• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Marantz Model 30

Rizzle

Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2020
Messages
82
Likes
117
Just saw this new amplifier from Marantz, looks absolutely amazing and then I read it was based on the Hypex NC500.

TaG7EaLT2hV2cwgPW8gnaR.jpeg


https://www.stereonet.co.uk/news/marantz-model-30-and-sacd-30n-unveiled
https://www.us.marantz.com/en-us/30-series

Really curious to see how this would measure.
 

GXAlan

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 15, 2020
Messages
3,868
Likes
5,954
Looks nice. The white one is definitely looks like a "lifestyle" product. [but what about the speakers and speaker cable?]

But only 107 dB SNR?
$2500 is also a bit pricey in my opinion without integrated HEOS/DAC.

The SACD 30 specifications match the SA-KI
112 dB SNR and 109dB Dynamic Range in SACD mode (presumably DAC mode also)

But that's not as good as
Denon DCD-SX1
122 dB and 118 dB

or even the DCD-1600NE
117dB and 112dB

And the Denon's have AL32 Processing Plus.

1598963945798.png
 

anmpr1

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 11, 2018
Messages
3,722
Likes
6,406
From a user standpoint, the idea of supporting phono demands at the minimum a subsonic filter and a mono switch. When I see high priced gear that is supposed to support phono playback without those, I know that the thinking behind the product is not complete.

To it's credit it does feature a balance control and tone controls. So it is halfway there.
 

JeffS7444

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 21, 2019
Messages
2,347
Likes
3,508
Looks good, omission of cloud services makes sense if they actually do expect people to keep these in service for many years: Pretty sure than an analog integrated amplifier will be usable a generation hence, Alexa or Heos Music not so much.
 

asruser2020

Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2020
Messages
56
Likes
43
Looks nice. The white one is definitely looks like a "lifestyle" product.

That color is not white. Marantz has been using a color called "Champagne" in their components for many years. Interestingly, for these new units, they're calling it "silver gold".
 

asruser2020

Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2020
Messages
56
Likes
43
For those of you unfamiliar with Marantz, in their high-end lines the integrated amps are all analog. The matching CD player in the line will have all the digital components, including the DAC with digital inputs (e.g. USB-B, toslink, etc.).
 

dualazmak

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
2,820
Likes
2,950
Location
Ichihara City, Chiba Prefecture, Japan
Looks good, but my disappointment is no XLR balance input available.
 

Abe_W

Active Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2019
Messages
182
Likes
68
Location
United States
Hmmm, made in Japan ( that Japanese aptitude and zen concentration went into making this??),,,,, looks like the only Class D amp out there worth checking out at the moment....I may actually step off my Class A high throne for a minute and interview this class D peasant from Marantz...give it a fair shot!
 

MakeMineVinyl

Major Contributor
Joined
Jun 5, 2020
Messages
3,558
Likes
5,871
Location
Santa Fe, NM
Am I the only one who thinks that the styling is ugly and contrived?
 

MakeMineVinyl

Major Contributor
Joined
Jun 5, 2020
Messages
3,558
Likes
5,871
Location
Santa Fe, NM
It looks like they're channeling the styling of this Mytek component which I think looks like reptile skin.

IMG_6602_EDITED_smaller.jpg
 

voodooless

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 16, 2020
Messages
10,227
Likes
17,806
Location
Netherlands
And the Denon's have AL32 Processing Plus.

That’s just word word salat.. you can’t even find what it actually is supposed to do..

In any case, the HDAM circuits will probably fuck up the good objective performance as they always do.
 

GXAlan

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 15, 2020
Messages
3,868
Likes
5,954
That’s just word word salad.. you can’t even find what it actually is supposed to do..

I have sent @amirm an old Denon ALPHA processor which will let him enable and disable the feature as well as Denon's old test tracks used to demonstrate the feature. This will let him take objective measurements but based upon the backlog, it may be Nov or Dec before he can test the claims and compare it to modern DACs. It's a lot of work for him.

ALPHA looks at the audio data in blocks and supposedly was tuned using Nippon Columbia’s own classical music recordings in the past. ALPHA is supposed to make educated guesses about

1) roll off filter. It’s similar to the old PMD100. We have fast roll off, slow roll off, etc. Here the Alpha processor should pass transients when appropriate to prevent pre and post ringing. Most slow roll-off filters have consequences of Figure 6 and Most fast filters have consequences of Figure 2. ALPHA is supposed to magically do what's needed based upon the music, so that you get the best of all worlds.

2) Adaptive Line Pattern Harmonized Algorithm is a resampling algorithm that is supposed to work magic like Figure 7 through 10.

3) Although they demonstrate it with sine waves and oversampling/upsampling may generate the same performance, Denon had such confidence in ALPHA on real-world music in the 90's that they provided Track #13 on their test CD. This is normal classical music which is recorded at -50dB. (That's because real-world classical music dynamic range is around that level).

The thought is that with 16-bit dynamic range, the quiet passages were highly sensitive to DAC performance and ALPHA enhances this. By moving most of the music to this level, you can now compare the ALPHA processor against conventional DACs for an entire 4 minute music track.

4) The original ALPHA only worked for 16/44. AL32 Processing Plus is supposed to be enable these algorithms to 32-bit/192 kHz and the "Plus" is supposed to be better upsampling algorithm than the non-Plus. Since it's called AL32 instead of ALPHA32, there's no guarantee that today's receivers actually do the same types of calculations that the original ALPHA processing did. The old ALPHA processor had a physical chip that was the digital filter paired with a PCM-1702 or similar chip. Denon's AVRs claiming AL32 say that calculations are done with the DSP, but the DAC chips really aren't designed for external digital filters. No AVR has the "Plus" monicker, so it's also possible that the AL32 in AVRs and AL32 in hifi gear is dramatically different in implementation.


1599085737973.png



The questions that remain
a) Can Amir reproduce these showcase waveforms with ALPHA processing?
b) How do modern DACs from ESS and AKM handle these test tracks? Do all modern DACs have the same results? Again, this is only for 16/44.
c) Is any of this audible to his golden ears or measurable on real-world music beyond their test tracks?
 

voodooless

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 16, 2020
Messages
10,227
Likes
17,806
Location
Netherlands
I have sent @amirm an old Denon ALPHA processor which will let him enable and disable the feature as well as Denon's old test tracks used to demonstrate the feature. This will let him take objective measurements but based upon the backlog, it may be Nov or Dec before he can test the claims and compare it to modern DACs. It's a lot of work for him.

While interesting, it really only tells you how that singe device works. There is no guarantee that the latest versions do the same.. or even anything at al..

ALPHA looks at the audio data in blocks and supposedly was tuned using Nippon Columbia’s own classical music recordings in the past. ALPHA is supposed to make educated guesses about

...

c) Is any of this audible to his golden ears or measurable on real-world music beyond their test tracks?

I’ve found that kind of info before.. Sorry, this just more word salad.. showing sine waves with steps.. it might have worked in the 90’s... nowadays that’s just humbug.
 

restorer-john

Grand Contributor
Joined
Mar 1, 2018
Messages
12,580
Likes
38,281
Location
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
Am I the only one who thinks that the styling is ugly and contrived?

I think the products will look better in the flesh. Marantz generally don't screw up styling.

PS The hipster video ad for it is just garbage.
 

dougi

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
May 31, 2020
Messages
845
Likes
763
Location
ACT, Australia
The text at the link on the US site seems to have some errors. It describes the phono MM - MC low/med/high switch as an impedance switch. Maybe, but more likely a combination of gain with an appropriate MM vs MC load impedance.

More unfortunately it does not seem confident in itself, describing itself as a piece of sh*t with a "dumping factor - 500"
 
  • Like
Reactions: JRS

dougi

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
May 31, 2020
Messages
845
Likes
763
Location
ACT, Australia
Plus how do they only rate it as 100W/ch with a Hypex NC500/SMPS600?
 

dougi

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
May 31, 2020
Messages
845
Likes
763
Location
ACT, Australia
Plus how do they only rate it as 100W/ch with a Hypex NC500/SMPS600?
I'll answer my own question and suggest they are using the Hypex continuous power figure.
 
Top Bottom