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Measure my tinnitus, or yours?

Multicore

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I searched (casually) and it seems audiologists are Measuring Tinnitus (American Tinnitus Assoc.) as I would imagine:
  • Tinnitus sound matching: The presentation of common tinnitus sounds back to patients, to help them identify their specific perception of tinnitus. The health professional may adjust the pitch and layer multiple sounds to create an exact audio recreation of the the tinnitus. Sound matching provides an important baseline for subsequent tinnitus management therapies, which are often customized for each patient.
  • Minimum masking level: The volume at which an external narrowband noise masks (or covers) the perception of tinnitus. Determining the minimum masking level provides an approximate measure of how loud a patient perceives his/her tinnitus and can be used in subsequent tinnitus masking and sound therapies.
I thought it might be fun to learn to do this at home with headphones. What would seem to be missing is
  • in-ear SPL calibration
  • test protocol
I figure we could come up with a protocol together. Not sure about calibration. Can we combine @amirm 's headphones' sensitivities with voltage measurement to estimate SPL?

Then we could have a jolly old thread where we mess around and compare our tinnitus numbers.
 
In my humble opinion, yes.
The tinnitus pitch seems to be a quite repeatable thing and it is often similar, even for different subjects.
The masking should also be subsequently defined with a certain grade of approximation.

P.s. good idea!
 
With software like REW or a DAW we can generate test tones. With a suitable resistor (e.g. 100 ohm) and a multimeter we can measure voltage at a given dBFS and given amplification setting (e.g. knob position on my MOTU M4). Then, knowing measured impedance of the headphone and its sensitivity in dB SPL per milliWatt, we can calculate an SPL from the generator's dBFS level.

Right?
 
I'm puzzled by people who can find the frequency of their tinnitus tone(s). I've used tone generators to try and identify my own but they're higher than I can hear. My high frequency perception rolls off around 7k. I kept adding gain and going higher but gave up after +20db or so.

I don't know what this says about my condition...
 
I'm puzzled by people who can find the frequency of their tinnitus tone(s). I've used tone generators to try and identify my own but they're higher than I can hear. My high frequency perception rolls off around 7k. I kept adding gain and going higher but gave up after +20db or so.

I don't know what this says about my condition...
Idk. What does it should like to you?

I hear what sounds like tones around 11kHz. Most of the time I can live with it but it's been getting worse in recent days.
 
Did it but unsure of my calculation. Please check?
  • MOTU M4 headphone output with vol knob at max
  • Generator at -12 dBFS in REAPER
  • I measured 0.837 V open circuit at 110, 220 and 440 Hz
  • Headphones are Massdrop/Sennheiser HD58X Jubilee, 150 Ohms and 102 dB SPL per mW (thanks @solderdude )
  • Amir's test of the M4 headphone amp test suggests I can use the open circuit 0.837 V is -12 dBFS as a first approximation (thanks Amir)
  • I measured that my tinnitus masks the generator signal in the headphone at 9700 Hz at -55 dBFS
  • That's 43 dB gain ratio below the -12 dBFS / 0.837 V calibration, so 5.94 mV
  • Into 150 Ohms that makes 0.000235 mW
  • Which is 36.29 dB power ratio below 1 mW
  • So the headphone is putting out 65.71 dB SPL at 9700 Hz but I can't hear it because the tinnitus masks it.

WAT! 65.71 dB SPL at 9700 Hz?​

Speak up please or use my right ear.
 
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I'm puzzled by people who can find the frequency of their tinnitus tone(s). I've used tone generators to try and identify my own but they're higher than I can hear. My high frequency perception rolls off around 7k. I kept adding gain and going higher but gave up after +20db or so.

I don't know what this says about my condition...
i went to see an audiologist and an ear nose and throat nurse practitioner today, after running my own test (above). there is significant mild hearing loss on the left. they had absolutely nothing to quantitatively characterize my case of tinnitus. actually the whole experience was very disappointing.

the audiologist speculated that the hearing loss causes the tinnitus. i've heard this conjecture before often enough. the ENT NP i consulted afterwards ordered a brain scan to look for a tumor since my L hearing loss is 10-20 dB worse than my R. but if that's not the case the presumption will be that age- and perhaps exposure history-related hearing loss is causing the tinnitus. that is to say, my brain, accustomed as it was to hearing noises in the 9 to 10 kHz range since i was a wee bairn is now making stuff up for me to hear.

so that makes this question of testing tinnitus kinda interesting and fun. so you can't hear 9700 Hz? nope. but that's all you can hear? yup.

i tried the same masking test that i did with headphones in the post above with a loudspeaker and my wife beside me. i set it up so she could hear what was just below perceptible at my tinnitus frequency. she was horrified. she's one year younger than i am. i should ask the dogs what they think.
 
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Don't know about what everyone else's is but seriously doubt mine could be masked over.

I have 4 different distinct noises 10% of the time rest is usually at least 3.

I have 35% speech recognition with hearing aids tested thru the VA.

With hearing aids on, I can walk into a 32 lane bowling alley. All lanes being used and that still does not drown out the noises.

VA said at last test was boarder line cochlear implants. I don't remember what quite is.
 
Don't know about what everyone else's is but seriously doubt mine could be masked over.

I have 4 different distinct noises 10% of the time rest is usually at least 3.

I have 35% speech recognition with hearing aids tested thru the VA.

With hearing aids on, I can walk into a 32 lane bowling alley. All lanes being used and that still does not drown out the noises.

VA said at last test was boarder line cochlear implants. I don't remember what quite is.
I am sorry to read it.
 
Thanks multicore. Appreciate the thought. I still enjoy the sounds of music, just not as great sounding as it use to be. As pink floyd said "I see your lips move but can't hear what you are saying" comfortably numb.
 
I measured that my tinnitus masks the generator signal in the headphone at 9700 Hz at -55 dBFS
I repeated the measurement today and found -51 dB FS 9700 Hz sine tone is masked by my tinnitus but -50 dB FS is not. That's 4 dB more than 6 months ago.

Now, please would you help me with the ratio math.

The generator level (dB FS in the DAW) corresponds linearly with voltage of the signal going to the headphones (which I calibrated). That's a gain ratio, i.e. 20×log₁₀(V1/V2)

SPL is a power ratio, 10×log₁₀(P1/P2).

Do I get to sat that 4 dB more in the generator is 4 dB more SPL?
 
I don’t think I’ve measured my tinnitus in terms of DB level. I’d actually prefer not to cause I’m trying to forget about it. (it’s been really viciously spiked for the past couple years.)

However, I can use tone generators to dial the tone at which my tinnitus occurs because mine is a thin ringing sound.

Also as it happens white noise, in particular the thin, high hiss known as Violet or purple noise. That happens to match exactly to my tinnitus. And so I can turn that on at a certain level and it perfectly mosques only my tinnitus ringing. Which gives me a fascinating impression of having no tinnitus, even in a otherwise silent room.

Otherwise, I once suffered some hearing trauma from being underneath the path of some fighter jets on the way to an airshow.
That was when I already had developed hyperacusis. And it elevated my case of hyperacusis so badly that when it was measured by an audiologist - that is, he measured my sensitivity to sound, and at what point sound levels became painful for me across a wide frequency spectrum - he said it was the worst measured case of hyperacusis he’d come across. Basically, he looked shocked and felt that it should be completely disabling and wondered how I was even living with it.

Fortunately, he also treated my hyperacusis, and I got a lot better.
 
glad to hear it was improved- what was the treatment, Matt?

It was based off of tinnitus retraining therapy - TRT.

It involved measuring my hearing sensitivity at various frequencies - some frequencies being intolerable, even at the lowest volume - to get a picture of my hyperacusis.

And then I wore hearing aid type device devices, which injected a calming sort of white noise into my ears for most of the day.
Especially sculpted for my particular hyperacusis sensitivity.

The benefits are two-fold. The first is that the constant addition of that noise reduces the contrast effect of loud noises or sharp noises, so they are not as alarming to the hearing or nervous system.

But the main benefit is to get the auditory system used to sound again, not seeing it as a threat or something to be alarmed about.

The treatment started with a very soft, relaxing, non-threatening type of noise.
I had been to the point where even other people’s voices and my own voice was too loud for me. Even chewing food caused painful distortion in my ears. Even turning the page of a book or magazine was irritating.

And I remember the distinct feeling of relief when I walked out of the clinic the first day wearing those devices in my ear with the soft noise. I could literally feel my whole auditory and nervous system relax for the first time in a long time since the accident.

And progress started out pretty fast in terms of being more comfortable with the every day sound around me.

The typical treatment time is usually estimate estimated for tinnitus or hyperacusis to be up to around 18 months or so, often with the biggest benefits upfront, and then slowly accruing after that. Which is what happened with me. So I would go back to the clinic and they would remeasure my hyperacusis and then the nature of the sound was re-sculpted to get into some of the more challenging frequencies, so turning up some of the high frequencies, etc. And then once I was used to that they would keep modifying the sound to become more challenging and also louder in level. I think you’re supposed to wear the devices for at least 4 to 6 hours a day, but I wore it most of the day.

Anyway, pretty much by the end of the treatment in terms of everyday life, my hyperacusis was essentially gone. There was no way I was going to go to something like a live concert or a really loud movie. I didn’t want to risk that. But essentially everyday life was fine and I had no trouble doing my post sound production work. In fact, my ears had not been so robust since maybe 20 years earlier, before I developed hyperacusis.

It was certainly great while it lasted which was probably about six years. But then I suffered another sort of accident which brought the tinnitus and some degree hyperacusis back. But I know that I can habituate over time.
 
Thanks for the detailed response- glad it was successful for you!

Yup.

Unfortunately, my wife decided we absolutely needed to have a bathroom renovation which just started today. My God it is loud!
My ears are in agony. Sigh.
 
In my humble opinion, yes.
The tinnitus pitch seems to be a quite repeatable thing and it is often similar, even for different subjects.
The masking should also be subsequently defined with a certain grade of approximation.

P.s. good idea!
That's nonsense; some people hear high-pitched sounds and others hear low-pitched sounds.
 
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