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"Measurement data are one thing, and audio quality is another. "

stereo coffee

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Video - codec Youtube.
And the volume is not matched.

The person providing is as I see, only adjusting a speaker switch, so Yes the Yamaha is less efficient, which I agree could have been improved
in the demonstration...then again is also showing that aspect of the speakers performance to consider... but which did you prefer listening, vs if you can -which measurements you prefer ?
 
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North_Sky

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There is no substitute for sound preference. It's a winning combination of all elements under the same roof...our roof. It's a private personal "music sound flow" matter.

I appreciate the scientific measurements of the audio gear and mechanical speakers.
But they are not ruling my life, my ears, my music listening enjoyment, my life's satisfaction. I use them as a guide but not the only guide in existence.

I respect vintage audio gear, reconditioned audio gear sound. I enjoy modern and old well recorded music albums of the music I like...Opera, Chorales, Classical Chamber, Classical Orchestral, Solo Piano, Solo Cello, Solo Violin, Jazz, Blues, International, Electronica, New Age, New Wave and Tango.
 
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Blumlein 88

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But what has the equipment to do with the appreciation of music? It's a tool, like a hammer or a washing machine. I get as much emotional connection with my hifi as I get from my lawn mower.

Music, however, has nothing to do with the equipment it's reproduced on. In most cases, it was composed hundreds of years before reproduction was even possible, so no, no connection as far as I'm concerned.

S
I get more emotional to my hifi gear than my lawn mower. Or maybe I should ask, "hey man, what kind of lawn mower do you have?"

People or maybe I should say guys get attached to gear. More so if it is used for emotional things, like music, but even when not. I'm about to sell a vehicle I've owned for 20 years. While it is purely a utilitarian bit of machinery, I'm a little attached to it just having owned it for so long, counted on it for so long and done some memorable things with it during that time.
 

Blumlein 88

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Extensive enough properly interpreted data almost by definition has to be enough to determine audio quality.

Now there are worlds of things between the beginning and end of that sentence.

Not to drift too much into the old beat to death obs and subs argument.

Suppose I can manipulate the listener so that measureably inferior audio quality makes the listener happier than superior data confirmed audio quality? One can imagine many ways this can be so. Most being completely peripheral to audio quality. Does that mean the data is wrong about the audio quality? No it doesn't. Just make sure you don't make this mistake and yes largely measurement data aren't one thing separate from audio quality.
 

VintageFlanker

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Pretty much what @sergeauckland et @BDWoody said:
The major problem is: audiophiles seem to do not understand this very simple point:
First : Emotion/communication/inspiration/soul or whatever are in the music itself, not in the gear.
Second: that is the music reproduction abilities which are measured, not the music itself. Then, you cannot distinguish music reproduction (fidelity) from measurements.
 

digicidal

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Agreed with above... I think the only question is whether or not "audio quality" describes something other than "fidelity level"... i.e. do you believe there is something other than transparency to the source material to be considered?

If you do, then measurements are likely to be either totally useless, or merely anecdotal icing on your subjective equipment selection cake. On the other hand, if you believe that measurements (and technology) were the sole factor involved in capturing waves in air and converting them into recorded media... then they are surely all that matters on the back end as well.

How you relate to those sound waves is a completely different subject, and is very likely to color everything in the signal chain (in your mind at least) unless you're determined not to let it. No matter how confident I am in the science and technology... when my equipment provides access to a very moving piece of music - it's nearly impossible not to project some of that emotion on to the equipment (regardless of how irrational I know that to be). :facepalm:
 

North_Sky

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When I shop for a car, a house, a neighborhood, a watch, groceries, I read the reports for best consumption and then go for a test drive. And I compare the reports and the various products to get a better handle. If Daddy says son get this one because it's the best measure of both worlds I always listen to Daddy...he knows what's best for me...his own son, own blood. Best to be in friendly terms with Daddy and Mommy than in disagreement. Parents have that intuitive thing that's best for their children.
It's the same @ school with our teachers, with our leaders.

Without a clear road ahead there's no direction. Without scientific studies there's no climate change, no audio sound evolution. Without measurements we are advancing blind in the darkness.

Everything counts when it comes to our sound.
Sound matters ...
 

digicidal

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Parents have that intuitive thing that's best for their children.
It's the same @ school with our teachers, with our leaders.

We definitely have very different opinions on the veracity and motivation of both parents and institutional representatives. ;)

Without a clear road ahead there's no direction. Without scientific studies there's no climate change, no audio sound evolution. Without measurements we are advancing blind in the darkness.

I can agree with that sentence without qualification, however.
 

Robin L

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stereo coffee

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In the image above, they have no opinion. other than three people strangely seemingly have had collective brain fade, all at the same moment, which is funny.
 

murraycamp

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Wes

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guys get attached to gear because a while back the guys who didn't really care about how well their spears and arrowheads were chipped out of the right kind of stone either starved to death or were killed by guys who did care
 

mhardy6647

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guys get attached to gear because a while back the guys who didn't really care about how well their spears and arrowheads were chipped out of the right kind of stone either starved to death or were killed by guys who did care
You may be on to something of deep anthropological significance.
I routinely bludgeon rivals with spare amplifiers.

:cool:
 

murraycamp

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You may be on to something of deep anthropological significance.
I routinely bludgeon rivals with spare amplifiers.

:cool:
I guess one reason to consider Class A/B over Class D. More mass.
 
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