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Marantz Cinema 50 installed

bhouseski

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Hi, recently received my Cinema 50, and have spent some time setting up. I am having an issue with bass. I have two subs installed, and when I try the test tone, I barely have any audible sound. This is with both subs set to max volume, and the AVR volume at 3/4. Interesting though, when I do an Audisey tuning, the bass volume seems more normal, in that I have to decrease the volume on each sub to what it was before I got the cinema 50. But once I finish and go back to the test tone, it he sub volume is again extremely low in volume.

Any thoughts?
 

shuvadeep

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Replaced the Cinema50 with the SR8015. Audio sounds a lot better. Wider and better sound stage. Bass is tigher and more defined.
 

joeliu2003

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Hi, recently received my Cinema 50, and have spent some time setting up. I am having an issue with bass. I have two subs installed, and when I try the test tone, I barely have any audible sound. This is with both subs set to max volume, and the AVR volume at 3/4. Interesting though, when I do an Audisey tuning, the bass volume seems more normal, in that I have to decrease the volume on each sub to what it was before I got the cinema 50. But once I finish and go back to the test tone, it he sub volume is again extremely low in volume.

Any thoughts?
I noticed this as well - I think it’s a software bug in the “test tone” functionality. I just tuned using Audessey and left it alone.

FYI - there is an Audessey app for iOS that provides more info and tuning options that you can use in conjunction with your AVR. It’s $40 well spent in my books.
 

slacki

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Replaced the Cinema50 with the SR8015. Audio sounds a lot better. Wider and better sound stage. Bass is tigher and more defined.
did you do a blind-test or is this with knowing which one is playing?
 

techsamurai

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Replaced the Cinema50 with the SR8015. Audio sounds a lot better. Wider and better sound stage. Bass is tigher and more defined.

That's my problem - I own an old 8000 series (8002) and I'm not sure how the Cinema 50 and 40 will sound besides the fact that they are obscenely overpriced. The 8002 was used as a reference and was obviously the reference for the 8012 and 8015 which utilize the same toroidal power supply.
 

agalluppi3

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I got the Cinema 50 installed and running last night. Initial impressions are good. I haven't dived too far yet beyond initial setup and listening at default settings though. Most important thing, sound quality seems great. I didn't pack the Anthem MRX 740 8K yet, so I had an opportunity to put the two receivers side by side and swap back and forth. I kept all EQ and positional settings default on both of them and just swapped my fronts back and forth manually (don't have a speaker switch). It was difficult to tell differences, but I thought the Cinema 50 sounded at least as good as the MRX 740 8K. I used three test songs that I knew fairly well and swapped back and forth at least five times. If anything, I felt like the Cinema 50 had a bit more clarity. Hard to say without of course getting into minutia of settings and such to try and even everything between the two.
I did run some atmos content and it sounded great. Very clear separation and detail, and objects sweeping between channels sounded natural. So processing seems accurate for my limited point of reference.
One thing that doesn't make sense to me about the Cinema 50. Why are there 11 speaker outputs when there's only 9 channels of amplification? I incorrectly assumed I'd be able to run a 7.2.4 system out of the box, but in fact I still need an external stereo power amp in order to do that.
Unit look and feel is nice. Front plate is plastic and remote is plastic, but everything still feels good. I didn't hear any fan noise yet. The relays inside make a rather loud clunk though, maybe that's a good thing to mean they're hefty?
Overall, Cinema 50 seems better deal than the MRX 740 8K. More channels, although slightly less power. $600 cheaper. Better user experience. Comparable sound quality, maybe a bit better.
Were you able to get the bass to sound better watching movies. I feel that the 50 sounds great for music but lacks a little in bass watching movies. To me it is just a very mild rumble and I'm using ml dynamos Any tips? I used the app to calibrate but did not change any bass frequencies.
 

techsamurai

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Were you able to get the bass to sound better watching movies. I feel that the 50 sounds great for music but lacks a little in bass watching movies. To me it is just a very mild rumble and I'm using ml dynamos Any tips? I used the app to calibrate but did not change any bass frequencies.

When you say it's lacking bass, are you saying your speakers themselves aren't putting out bass or the sub isn't?
 
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Replaced the Cinema50 with the SR8015. Audio sounds a lot better. Wider and better sound stage. Bass is tigher and more defined.
I guess what I don't get about statements like this is we are comparing what all are calling an overpriced 2500$ AVR, to a 4000$ AVR when new and are surprised when the cheaper one doesn't "sound" as good. I just went from an X2300 to the Cinema 50. Does it sound better, I'm not sure. But I didn't upgrade for that. I needed two more channels of internal amplification and got a good deal on the 50.
 

slacki

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i also noticed that behaviour of audyssey reducing bass, my subs had -10db, so i moved them to 0db. now its fine. enough rumble, all day long ;)
thats a common wierd behaviour of audyssey, not sure why it does that. maybe it recognized room modes and tries to fix it with reducing bass to zero.
 

techsamurai

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I guess what I don't get about statements like this is we are comparing what all are calling an overpriced 2500$ AVR, to a 4000$ AVR when new and are surprised when the cheaper one doesn't "sound" as good. I just went from an X2300 to the Cinema 50. Does it sound better, I'm not sure. But I didn't upgrade for that. I needed two more channels of internal amplification and got a good deal on the 50.

Yeah but the pricing is kind of like Marantz's stock exchange. The 8015 started at $3,199 and jumped to $3,700 and $4,000 with changes that adversely affected performance.

Sure the Cinema 50 started at $2,500 but ultimately could end up in 1-2 years as a $4,000 AVR (with the DIRAC license) especially since it has a lot of plastic and Marantz charges more for plastic;-)

The Cinema 50 is technically a 6000 series but now priced as a 7000 series - so it is a premium AVR and should deliver 7000 series performance and be very close to the 8000 series. They should be indiscernible except in very few cases.
 

slacki

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Yeah but the pricing is kind of like Marantz's stock exchange.
Dont forget covid and other problems like bad supply chains that affect the price. Most things are more expensive now than they were 2 years ago, and 10% is pretty normal. My ebike (waiting for it now for nearly a year... hope it arrives soon) was first sold for about 4500, now its 5300. This does not only affect Marantz, it affects nearly everything.
 

ban25

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Were you able to get the bass to sound better watching movies. I feel that the 50 sounds great for music but lacks a little in bass watching movies. To me it is just a very mild rumble and I'm using ml dynamos Any tips? I used the app to calibrate but did not change any bass frequencies.
There are a few things worth checking.

1) If you've used Audyssey room correction, make sure Dynamic EQ is enabled and consider buying the $20 mobile app so you can remove the Mid-Range Correction (MRC) curve that Audyssey adds by default, as well as increase the bass below 120 hz since Audyssey tends to neuter that unnecessarily.

2) Make sure all of your speakers are set to 'Small' under Setup -> Speakers -Manual Setup -> Speaker Config. If they are set to 'Large', which Audyssey will sometimes set, and your Subwoofer Mode is set to the default of 'LFE' under Setup -> Speakers -Manual Setup -> Bass, then no output will be sent to your subwoofer at all.
 

techsamurai

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Dont forget covid and other problems like bad supply chains that affect the price. Most things are more expensive now than they were 2 years ago, and 10% is pretty normal. My ebike (waiting for it now for nearly a year... hope it arrives soon) was first sold for about 4500, now its 5300. This does not only affect Marantz, it affects nearly everything.
Has your income gone up by 20-25% over the past 2 years? You can't just raise prices cause you feel like it.

Sony raised the price of the PS5 by 10% (unprecedented) but quite unwarranted given the fact that $500 are now $900+ dollars in yen.

Have TV prices gone up? Nope.

Have PC prices gone up? Nope.

What happened with Marantz was the fact that they pulled a Nvidia on us where they renamed the models and went backwards in an effort to make us believe that a 6000 should cost as much as a 7000. Nvidia recently tried to market the 4070Ti as a 4080 and everyone explained to them that we're not idiots. The problem is that Marantz has done that 3 times in a row and also really offers the least for the American market as we're 2nd class citizens and appear to be idiots in their eyes. For 20 years, they never offered the gold or silver finishes in the US for their AV receivers despite the fact that they were as expensive or more expensive here.

I asked Marantz why they don't offer the better finishes in the States and their response was - "No one wants them" and I replied "Clearly I do and you just ignore me and everyone else!"

Correction: the PS5 increased everywhere but the US due to the higher value of dollars converted to yen.
 
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Yeah but the pricing is kind of like Marantz's stock exchange. The 8015 started at $3,199 and jumped to $3,700 and $4,000 with changes that adversely affected performance.

Sure the Cinema 50 started at $2,500 but ultimately could end up in 1-2 years as a $4,000 AVR (with the DIRAC license) especially since it has a lot of plastic and Marantz charges more for plastic;-)

The Cinema 50 is technically a 6000 series but now priced as a 7000 series - so it is a premium AVR and should deliver 7000 series performance and be very close to the 8000 series. They should be indiscernible except in very few cases.
If the 50 is technically a 6000 series, it should deliver 6000 series performance regardless of price. Price does not make it perform better.
 

techsamurai

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If the 50 is technically a 6000 series, it should deliver 6000 series performance regardless of price. Price does not make it perform better.
Well, if I renamed the Denon Series and the 3800h currently retailing for $1,800 became the Denon 50 and it was priced at $2,500 should it deliver 3800h performance or 4800h performance ($2,500)?

As a consumer, I'd like to see a bit of improvement for the extra $800 other than the addition of plastic to the fascia and the convenient excuse of inflation that seems to affect Marantz disproportionately to everyone else.
 

techsamurai

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There are a few things worth checking.

1) If you've used Audyssey room correction, make sure Dynamic EQ is enabled and consider buying the $20 mobile app so you can remove the Mid-Range Correction (MRC) curve that Audyssey adds by default, as well as increase the bass below 120 hz since Audyssey tends to neuter that unnecessarily.

2) Make sure all of your speakers are set to 'Small' under Setup -> Speakers -Manual Setup -> Speaker Config. If they are set to 'Large', which Audyssey will sometimes set, and your Subwoofer Mode is set to the default of 'LFE' under Setup -> Speakers -Manual Setup -> Bass, then no output will be sent to your subwoofer at all.

What about just using volume and increasing the volume of the sub? I bumped my Audyssey settings (older version) by 10db in my SVS app. I go with an extra 5db for music.
 
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Well, if I renamed the Denon Series and the 3800h currently retailing for $1,800 became the Denon 50 and it was priced at $2,500 should it deliver 3800h performance or 4800h performance ($2,500)?

As a consumer, I'd like to see a bit of improvement for the extra $800 other than the addition of plastic to the fascia and the convenient excuse of inflation that seems to affect Marantz disproportionately to everyone else.
As a consumer I agree. I want the most for my money. But while I disagree with their price increases, it doesn't mean I think that just because it's more expensive then previous years, the price alone should put it in a higher performing class
 

slacki

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Has your income gone up by 20-25% over the past 2 years?
Yes.

You can't just raise prices cause you feel like it.
You can, if you think the people will still buy it. Take a look at apple. Or other "Hifi"-components like unicornhaircables that cost around 1000$ per meter.

Have TV prices gone up? Nope.
Have PC prices gone up? Nope.
I dont know where you live, but where i live TV and PC prices have risen.
You even gave the example of NVIDIA, so you should know that prices have risen. And of course, there are some bad sheeps that go higher than they should to get more profit out of the crisis. But 10% is absolutely normal. I bought my SR7011 back in the days for about 1500EUR, if i would buy the same today i would have to pay about 1000EUR for a 7 year old device. I paid 1700 for the Cinema 50. I dont know what the SR6011 would have cost back in the days (guess about 1300), but for me this feels perfectly fine. I still think the Cinema 50 is a bit overpriced, but not that much. But i would not pay 2500 EUR for the Cinema 40, this is really overpriced (imo). But hey, when i would be Marantz and see people go for it, why not ;) I dont want to white wash/excuse Marantz, but some people seem to have nothing left to do than flaming them... dunno. Imo the only thing that s*cks hard with Marantz is their support.
 

peng

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What about just using volume and increasing the volume of the sub? I bumped my Audyssey settings (older version) by 10db in my SVS app. I go with an extra 5db for music.

That's what I would do, but I would increase the volume to the red zone when running Audyssey and ignore the too loud message. That way, Audyssey would set the level trim for the sub to the -5 dB to -10 dB range. That way you can just bump up the trim level of the subs back to say -3, or 0 dB. If you bump up the sub volume after Audyssey you can get the same effects obviously. I prefer the other way because it is easier to just grab to remote whenever I want to bump things up, leaving the physical vol know on the sub alone.
 

techsamurai

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I paid 1700 for the Cinema 50.
Why would you pay 1,700 Euro for the Cinema 50 when it costs 2,500 dollars in the US?

I agree 100%, the Cinema 50 is a 1,700 Euro and $1,700 dollar AVR. At $1,700 it's actually a pretty good AVR and of course not on par with the 8015.

Someone was telling me recently how they purchased the 7015 new in Europe for $1,500 while it goes for $3,000 in the States. It's crazy. You can get 2 7015s in Europe for the price of 1 in the States.

To say that Marantz is hating on the US market would be an understatement of the century. By the way, I wish I had a 20-25% income increase. :)
 
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