Marantz CD6007 sounded bad - advice wanted for new cd player

[Leon74]

A while ago I bought the Marantz CD6007 and matching amplifier and to be honest, it sounded *horrible*. I sent it back.
I have an old Akai CD27 and an old Philips Cd player, both from the nineties and both players have a MUCH more transparant, clear, well defined sound. Both hooked up to a Sony STR-DE445 receiver, also from the nineties.
As the Philips cd player warms up the CD's too much and both the Philips and the Akai are getting really old and the dac in the Sony receiver is not that good (I have been using analog out), I am looking for something new and bought the Denon DRA 800H. But now I am in doubt which CD player I should buy. The Denon DCD-900NE or soemthing else. On Amazon I found too many reviews from people that it often fails to read cd's.
I also considered the two audiolab transports, but the cheaper one has a slot (causing scratches on the CD) and the more expensive one with a tray has a color cd screen, and I am afraid that might go bad one day as it is a (color) LCD screen.

I would love to get your advice for a CD player that has a quite neutral, well defined sound. With good bass, midtones and highs. price: up to 550.

 

[Rick63]

FYI - I've had my Audiolab 6000CDT for nearly two years, and it has never scratched a single disc. If it did it wouldn't still be here.

 

[kemmler3D]

a CD player that has a quite neutral, well defined sound. With good bass, midtones and highs. price: up to 550.

Any decent CD player that works properly should fit this definition, especially when you use an external DAC.

I would maybe suggest pretty much any CD player with SPDIF out, up to $200-300 and a nice stand-alone DAC up to $200-300.

As for the CD6007, if it sounded completely and obviously awful, odds are it was broken or there was a faulty connection.

 

[audio_tony]

I just checked the specs of your receiver and with an input sensitivity of 250mV it's possible that the CD player(s) are simply overloading the input.

Bear in mind that the average CD player outputs about 2V rms.

I was unable to determine if this receiver digitise all the analogue inputs as well, however the frequency response would suggest not.

Have you tried connecting the CD player via the digital input instead of using an analogue input?

Sony STR-DE445 specifications:
Inputs (Analog)
5.1CH INPUT, CD,
DVD/LD, MD/TAPE,
TV/SAT, VIDEO,
AUX:
Sensitivity: 250 mV
Impedance: 50 kilohms
S/Na) : 96 dB (A, 250mVb))

a) INPUT SHORT
b) Weighted network, input level

Frequency response
CD, MD/TAPE, DVD/
LD, TV/SAT, VIDEO,
AUX:
10 Hz - 50 kHz + 0.5/–2 dB (with sound field, tone, and bass boost bypassed)

 

[JeremyFife]

I don't like to be negative, but that Denon did not measure well https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/denon-dra-800h-review-stereo-receiver.26743/
It may be better to fix that before you add a CD? Is it still in a return window?

The Denon is stereo in an AVR box - no issue with that - what did you want in terms of features?

Other than that, I agree that a decently made CD (or Blu-Ray) player with digital output should give you everything you need for a fraction of your budget. I'd look at Sony Blu-Ray players and see what you like the look of

 

[Leon74]

Any decent CD player that works properly should fit this definition, especially when you use an external DAC.

I would maybe suggest pretty much any CD player with SPDIF out, up to $200-300 and a nice stand-alone DAC up to $200-300.

As for the CD6007, if it sounded completely and obviously awful, odds are it was broken or there was a faulty connection.

I finally decided to buy the Denon DCD900N. But it probably won't arrive before January 8th. Hope I made a good choice. There is so little choice in CD players nowadays...and every device seems to have a weakness and problems...
The stupid thing is I have two working Philips players in the attic. From the nineties, with a great sound but when I take out a disc after an hour of playing, the disc feels as hot as when you touch someone who has fever.... I don't trust it, does anyone know if this could be really dentrimental to the discs?

 

[JeremyFife]

Nice, the DCD900NE (or is that the same thing?) certainly looked great https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/denon-dcd-900ne-review-cd-player.56587/

 

[Leon74]

I just checked the specs of your receiver and with an input sensitivity of 250mV it's possible that the CD player(s) are simply overloading the input.

Bear in mind that the average CD player outputs about 2V rms.

I was unable to determine if this receiver digitise all the analogue inputs as well, however the frequency response would suggest not.

Have you tried connecting the CD player via the digital input instead of using an analogue input?

Sony STR-DE445 specifications:
Inputs (Analog)
5.1CH INPUT, CD,
DVD/LD, MD/TAPE,
TV/SAT, VIDEO,
AUX:
Sensitivity: 250 mV
Impedance: 50 kilohms
S/Na) : 96 dB (A, 250mVb))

a) INPUT SHORT
b) Weighted network, input level

Frequency response
CD, MD/TAPE, DVD/
LD, TV/SAT, VIDEO,
AUX:
10 Hz - 50 kHz + 0.5/–2 dB (with sound field, tone, and bass boost bypassed)

"A while ago I bought the Marantz CD6007 and *matching* amplifier"

Thank you very much for your help, Tony! Maybe my text was confusing: I listened to the Marantz CD6007 with a Marantz Stereo 70S.
I don't think anything was wrong with the devices. The sound was way too warm, not well defined, with too little detail, not clear, like someone wanted to give the impression of vinyl being played. And well, of course, it could be my taste, but my husband who is a music teacher agreed.

 

[Leon74]

I don't like to be negative, but that Denon did not measure well https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/denon-dra-800h-review-stereo-receiver.26743/
It may be better to fix that before you add a CD? Is it still in a return window?

The Denon is stereo in an AVR box - no issue with that - what did you want in terms of features?

Other than that, I agree that a decently made CD (or Blu-Ray) player with digital output should give you everything you need for a fraction of your budget. I'd look at Sony Blu-Ray players and see what you like the look of

Thank you for pointing that out to me, Jeremy!
Unfortunately Amazon sent it already, but it will go back straight away when it arrives. 585 euros is way too much with such bad test results.

I won't use the device for TV, just for listening audio, so I opted for a stereo. But I should look for an AVR instead: Though the manual calls my old Sony STR-DE445 an FM/AM receiver, it really is an AVR. I guess the word AVR didn't exist yet in the nineties...
Usually I listen with everything "flat" but sometimes when an album was badly recorded, I use a sound mode to enhance the sound. I would miss that with a pure stereo receiver.

If you or anyone else has some suggestions...please!

Oh, I need 100-150 watts per channel for my floor standing speakers.

 

[GXAlan]

The CD player has Marantz HDAMs which are intended to manipulate the sound character. Your Stereo 70s has digital input without HDAMs and a digital filter that should mirror the Cinema 70s

You should compare the CD player running analog versus through a digital connection.

There is a lot of real world benefit of having one remote that controls your CD player and your amplifier, so I wouldn’t recommend changing your CD player.

 

[JeremyFife]

Thank you for pointing that out to me, Jeremy!
Unfortunately Amazon sent it already, but it will go back straight away when it arrives. 585 euros is way too much with such bad test results.

I won't use the device for TV, just for listening audio, so I opted for a stereo. But I should look for an AVR instead: Though the manual calls my old Sony STR-DE445 an FM/AM receiver, it really is an AVR. I guess the word AVR didn't exist yet in the nineties...
Usually I listen with everything "flat" but sometimes when an album was badly recorded, I use a sound mode to enhance the sound. I would miss that with a pure stereo receiver.

If you or anyone else has some suggestions...please!

Oh, I need 100-150 watts per channel for my floor standing speakers.

Cool, is that power rating at 4Ohm or 8? Are there any features you want - apart from tone control / DSP?

What will you use as a source, apart from CD?

 

[Leon74]

The CD player has Marantz HDAMs which are intended to manipulate the sound character. Your Stereo 70s has digital input without HDAMs and a digital filter that should mirror the Cinema 70s

View attachment 409979


You should compare the CD player running analog versus through a digital connection.

There is a lot of real world benefit of having one remote that controls your CD player and your amplifier, so I wouldn’t recommend changing your CD player.

The CD player will be the Denon 900NE. The Stereo 70s I just tried a while ago and sent abck, together with the Marantz cd player cd6007

 

[Leon74]

Cool, is that power rating at 4Ohm or 8? Are there any features you want - apart from tone control / DSP?

What will you use as a source, apart from CD?

The loudspeakers are Visaton Tristar 4 ohm. My husband build them himself. They produce a terrific sound.
Probably 90% of the time CD's. Probably some streaming from my phone - I have a bluetooth receiver that works with LDAC. Yes, tone control is a must. I saw an audiolab with no tone control, that's a no go. I don't use it a lot, just sometimes +/- 1 or 2 for treble and bass.
And as I said, a few sound modes, so I can make a badly recorded cd sound better.
I'd also like to have USB in on the front, and if I could connect a hd too, that would be great. Dab radio would be nice, but as I almost don't listen to radio and DAB sound is low quality anyway, it's not a must.
Built in Deezer would be nice, too. Qobuz has higher quality sound, but unfortunately it doesn't have "Flow" that I use a lot.
That's it
Oh, before I forget: Build quality matters to me.

 

[JeremyFife]

Denon AVR x1800h, but there's a lot of unused functionality

You might find a Yamaha receiver or integrated amp with a lot of what you want.

If it was my money ... WiiM Amp Pro, not a question.

 

[Leon74]

Denon AVR x1800h, but there's a lot of unused functionality

You might find a Yamaha receiver or integrated amp with a lot of what you want.

If it was my money ... WiiM Amp Pro, not a question.

Yamaha might be worth looking into.
As for Wiim, for what it is worth, according to chatgpt:

If your primary focus is on playing CDs and you already own the Denon DRA-800H, this is likely the better choice. This receiver will probably offer more dynamics, detail, and a more natural sound when playing CDs compared to the WiiM Amp Pro. The WiiM Amp Pro would be better suited if you're looking for a compact solution and primarily want to stream high-resolution audio.

I guess when it comes, I will unpack the Denon DRA 800H anyway and listen to it. Measurements are one thing, sound quality is not necessarily the same. Especially when you're listening at normal levels. When it sounds bad, it will go back.

 

[Leon74]

Denon AVR x1800h, but there's a lot of unused functionality

You might find a Yamaha receiver or integrated amp with a lot of what you want.

If it was my money ... WiiM Amp Pro, not a question.

Sorry, I missed your recommendation of the Denon AVR x1800h. Will definitely have a look at that one.

 

[JeremyFife]

Yamaha might be worth looking into.
As for Wiim, for what it is worth, according to chatgpt:

If your primary focus is on playing CDs and you already own the Denon DRA-800H, this is likely the better choice. This receiver will probably offer more dynamics, detail, and a more natural sound when playing CDs compared to the WiiM Amp Pro. The WiiM Amp Pro would be better suited if you're looking for a compact solution and primarily want to stream high-resolution audio.

I guess when it comes, I will unpack the Denon DRA 800H anyway and listen to it. Measurements are one thing, sound quality is not necessarily the same. Especially when you're listening at normal levels. When it sounds bad, it will go back.

Chatgpt may well be misleading ... it is certainly regurgitating subjective nonsense. Honestly, disregard that.

Look at the WiiM review on this site. Objective.

I do agree that you should try the DRA-800H. Poor measurements are not always audible, as you say. I'd struggle 'knowing' that the measurements were poor - but that's a form of bias in itself!

Your system, your choice

 

[restorer-john]

I also considered the two audiolab transports, but the cheaper one has a slot (causing scratches on the CD) and the more expensive one with a tray has a color cd screen, and I am afraid that might go bad one day as it is a (color) LCD screen.

Old slot load designs definitely caused scratching on CDs, but that was mainly in the CD auto head-unit era, where the rollers would get particles of dirt/detritus and "skid" causing damage. Also the felt/brushes meant to prevent dirt getting inside got dirty themselves. LOL.

Modern slot loaders for home are good as they have guides/rollers on the circumference of the disc and generally cause no damage.

 

[Leon74]

Chatgpt may well be misleading ... it is certainly regurgitating subjective nonsense. Honestly, disregard that.

Look at the WiiM review on this site. Objective.

I do agree that you should try the DRA-800H. Poor measurements are not always audible, as you say. I'd struggle 'knowing' that the measurements were poor - but that's a form of bias in itself!

Your system, your choice

Yes I understand what you mean by "struggling 'knowing' that the measurements were poor"... I can understand it, but then sound quality can be such a subjective and difficult to qualify thing. If it weren't for that, we wouldn't have a vinyl survival I guess ;-)

 

[Leon74]

Old slot load designs definitely caused scratching on CDs, but that was mainly in the CD auto head-unit era, where the rollers would get particles of dirt/detritus and "skid" causing damage. Also the felt/brushes meant to prevent dirt getting inside got dirty themselves. LOL.

Modern slot loaders for home are good as they have guides/rollers on the circumference of the disc and generally cause no damage.

I saw a test video showing the audiolab caused scratches, tough minor and probably insignificant:

My greater worry would be: What if a few years after use for example a graind of sand would inadvertently end up in the slot? With a tray you won't have that problem.
And I read a few comments saying that the scratching depends on how you put the CD in the slot. One person said that if the mechanism can grab the CD right away, it doesn't cause scratches, but it seems to do when it has to make a few attempts.