Macbook sets Midi settings to -41db when using Tidal exclusive mode! too quiet.

[JIW]

Sounds like you have a similar problem as I do. Are you outputting to a USB DAC? When you have a chance, can you see if you can reproduce my issue?
Steps:
1) Open the Audio MIDI Setup app.
2) Select the USB DAC output you use to listen to Tidal
3) Make sure the Primary Stream volume is set to maximum Value=1.0 db=0.0
4) Open the Tidal app.
5) Play a song on Tidal
6) Make sure your Tidal volume slider is set to Max.
7)Enter the sound output menu (little speaker icon next to the volume control in the Tidal app)
8) Choose the USB DAC (more settings)
9) You should get a pop up with two options: 1) Exclusive mode 2) Force Volume.
10) Toggle on Use Exclusive Mode.

Q1: Does the volume suddenly drop?
Q2: Go back to the Audio MIDI Setup app. What is the Primary Stream volume level for your USB DAC now at?

Yes, I am using a Topping DX 5 II via USB. Did you try turning loudness normalisation off? If that does not resolve your issue, we don't have the same one.

 

[JIW]

Sounds like you have a similar problem as I do. Are you outputting to a USB DAC? When you have a chance, can you see if you can reproduce my issue?
Steps:
1) Open the Audio MIDI Setup app.
2) Select the USB DAC output you use to listen to Tidal
3) Make sure the Primary Stream volume is set to maximum Value=1.0 db=0.0
4) Open the Tidal app.
5) Play a song on Tidal
6) Make sure your Tidal volume slider is set to Max.
7)Enter the sound output menu (little speaker icon next to the volume control in the Tidal app)
8) Choose the USB DAC (more settings)
9) You should get a pop up with two options: 1) Exclusive mode 2) Force Volume.
10) Toggle on Use Exclusive Mode.

Q1: Does the volume suddenly drop?
Q2: Go back to the Audio MIDI Setup app. What is the Primary Stream volume level for your USB DAC now at?

I tested first without volume normalisation. No change. I then tested with loudness normalisation. Volume dropped by around 32 dB in Audio MIDI Setup.

 

[Beershaun]

Hm. I only have normalize volume. I don't see a normalize loudness option. Could you tell me where you find that option?

 

[JIW]

Hm. I only have normalize volume. I don't see a normalize loudness option. Could you tell me where you find that option?

That is what I meant by it.

 

[Beershaun]

Ah. I see. For me Normalize volume just removes the volume control in the Tidal app. I can still adjust the primary stream volume in the Audio MIDI Setup app.

 

[JIW]

Ah. I see. For me Normalize volume just removes the volume control in the Tidal app. I can still adjust the primary stream volume in the Audio MIDI Setup app.

I can still control volume in the app but not in the Audio MIDI Setup with exclusive mode and normalisation on. Force volume prevents this. Your case only works with exclusive mode disabled and force volume enabled.

However, oddly, enabling exclusive mode strongly lowers volume if volume normalisation is enabled. With exclusive mode disabled, it is much more subtle. This might be because the attenuation is in absolute values not dB. Typically, half volume would be attenuation by a factor of 0.5 which is 20*log10(0.5) = -6.02 dB. However, the DX5 II does not have that correspondence in macOS. 0.5 volume is -37.19 dB whereas -6.0 dB is 0.908. The internal speakers are different with 0.5 being -18.6 dB and -6.0 dB is 0.82.

 

[JIW]

After mentioning it in my previous post, I decided to test if TIDAL's volume normalisation in exclusive mode sets the output device's volume in absolute value instead of dB values. Since absolute value volume varies for devices in macOS, I used the same track and looked at whether the absolute volume level would be identical with my Topping DX5 II and the MacBook Air built-in speakers. This is indeed the case at 0.51 and hence the reason it gives such extreme attenuation.

 

[Beershaun]

Does it happen as well when using exclusive mode but without using volume normalization?

 

[JIW]

Does it happen as well when using exclusive mode but without using volume normalization?

In that case volume is 1.0 in Audio MIDI Setup if TIDAL volume is set to full.

 

[Beershaun]

Thanks. Yours behaves different than mine. I wonder if there is a setting I need to change in the Mac?

 

[JIW]

Thanks. Yours behaves different than mine. I wonder if there is a setting I need to change in the Mac?

Do you have force volume enabled?

 

[Beershaun]

Do you have force volume enabled?

Not with exclusive mode.

 

[JIW]

Not with exclusive mode.

That might be the difference. In that case, with exclusive mode the app's volume is applied via the system as can be seen in Audio MIDI Setup while the system cannot control the volume by itself.

 

[Beershaun]

When I set force volume and exclusive mode the system volume level still drops and the Tidal app volume is greyed so no difference or change.

 

[JIW]

When I set force volume and exclusive mode the system volume level still drops and the Tidal app volume is greyed so no difference or change.

With volume normalisation enabled?