I heard you can open a terminal in Win 10 buy typing cmd in Find but it has limited use.
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Measured Differences Between Software Audio Players
- Thread starter amirm
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Well I am sure you all use short keys and don't use a mouse in Windows as that's the kind of guys you all are.... Yea right
Don't live in a term but do like doing some things in the ole school ways. Like using Mark Lord's Wiper utility from hdparm to trim my SSD.Well I am sure you all use short keys and don't use a mouse in Windows as that's the kind of guys you all are.... Yea right
Don Hills
Addicted to Fun and Learning
It will play a full directory at a time. It doesn't recurse though.
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Wondering about the WTF and Foobar 192 khz files with clock locked some more.
Decided to look at sample values at the peak of the waveform. With clocks locked you would expect the same exact place to be sampled at the peak for each peak of a repetitive waveform like the one used. Which should mean the same exact value for that sample. In the case of 44.1 khz sample rates the point of sampling will repeat exactly every 441 samples. Analog noise will prevent exactness every time, but should be low enough the variance at the peak samples should be quite small.
So with Foobar locked files I checked the peak sample and every 441 samples thereafter. The following is in -dbfs. The results look like what I would expect with locked clocks.
.42813
.42813
.42786
.42813
.42841
.42813
.42841
.42869
.42841
WTF locked file is about .1 db lower in level, but otherwise very similar.
.52642
.52756
.52784
.52784
.52756
.52784
.52756
.52727
.52727
What variance you see is consistent with somewhere near -80 db of noise interference.
Now looking at a 192 khz file with locked clocks I only need to find a peak and skip 192 samples to find what should be the same exact sampling point of the waveform. When I do that with one of the WTF files I saw:
.59906
.54863
.48092
.40294
.43883
.50931
.56931
.61197
.63190
.62768
Much more variance. Now that can be caused by at least two things. One is a high noise level, and the other would be clocks that aren’t well locked or are unstable in the locking. The FFT shows that there is not a general high noise level across the board. I therefore believe the sample time between the ADC and DAC is varying because the lock is not stable. Each sample is not occurring at the same point in time on the waveform. Looking at unlocked clock files shows even more variance, but that is expected as the exact peak sample point is drifting on and off peak over time.
I don’t know what connection they used to lock the clocks, but I have seen such behaviour when using TOSLINK cable. It locks fine at up to 96 khz, and while it locks and records at 192 khz you see such instability in the timing sometimes with marginal connections. Again it would be nice to see the 192 khz signals done at a quarter sample rate.
This is further evidence I think to distrust any of the results with the locked 192 khz files.
Decided to look at sample values at the peak of the waveform. With clocks locked you would expect the same exact place to be sampled at the peak for each peak of a repetitive waveform like the one used. Which should mean the same exact value for that sample. In the case of 44.1 khz sample rates the point of sampling will repeat exactly every 441 samples. Analog noise will prevent exactness every time, but should be low enough the variance at the peak samples should be quite small.
So with Foobar locked files I checked the peak sample and every 441 samples thereafter. The following is in -dbfs. The results look like what I would expect with locked clocks.
.42813
.42813
.42786
.42813
.42841
.42813
.42841
.42869
.42841
WTF locked file is about .1 db lower in level, but otherwise very similar.
.52642
.52756
.52784
.52784
.52756
.52784
.52756
.52727
.52727
What variance you see is consistent with somewhere near -80 db of noise interference.
Now looking at a 192 khz file with locked clocks I only need to find a peak and skip 192 samples to find what should be the same exact sampling point of the waveform. When I do that with one of the WTF files I saw:
.59906
.54863
.48092
.40294
.43883
.50931
.56931
.61197
.63190
.62768
Much more variance. Now that can be caused by at least two things. One is a high noise level, and the other would be clocks that aren’t well locked or are unstable in the locking. The FFT shows that there is not a general high noise level across the board. I therefore believe the sample time between the ADC and DAC is varying because the lock is not stable. Each sample is not occurring at the same point in time on the waveform. Looking at unlocked clock files shows even more variance, but that is expected as the exact peak sample point is drifting on and off peak over time.
I don’t know what connection they used to lock the clocks, but I have seen such behaviour when using TOSLINK cable. It locks fine at up to 96 khz, and while it locks and records at 192 khz you see such instability in the timing sometimes with marginal connections. Again it would be nice to see the 192 khz signals done at a quarter sample rate.
This is further evidence I think to distrust any of the results with the locked 192 khz files.
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Okay, some of my last post was shall we say misguided, or polluted or missing something important.
My idea of checking peak values for accurate locked clocks was fine if it meets the right conditions. That being relatively low noise otherwise and only one repetitive signal and its harmonics. Unfortunately, the triangle waves are not the purest. There is enough of a 100 hz component sum&differencing with the fundamental and harmonics to corrupt my make shift method of checking clock accuracy. Notice the FFT of the reference triangle wave.
The sum and difference signals around the fundamental at 100 hz spacing and also around the harmonics shouldn't be there. They are modulating the peaks of the wave. That means every tenth wave of 1000 hz waves will have the same amplitude. I used every tenth wave peak comparing at 44.1 khz because it takes ten waves to evenly divide 1000 hz into 44,100 hz sample rates. Since samples repeat each wave evenly at 192 khz I was comparing every wave consecutively. Those were being 100 hz modulated and looked uneven at the peaks. When I went back and compared the 192 khz files on every tenth wave peak they also were tightly bunched like you would expect locked clocking to accomplish. I think a sine would have been more useful for this testing (and at a quarter sample rate too).
So instead of the Mea Culpa how about in the famous words of Emily Litella "NEVER MIND".
My idea of checking peak values for accurate locked clocks was fine if it meets the right conditions. That being relatively low noise otherwise and only one repetitive signal and its harmonics. Unfortunately, the triangle waves are not the purest. There is enough of a 100 hz component sum&differencing with the fundamental and harmonics to corrupt my make shift method of checking clock accuracy. Notice the FFT of the reference triangle wave.
The sum and difference signals around the fundamental at 100 hz spacing and also around the harmonics shouldn't be there. They are modulating the peaks of the wave. That means every tenth wave of 1000 hz waves will have the same amplitude. I used every tenth wave peak comparing at 44.1 khz because it takes ten waves to evenly divide 1000 hz into 44,100 hz sample rates. Since samples repeat each wave evenly at 192 khz I was comparing every wave consecutively. Those were being 100 hz modulated and looked uneven at the peaks. When I went back and compared the 192 khz files on every tenth wave peak they also were tightly bunched like you would expect locked clocking to accomplish. I think a sine would have been more useful for this testing (and at a quarter sample rate too).
So instead of the Mea Culpa how about in the famous words of Emily Litella "NEVER MIND".
Repercussions of a youth mis-spent?
OP
- Thread Starter
- #48
Mistake or not, you are putting a hell of a lot of effort into this!
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Well I had some time couped up when I couldn't be elsewhere otherwise I wouldn't have. Even then it was probably too much effort.Mistake or not, you are putting a hell of a lot of effort into this!
Appreciated none the less.
watchnerd
Grand Contributor
WTF works best with OTL and single-driver speakers in an all minimalist steampunk system.
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watchnerd
Grand Contributor
Nazi Reel to Reel?
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Hey, you wanted steampunk. Magneto phone. What the Germans came up with after wire recording.
watchnerd
Grand Contributor
Retro, yes. Steampunk, arguably not. Steampunk is pre-electronics.
Unless it's big Tesla coils powered by lightning.
Currently really into SteamPunk art.
My latest build of my OS has a SP theme thru-out.
Desktop and Log In screens.
watchnerd
Grand Contributor
Konqueror...so some distro that uses KDE? SuSE?
Witness top right corner of desktop, PCLinuxOS.
I was part of the dev team for the first 7+ years 2002 and later.
watchnerd
Grand Contributor
Interesting. All the Linux servers (4, I think) in my house are headless and GUI-less.
You run your media manager blind from a terminal? That would be fun.
I only have need for one server/source/whateveryoucallit at my little crib. Tower PC running PCLinuxOS>Clementine sends bit perfect datastream to DC-1 DAC via 1 meter BJC Toslink. DONE .
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