• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Marchand XM44 Analog Active Crossover Review

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
20,753
Likes
20,771
Location
Canada
Personally, I find it hard to imagine a use case for this device, aside perhaps from an infinite baffle speaker or a 3-way with extremely linear midrange and high-frequency drivers and whose woofer has such high voice coil inductance that its roll-off happens to compensate nicely for baffle step. But otherwise, what trio of drivers in a box measures so flat that textbook XO filters at fixed frequencies get them to anywhere near the kind of performance that you'd be hoping for if you're willing to outlay nearly $2k on just the crossover?
Yes, the competition up to $2000.00 is pretty good. Including parametric EQ and infinitely adjustable crossover points and DSP.
 
D

Deleted member 2944

Guest
Personally, I find it hard to imagine a use case for this device, aside perhaps from an infinite baffle speaker or a 3-way with extremely linear midrange and high-frequency drivers and whose woofer has such high voice coil inductance that its roll-off happens to compensate nicely for baffle step. But otherwise, what trio of drivers in a box measures so flat that textbook XO filters at fixed frequencies get them to anywhere near the kind of performance that you'd be hoping for if you're willing to outlay nearly $2k on just the crossover?
This 'particular' unit is limited in usefulness, but it could maybe be used in a "hybrid" configuration with the active crossover doing the primary filtering job and some high-level passive equalization shaping the response of the individual driver units.

The XM-44 does have some utility to create equalization curves of various types with module change out. But even then, it's getting really fiddly for the average user and maybe another approach would be preferable.

As I mentioned earlier on, I think analog units like this would appeal to users who refuse to take the DSP fork in the road. :)

Dave.
 

andreasmaaan

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Messages
6,652
Likes
9,399
As I mentioned earlier on, I think analog units like this would appeal to users who refuse to take the DSP fork in the road. :)

It's exactly this mentality that leads to products like this one ;)
 
D

Deleted member 2944

Guest
It's exactly this mentality that leads to products like this one ;)
Well, in this case, Phil Marchand has been building active crossovers (generally like this one) since well before DSP units.
In some ways, he's been way ahead of the curve in the home audio product business. Unlike the typical "high-end" audio manufacturers who have been shooting themselves in the foot and well behind the pro-audio world and other portions of the industry.

Dave.
 

andreasmaaan

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Messages
6,652
Likes
9,399
Well, in this case, Phil Marchand has been building active crossovers (generally like this one) since well before DSP units.
In some ways, he's been way ahead of the curve in the home audio product business. Unlike the typical "high-end" audio manufacturers who have been shooting themselves in the foot and well behind the pro-audio world and other portions of the industry.

Dave.

Fair enough :) I didn't mean to seem disrespectful if Marchand. But really, this product is obsolete IMHO.
 

maverickronin

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 19, 2018
Messages
2,527
Likes
3,308
Location
Midwest, USA
D

Deleted member 2944

Guest
Geejuz. Another inane back and forth in a thread on ASR.

Carry on.

Dave.
 

psemeraro

Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
29
Likes
37
Location
Orlando, FL
Thanks for this!! Have always wondered about those units. Used and rebuilt lots of classic x-overs, particularly the Rane and Ashly units. Learned to DSP with the BSS Omnidrives at Universal Studios and Disney venues and eventually spent lots of time with the EAW 8800 unit. If you've been to a concert or stadium in the last 10 years you've probably heard the 8800 more than you realize. I now use the Venu360 as a swiss knife in my personal projects. Here is info on the EAW unit https://www.eaw.com/products/ux8800/ *I'm not affiliated with any of the brands and have nothing to sell*
 

DrTebi

Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2018
Messages
29
Likes
22
One of the most praised active crossovers of the "golden era of HiFi" was the Sony TA-D88 and Sony TA-D900 (pretty much identical). These have exchangeable frequency modules, which makes them quite versatile. All filters are 24dB, which was unusual for the time. They look and feel quite sexy too.

ta-d88-0-sony.jpg


More info on these here: http://www.thevintageknob.org/sony-TA-D88B.html

These also don't require software updates, reboots, touch devices to operate... and start-up time is next to nothing :)
 

OCD HiFi Guy

Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2019
Messages
25
Likes
9
Ive had many Marchand crossovers and one thing for sure is they all work great in my rig and sound phenomenal. I even commissioned a build of a 4 way XM44 that is fully differential and 100% discrete with no Opamps, all Wima caps and Milspec Dale Vishay resistors with silver plated copper in PTFE wiring... The only way as far as Im concerned to DSP is to do it all before the DAC. Although I am one of those silly audiophiles that makes no room for half measures such as DSP after the DAC .Thats right up there with connecting your subwoofers to the main channel amp outputs . lol . I have a Behringer that I fully modified to a whole new high falootin output board, and I still use it as a tool to find my points and slopes then I solder up my own Marchand modules and make it happen in the Analog domain as it sounds better then the Behringer for sure. And the 44 is infinitely adjustable for slope point, filter type, attentuation, shelf filters, you name it . Its the most versatile x over piece Ive ever seen. So I wouldnt knock Phil Marchand product unless youve got something that beats it .. I dont even think Nelsons crossover is as versatile or tweakable and that one is extremely adjustable..
 
D

Deleted member 2944

Guest
As far as analog crossovers go, it's very versatile. But it's way, way, way, way, way, short of the versatility DSP-based gadgets provide.
In the audiophile orbit/context, non-analog products tend to be looked down upon by some, so this particular crossover fits the pocket in the market.

It's unfortunate that Amir wasn't able to characterize the performance of this unit correctly, but that's not really an issue for Marchand, who has a large following. The owner of this unit didn't seem interested in having somebody else (me) test the unit. Oh well.

Dave.
 

Trdat

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 6, 2019
Messages
967
Likes
396
Location
Yerevan "Sydney Born"
As far as analog crossovers go, it's very versatile. But it's way, way, way, way, way, short of the versatility DSP-based gadgets provide.
In the audiophile orbit/context, non-analog products tend to be looked down upon by some, so this particular crossover fits the pocket in the market.

It's unfortunate that Amir wasn't able to characterize the performance of this unit correctly, but that's not really an issue for Marchand, who has a large following. The owner of this unit didn't seem interested in having somebody else (me) test the unit. Oh well.

Dave.

I don't know what there is to characterize when your loosing valuable SINAD using something that needs to be transparent. I got the Marchand XM66, I love it and think its a vital part of integrating subs and I will use it for a PA style speaker crossover next making the most of its digital crossover frequency choice.

After comparing it to the DBX234xl, of course I can hear and easily tell it outperforms it but measurements are measurements. No doubt that it is a important part in the chain, especially when using software DSP, you need an analog crossover.

But its disappointing that it lacks solid engineering and if he is not keen to improve it sprouts skepticism in his products as a whole. Its funny, there is such a limited amount of analog crossovers to be found and if he did participate in the forum business might potentially improve even more than what his happy with.
 

Qwin

Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2020
Messages
25
Likes
28
Location
Durham UK
Here is an alternative but relevant point of view on this Marchand analogue active crossover, for anyone considering going active with DSP.

One thing I can say about the analogue active approach, it knocks spots off either miniDSP 4x10HD or Hypex DLCP DSP systems, if you use a turntable/phono stage. I've tried both these DSP set ups and the analogue inputs ADC on both is just not good enough, like an after thought, actually more like a joke they are so bad. Turns a decent vinyl set up into entry level sound quality, in one easy to program step. The Hypex (no longer available) handles analogue better than miniDSP but that's not saying much. Both sounded good, very good in fact, with digital sources, but they are not for those that have analogue I'm afraid, a seriously large backward step if you try.

I now use a Marchand XM44EMB for LP bass and passive filters for mid/twt, this allows a low powered valve amp for mid/twt and a beefy class D for Bass. It may not be for everyone, but this variant of the Marchand unit works for me, when DSP didn't. I use a Rod Elliott designed PSU for my Marchand board and populate the plug in crossover modules with Polystyrene caps and Takman metal film resistors, both rated at 1% but I grade them further to +/- 0.1%. The Marchands basic technology is DIY friendly for upgrading components, where DSP units tend not to be, unless you are an EE or very accomplished amateur.

No Audible background noise close up to the speaker, when the Marchand is in circuit, which is more than could be said for the miniDSP.
There doesn't seem to be any negative impact on the performance of my vinyl set up, or my Okto DAC8 Streamer for that matter.

So different strokes for different folks I guess, but worth mentioning. :)
 

birkbott

Active Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2019
Messages
115
Likes
62
This is very disappointing. I had their XM66 (variable frequency) unit on my short list but at $1200 I can’t pay that much for this kind of performance.

I have a DriveRack PA2 on order instead.
 

Qwin

Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2020
Messages
25
Likes
28
Location
Durham UK
This is very disappointing. I had their XM66 (variable frequency) unit on my short list but at $1200 I can’t pay that much for this kind of performance.

I have a DriveRack PA2 on order instead.
The XM66 wasn't reviewed.
I hope you haven't got any analogue sources, cheap DSP units only put token ADC circuits on their inputs. I've yet to hear one that sounded even close to being good. You need to spend as much, if not more on an ADC as a good DAC.
The Burl Audio B2 Bomber ADC is in a different league, but at around £2.5k you would expect it to be.
If you are all digital the DriveRack might float your boat, just don't expect much from the line level inputs. :)
 

birkbott

Active Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2019
Messages
115
Likes
62
The XM66 wasn't reviewed.
I hope you haven't got any analogue sources, cheap DSP units only put token ADC circuits on their inputs. I've yet to hear one that sounded even close to being good. You need to spend as much, if not more on an ADC as a good DAC.
The Burl Audio B2 Bomber ADC is in a different league, but at around £2.5k you would expect it to be.
If you are all digital the DriveRack might float your boat, just don't expect much from the line level inputs. :)
It only has analog (XLR) inputs. Measures pretty well, should be transparent but we’ll see.

 

Qwin

Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2020
Messages
25
Likes
28
Location
Durham UK
Yeh, but the analogue inputs are converted to a digital signal by going through the internal ADC as the DSP for the XO filters etc needs a digital signal. after digital processing it is converted back to analogue using the internal DAC, before exiting via the High/Med/Low frequency analogue outputs.
Another issue with DSP is MQA, lets hope that dies a death, because as far as I'm aware, you can't use DSP with MQA files.
The whole purpose of MQA is to stop piracy and to maintain global distribution rights. So you can't play a tune bought in say the USA on a machine in Europe etc. Each zone has its own encryption/key, but this encryption locks the music information away and stops any post processing like copying or digital manipulation such as DSP XO filters from working.
If what I've said is correct, a global take up of MQA would render all DSP devices obsolete.

I have no interest in MQA so I've only looked at it briefly, I would appreciate it if someone knowledgeable could confirm that DSP won't work on MQA files. I'm sure this information would be of interest to lots of folks.
 
Top Bottom