPL of around 100 dB (as mentioned in the thread), let's say 100 dB (or more) for a longer time, then you should investigate PA speakers. That is what they are designed to deliver.
No surprise: Really deep bass reproduction is solved by large bass drivers (with large x-max) in sufficiently large bass boxes.
However, Audio Pro had their own patented Ace Bass technology to get deep bass in smaller boxes, but that might be the subject of another thread?
Yamaha had or has? something similar with their YST technology.
Well, it is possible to "force" a deeper bass out of speakers. I thought of: Linkwitz transform.YS-Processing.
I remember it as a loudness EQ specifically tuned for certain speakers.
I have it on a few of my Yamaha amplifiers. I should try activating it to see what it does.