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Marantz AV7705 Home Theater Processor Review

Urgo

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On my Marantz SR8015 I don't need HEOS, zone2 / 3, bluetooth, wifi, no cinch except the output .... it could all be cheaper. This McIntosh is great.

Well, at the moment I don't use other zones, but I do use Heos to play quality streaming music. I recommend that you give it a try if you haven't already. The comfort of operating it from the mobile sitting in your chair and the wide variety of music in quality formats, really sound very good on the SR8015, has surprised me.
 

Martin_320

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Well, at the moment I don't use other zones, but I do use Heos to play quality streaming music. I recommend that you give it a try if you haven't already. The comfort of operating it from the mobile sitting in your chair and the wide variety of music in quality formats, really sound very good on the SR8015, has surprised me.

I concur. Before I really knew what HEOS was, I thought it was just another one of those marketing gimmicks. Then I thought I might as well install the app on my android smartphone. Then my existing Amazon Prime account could play music to my Marantz AV7705 - which steams directly from the internet via ethernet cable to the AVP. Not bad ! Then it asked me to upgrade to lossless Amazon Music HD for just a few extra bucks (after the free period).
Wow! Every song and CD I've ever listened to since my teens I could find without leaving my armchair, or the kitchen etc in lossless CD or greater quality. Or I can just select from a large variety of "stations" which play songs of a particular genre, as an endless playlist -- again in lossless quality. And I've discovered a lot more music since then, thanks to this...
 

Urgo

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Totally agree.

If you want to decode and reproduce formats such as the highest quality mqa offered by Tidal, for example, things get complicated because you need other devices. But, in addition to the comfort, the quality of the audio formats of the premium modalities of spotify, tidal, amazon HD, etc., which can be played from Heos, is already very high, and very difficult to differentiate by ear from the superior ones like mqa. You just have to have a dealer account and connect from Heos.

Even from the computer, we believe that the quality will be better, however, sometimes the same quality is not achieved, for example if you use spotify web or youtube as a player. You would also need a player and a suitable sound card or dac.
 

Martin_320

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Totally agree.

If you want to decode and reproduce formats such as the highest quality mqa offered by Tidal, for example, things get complicated because you need other devices. But, in addition to the comfort, the quality of the audio formats of the premium modalities of spotify, tidal, amazon HD, etc., which can be played from Heos, is already very high, and very difficult to differentiate by ear from the superior ones like mqa. You just have to have a dealer account and connect from Heos.

Indeed, the built-in HEOS (on a Marantz or Denon AVR/AVP) brings a whole new level of convenience, which effectively makes an external hirez streaming box pretty much obsolete. :)
Regarding your other point -- about MQA specifically -- I beg to differ slightly: HEOS (with Amazon HD's lossless FLAC container) streams the highest possible quality, whereas MQA relies on lossy upsampling+noise shaping.
 
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Urgo

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Indeed, the built-in HEOS (on a Marantz or Denon AVR/AVP) brings a whole new level of convenience, which effectively makes an external hirez streaming box pretty much obsolete. :)
Regarding your other point -- about MQA specifically -- I beg to differ slightly: HEOS (with Amazon HD's lossless FLAC container) streams the highest possible quality, whereas MQA relies on lossy upsampling+noise shaping.

Yes, you are right, I have confused formats.
 

Urgo

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The important thing is that all this has also been a pleasant surprise for me.
 

psraj

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Nice work on the review Amir. I feel the review is very "scientific" :D How much of this is really applicable to or audible in a "practical" use case? Granted 7705 has replaced the previous line of the AV processor, but at the same price point. Leaving the scientific numbers aside, how does this processor feel for human ears compared to other receivers in the same range? This review makes me feel like I am reading the "Rated battery life for my iPhone at 10hrs" which only applies under perfect lab conditions :D
 

Urgo

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Nice work on the review Amir. I feel the review is very "scientific" :D How much of this is really applicable to or audible in a "practical" use case? Granted 7705 has replaced the previous line of the AV processor, but at the same price point. Leaving the scientific numbers aside, how does this processor feel for human ears compared to other receivers in the same range? This review makes me feel like I am reading the "Rated battery life for my iPhone at 10hrs" which only applies under perfect lab conditions :D

I see it differently. Using your comparison, ASR will rather confirm to you that it is impossible for the battery to last as long as the brand's marketing claims.

In addition to many other data, Amir specifies in his graphs the audible, the probably audible, and the not audible. Of course, you just have to know how to read them.
 
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Martin_320

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I see it differently. Using your comparison, ASR will rather confirm to you that it is impossible for the battery to last as long as the brand's marketing claims.

In addition to many other data, Amir specifies in his graphs the audible, the probably audible, and the not audible. Of course, you just have to know how to read them.

To me the main SINAD test on ASR is very much like the torque dynamometer test curves that you see for cars.
For example, it tells me how much torque and horsepower my car can produce at 7,000rpm (manual-gearbox, petrol, turbocharged). It's nice to know, but I've never ever had the need to push it to that extremity of its performance envelope in normal operation. Rather, the most I normally ever get to in operation is about 4,500rpm -- which happens to be where my car's peak usable torque band lies.
In principle, I'm not against stress testing to see the ultimate load capability before failure, but for audio equipment, I do feel there should be some better way of objectively quantifying the audio performance under "normal" loads.
 

Urgo

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To me the main SINAD test on ASR is very much like the torque dynamometer test curves that you see for cars.
For example, it tells me how much torque and horsepower my car can produce at 7,000rpm (manual-gearbox, petrol, turbocharged). It's nice to know, but I've never ever had the need to push it to that extremity of its performance envelope in normal operation. Rather, the most I normally ever get to in operation is about 4,500rpm -- which happens to be where my car's peak usable torque band lies.
In principle, I'm not against stress testing to see the ultimate load capability before failure, but for audio equipment, I do feel there should be some better way of objectively quantifying the audio performance under "normal" loads.

I could partly agree. But most of the criticism is only focused on the maximum Sinad test, generally because its avr has not turned out very well, and that the differences would not be audible at that voltage, but they never take into account the rest of the curve. , nor the rest of the tests that are carried out.
 

Sal1950

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To me the main SINAD test on ASR is very much like the torque dynamometer test curves that you see for cars.
For example, it tells me how much torque and horsepower my car can produce at 7,000rpm (manual-gearbox, petrol, turbocharged). It's nice to know, but I've never ever had the need to push it to that extremity of its performance envelope in normal operation. Rather, the most I normally ever get to in operation is about 4,500rpm -- which happens to be where my car's peak usable torque band lies.
In principle, I'm not against stress testing to see the ultimate load capability before failure, but for audio equipment, I do feel there should be some better way of objectively quantifying the audio performance under "normal" loads.
You seem to attach it to something like the volume level you listen at.. True that there is a point beyond which futher improvements may be inaudible, but it's not tracked by your volume control but more closely follows your systems resolution and the recordings ability to deliver inner detail.
YMMV
 

Martin_320

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You seem to attach it to something like the volume level you listen at.. True that there is a point beyond which futher improvements may be inaudible, but it's not tracked by your volume control but more closely follows your systems resolution and the recordings ability to deliver inner detail.
YMMV

I'm not sure what you mean by "inner detail", but for me that manifests itself in the very quietest passages, of say, classical chamber music, where you want to discern even the tiniest details, of a viola bow making contact with a string. And not only that -- when I shut my eyes, I want to "see" exactly where in the soundstage that viola player is positioned around me. That's what I call "detail".

The kind of tests I'd like to see are how tiny transients are rendered on an otherwise silent background. but I don't see such tests here.
 
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peng

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Nice work on the review Amir. I feel the review is very "scientific" :D How much of this is really applicable to or audible in a "practical" use case? Granted 7705 has replaced the previous line of the AV processor, but at the same price point. Leaving the scientific numbers aside, how does this processor feel for human ears compared to other receivers in the same range? This review makes me feel like I am reading the "Rated battery life for my iPhone at 10hrs" which only applies under perfect lab conditions :D

The nice part about the ASR/amir's tests is that it included a lot of measurements other test bench might have omitted. For example, you can compare the duts not only on pre out SINAD (reciprocal of THD+N), but also linearity, IMD, 32 tones input test, FFT, SNR, DR, DAC filter performance etc., and that's just the preamp section. Those measurements do correlate to what we hear, to different extents obviously, but they do correlate. How much they matter in practical term would depend on each individual case where other factors are involved, such as the speakers used, the maximum and minimum SPL listened to, room ambient noise level, among others. To be on the safe side though, I would pick the one that measured best overall, regardless of whether it matters or not.

For example, if you are comparing a Denon AVR to another Denon or Marantz, it may be true that the one that measured better overall (in the important areas such as THD+N, IMD, FFT) may not sound better, but it surely won't sound worse, than the one the measured worse.
 

Sal1950

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I'm not sure what you mean by "inner detail", but for me that manifests itself in the very quietest passages, of say, classical chamber music, where you want to discern even the tiniest details, of a viola bow making contact with a string. And not only that -- when I shut my eyes, I want to "see" exactly where in the soundstage that viola player is positioned around me. That's what I call "detail".
I agree.
My personal belief is that ability to hear "into" the recording with electronics would be mainly enhanced by lower noise levels. But the quality of the source material along with your speakers with have the greatest influence on inner detail reproduction. The large percentage of todays electronics will be transparent to the source. Closely investigating the level of success a particular piece of gear has approached the SOTA may tell you much more than how it sounds but is a reflection of the designers desire to do the best he can in all corners of the gears build.
 

psraj

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I got a Denon 3700H based on the reviews here. I found the 3700 to be at best comparable to my old Yamaha RX-A1060, but 1060 was much better in terms audio brightness and clarity. 3700H lacked in dialogues and sounded laid back and too warm. I returned the 3700H and instead got a Marantz 7706, which is very similar to 7705 in most regards. After calibrating with Audyssey, the sound produced by 7706 is way way better than 3700. The most noticeable improvements are with channel separation and surround sound stage. The other noticeable improvement is the crystal clear dialogs. Watching Acquaman UHD, I was so surprised how much nuanced details I could hear in the underwater scenes. I am using Outlaw monoblock 2200 amps for my channels. All Klipsch RP series speakers. Works very well for my setup.
 

witchdoctor

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I've got the 7703, two generations earlier. Also what I expected to see, these numbers are typical of these tightly packed designs.
I do understand where Amir is coming from, he's an engineer looking for engineering excellence. On the other hand, to get a bit closer to the real world, as he mentions a couple times after bad outcomes "fortunately not that audible". And in all but the worst possible cases the reality is not audible at all. The FR rolloff is possibly one that could be most audible, but for those of us over 50 our hearing rolls off 3x that at 20khz anyway. LOL


Come buddy, you've taken 2 shots at the number of connectors and IMO those are cheap shots. In a modern multich rig those connections are required. In my little system I use 12 of the 13 output channels provided and a good portion of the available inputs. There's not a single connection I would consider superfluous depending on a users requirements. All in all a well considered switching allotment. Many users are forced to purchase the 8805 to allow for 15.2 connections over this units 13.2, and things only go up from there.


I wonder. I sure don't claim to understand the manufacturing costs vs sales of these things but you do seem to give no quarter to the difficulties of design, market demand, etc. In a world of HiFi that offers $10,000 power cords and interconnects, AVP's like this look to be the bargain of the century. Yes some of us have to live in a world where we divide the number of needed channels into the price and get the best we can afford. All kidding aside I don't see anyone being able to do any better at these price points.
There are a number of inconsequential issues with my 7703 I'm not happy with, but SQ, functionality, and reliability over the last 3 years is not in that equation.
As an owner of the 7703 and a 7701 before it, I give them 4 of a 5 star rating. ;)

I got the 7702 now for years and it has been rolling along NP. I still get occasional firmware upgrades too. If there is a BETTER 11 channel processor for around $2K I am waiting to hear what it is. I read that the $6K products with 16 channels have issues as well.
 

witchdoctor

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They will see the same issue in licensing DTS and Dolby. Not just those two, but the shadowy vendors of the DSP software that implement these parts of the chain of audio processing. There are a lot of snouts in the trough, and vested interests, presenting barriers to entry. Look at all the badges on the front of the box. Every one of them is getting a cut of the purchase price, and more that don't get a badge.

What is so depressing is that it would not be hard to do this pre-pro properly. Something as simple as a daughter board with a new set of DACs, all living with their own power supply, isolated from all the noise radiating from the processing chain, properly implemented, and feeding quality balanced output drivers. In the grand scheme of things it would not add a great deal to the BOM. The current offering is just insulting.

It is hard to make one properly compared to a desktop dac.
 

G-man

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Newbie here, but have learned a lot from these posts. Just purchased a 7705 and an Emotiva XPA 11. Since the nominal impedence of my new amp is rated at delivering maximum output at 1.5 volts (8ohms) wouldnt running the processor to 12 volts be extremely unnecessary?
 

Sal1950

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Newbie here, but have learned a lot from these posts. Just purchased a 7705 and an Emotiva XPA 11. Since the nominal impedence of my new amp is rated at delivering maximum output at 1.5 volts (8ohms) wouldnt running the processor to 12 volts be extremely unnecessary?
YES!
 

Sal1950

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Newbie here, but have learned a lot from these posts. Just purchased a 7705 and an Emotiva XPA 11. Since the nominal impedence of my new amp is rated at delivering maximum output at 1.5 volts (8ohms) wouldnt running the processor to 12 volts be extremely unnecessary?
BTW, I've got a 7703 driving Adcom amps rated at 1.25Vrms for full output into 8 ohms. I've never come close to seeing the clipping lights blink.
Don't fret over this issue. ;)
 
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