Marantz PM8006 & SR6013 Setup – Troubles with Power Amp Direct Mode and Remote Conflicts

[Punisa]

Hello everyone,

I'm facing a bit of a challenging situation and could use some advice.

Setup Background:
For several years, I've been using a Marantz SR6013 AVR, connected to my TV, PC, DVD, etc., in a surround sound setup with 2 front speakers, 1 center, 2 surrounds, and a subwoofer. For the front speakers, I use a Yamaha A-S1000 amp via the pre-outs on the SR6013, connecting to the Yamaha's "main in." This setup has been working flawlessly, letting me switch smoothly between surround sound for movies and pure stereo for music, thanks to my Harmony remote hub and Alexa integration.

Issue with the Yamaha A-S1000:
Recently, my Yamaha started acting up: the input selector switches randomly. I tried cleaning and resetting it, but no luck. It clearly needs a professional repair, which I’m planning to do. Meanwhile, I thought I’d explore a new amp to see if I preferred the sound, so I picked up a Marantz PM8006, hoping it would have the same versatility and input options as the Yamaha.

Discovering the PM8006’s Limitations:
The PM8006 sounds fantastic—rich and warm, exactly what I was looking for. However, two major issues have come up that are making integration difficult:

1. Power Amp Direct Mode Switching: Unlike the Yamaha, which allowed me to change to “main in” like any other source with a remote, the PM8006 requires holding down a button on the amp itself for three seconds to switch to “Power Amp Direct” mode. This means I can’t seamlessly switch between “Power Amp Direct” and my other sources (CD, tape deck, turntable, and Roon streamer) with the remote, which disrupts the usability of my setup. I found a forum post where someone mentioned getting the PM8006 to switch modes with a Harmony remote, but they didn’t explain how, and I haven’t found a solution.
2. Remote Conflicts with SR6013: All my remotes—the Harmony, the PM8006 remote, and the SR6013 remote—affect both devices. This means that every time I change a setting on one, it unintentionally changes the other, making it impossible to manage volume or inputs without affecting both units.

Possible Solutions and Concerns:
I realize this might sound like a “first-world problem,” but I’m hoping for some understanding and ideas:

• Switching PM8006 Modes Remotely: If anyone has managed to get the PM8006 to switch to “Power Amp Direct” via a remote, please share how! This alone would resolve most of my issues.
• Handling Remote Conflicts: One option I thought of is taping over the IR sensor on the SR6013 to avoid conflicts. However, I’d still need to access it sometimes, so manually covering and uncovering the sensor is less than ideal. I also haven’t tried using the “remote in/out” jacks on the PM8006 and SR6013—if anyone knows whether this could help with the dual-command issue, please let me know.

I could just repair the Yamaha and sell the PM8006, but I really love its sound. Manually switching modes on the amp each time I change sources isn’t a practical solution due to the “wife approval factor.”

If anyone has suggestions or workarounds, I’d really appreciate it!

 

[Beave]

Why use a separate integrated amplifier along with your AVR? Why not just use the AVR? Or, if you really want an external amp along with the AVR, why not get an actual external amp and not an integrated amp?

What speakers are you using, and are they particularly difficult loads that necessitate an amplifier other than your AVR?

 

[Punisa]

Why use a separate integrated amplifier along with your AVR? Why not just use the AVR? Or, if you really want an external amp along with the AVR, why not get an actual external amp and not an integrated amp?

What speakers are you using, and are they particularly difficult loads that necessitate an amplifier other than your AVR?

Hi Beave!
Simple really - when listening to stereo music sound is better with an external amp compared to using just SR6013.
For a year or two I used only SR6013, but once I upgraded to an external amp for stereo I noticed a positive difference.
As to why integrated - to have option to connect multiple stereo only sources (currently: CD, tape deck, Roon streamer, turntable).
For front left and right speakers I use Mirage FRx-7.

 

[Beave]

I guessed that you would say that it sounds better with the external amp, but I'm skeptical that this is a real effect and not just the result of improper listening comparison methodology (ie, due to mismatched levels or sighted bias).

To really determine that it sounds better, you would need to compare the two setups with precise matching of levels and with quick, blinded switching between the two. That would be a difficult comparison to do because of the complexity of the setup.

I'm not familiar with the Mirage FRx-7 speakers, but a quick Google search shows me that they are somewhat old (1990s) and inexpensive (I see used pairs now listed online for under $100).

I don't see measurements for them anywhere, which isn't too surprising given their age.

But I can't imagine your Marantz AVR not being able to power them sufficiently.

To me, that says that you are spending way too much money and attention than needed to your amplification and not nearly enough to the speakers. A general suggestion is to spend more on the speakers than on the electronics, as the speakers make by far the biggest difference in sound quality.

 

[polmuaddib]

But I can't imagine your Marantz AVR not being able to power them sufficiently.

I agree and level matched, in Marantz pure direct mode or similar, they would sound the same.

But OP wants to listen the way he wants to and we are not helping with suggestions that external amp is superfluous.

So, what you need, and have done so, is to find the amp or preamp with home theater bypass function as it is called. Indeed MArantz PM8006 has that function, but it's setup in a way that you can't easily change ti via remote. I suspect that they wanted to implement a certainty in selecting direct amp mode, so you wouldn't accidentally change it and thus damage your gear.
I don't think you will find other way of selecting that on PM8006, so either live with it or sell it and buy other ht bypass capable amp. There is a list online of all the amps and preamps with that function.
Also, do your research before purchasing.

 

[Punisa]

I guessed that you would say that it sounds better with the external amp, but I'm skeptical that this is a real effect and not just the result of improper listening comparison methodology (ie, due to mismatched levels or sighted bias).

To really determine that it sounds better, you would need to compare the two setups with precise matching of levels and with quick, blinded switching between the two. That would be a difficult comparison to do because of the complexity of the setup.

I'm not familiar with the Mirage FRx-7 speakers, but a quick Google search shows me that they are somewhat old (1990s) and inexpensive (I see used pairs now listed online for under $100).

I don't see measurements for them anywhere, which isn't too surprising given their age.

But I can't imagine your Marantz AVR not being able to power them sufficiently.

To me, that says that you are spending way too much money and attention than needed to your amplification and not nearly enough to the speakers. A general suggestion is to spend more on the speakers than on the electronics, as the speakers make by far the biggest difference in sound quality.

I am aware that the first result on Google is someone show scored Mirage FRx-7 for a hundred bucks on FB Marketplace, good for him
They go for around 300-400 USD these days (hifishark search). You can find some specs here.
I am indeed aware that it's smart to upgrade speakers first, but since I really like the sound of these I didn't bother yet.
It's not that Marantz SR6013 can't drive them, indeed it can, but at least in my case (and in my room) the results are not so great.

 

[Punisa]

I agree and level matched, in Marantz pure direct mode or similar, they would sound the same.

But OP wants to listen the way he wants to and we are not helping with suggestions that external amp is superfluous.

So, what you need, and have done so, is to find the amp or preamp with home theater bypass function as it is called. Indeed MArantz PM8006 has that function, but it's setup in a way that you can't easily change ti via remote. I suspect that they wanted to implement a certainty in selecting direct amp mode, so you wouldn't accidentally change it and thus damage your gear.
I don't think you will find other way of selecting that on PM8006, so either live with it or sell it and buy other ht bypass capable amp. There is a list online of all the amps and preamps with that function.
Also, do your research before purchasing.

Agreed on all your points. I do believe that Marantz actually wanted to avoid accidental messing with options while in "direct amp" mode. But it makes me think there should be a workaround. As mentioned earlier, I found a guy who claims he did it.

Here are his posts from 2018: https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/183778/avr-and-integrated-amp-use-same-remote-codes

He owns PM-14S1, but it's the same system (hold button on unit for 3 seconds to switch to direct amp in).

He wrote: "I've discovered the ability to switch the amp between Power Amp Direct mode and normal integrated mode with the Harmony remote. Marantz said this could not be done, and their remote won't do it!"

Now, isn't this interesting and worth investigating? I bet there are people out there who would love to find a solution for this!
I tried various things with my Harmony hub, but no idea how he made it work. Harmony has the option to "learn" new commands, but it works in a way that you point a remote to it and teach it by pressing the command. No clue how to do it in this case. I don't think it can register me pressing the button on the actual unit since it doesn not emit signal.

 

[Punisa]

Guys, I figured it out!

I managed to make my PM8006 switch to Power Amp Direct mode via remote!

Here's the process—you’ll need a Harmony hub and remote (though other Harmony devices may work too; I tested on an older Harmony 525, and it also works).

When I discovered that Marantz devices share IR codes, here’s the workaround I found: instead of adding your Marantz PM8006 (or any similar model that requires holding a button for 3 seconds to switch to Power Amp Direct) to your Harmony device list, add it as the Marantz model PM-10. Why? Because by selecting this advanced PM-10, you get access to two useful commands: “DirectInOn” and “DirectInOff.” This lets you switch to Power Amp Direct mode instantly with no need to hold down the button!

For the second issue, where both my SR6013 and PM8006 were receiving the same commands, the solution was also straightforward. The Harmony hub has two mini IR blasters connected to ports on its back. In the Harmony hub settings, go to “Hub Assignments” and assign each device to a different IR mini blaster (e.g., set one device to mini blaster port 1 and the other to mini blaster port 2). Then, simply position each mini blaster so it only reaches the intended device. If it doesn’t work right away, try unplugging the Harmony hub and reconnecting it.

Hopefully, this helps anyone facing a similar situation!