Luxsin X9 Smart Stereo DAC & Preamp

[Matt_Holland]

So the drop in preamp performance was also with digital sources?? I thought it was with analog only. Makes me look at it a little differently.

Adjustable slopes & filters for mains/subwoofers is a huge feature to be added with PEQ.

No color in black is a bummer

I was just about to post the same.
What do we even mean by pre-amp performance? All the SINAD measurements are made with the analogue output at max volume, right? I read the report as the SINAD was lower only when using the analogue input whereas pre-amp performance via digital sources was near SOTA.

 

[kolestonin]

Amirs reply, now that I read it again, leaves indeed that to be intended.

So are the sources you connect to it. But yes, I like to see 100 dB SINAD on that front.

But how can we have the preamp SINAD when using digital sources?

 

[Matt_Holland]

Amirs reply, now that I read it again, leaves indeed that to be intended.

But how can we have the preamp SINAD when using digital sources?

Because SINAD is a measure at the analogue output, typically at its maximum output (maximum volume level of the preamp). Of course the SINAD would logically reduce as the volume level is reduced.

 

[SorenTyson]

Whenever there is a vanilla DAC tested here, people complain if only it had sub out, HDMI in, a better display, PEQ, or analogue in.

This one seems to have all what is generally requested, but then they complain about the price.

Come on guys, this is great, and let Luxsin price it what they think the market supports! Objectively it's only too expensive if a similar or better product exists at a lower price.

 

[M.C. Logan]

People out here really questioning other people’s architectural situations. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

People 'round here really have zero curiosity?

 

[OldManMatt]

Because SINAD is a measure at the analogue output, typically at its maximum output (maximum volume level of the preamp). Of course the SINAD would logically reduce as the volume level is reduced.

The preamp numbers aren't horrible.. though I'm guessing that almost 2volts out is some high volume. When you see how good the dac numbers are you don't want to take that kinda hit using it as a preamp. But, there are many a dedicated preamps & analog sources/components not clearing 16bits. So I guess it just depends on what you are comparing the Luxsin "preamp" to.

I still rate it as a great device as long as any bugs are worked out on it. I could personally use all of its extra features. That's were I see it's value even at the asking price.

 

[Matt_Holland]

The preamp numbers aren't horrible.. though I'm guessing that almost 2volts out is some high volume. When you see how good the dac numbers are you don't want to take that kinda hit using it as a preamp. But, there are many a dedicated preamps & analog sources/components not clearing 16bits. So I guess it just depends on what you are comparing the Luxsin "preamp" to.

I still rate it as a great device as long as any bugs are worked out on it. I could personally use all of its extra features. That's were I see it's value even at the asking price.

The DAC result IS the preamp result.

The result some are disappointed in is the SINAD when the analogue INPUT is used. The results are stellar when digital inputs are used.

 

[VientoB]

The DAC result IS the preamp result.

The result some are disappointed in is the SINAD when the analogue INPUT is used. The results are stellar when digital inputs are used.

How is the analogue input processed?

 

[SoySalsaPicante]

How is the analogue input processed?

Guessing there is an ADC conversion to digital for DSP functions such as PEQ. Perhaps the Bypass setting needs to be turned on for testing the Analog input's true performance through the Preamp stage without ADC/DAC intervention.

Or perhaps there is absolutely no way to avoid the ADC. @Luxsin would have to clarify on exactly what path the Analog input signal takes through the unit.

 

[Mnyb]

Is there any tests on the PEQ/EQ / crossover to see if it introduces any processing artefacts ( similar to mini dsp ) ?
Some products with these features built in seems to not perform at the level of pc based software for example.

It would be interesting.

Otherwise i voted great

 

[Matt_Holland]

Is there any tests on the PEQ/EQ / crossover to see if it introduces any processing artefacts ( similar to mini dsp ) ?
Some products with these features built in seems to not perform at the level of pc based software for example.

It would be interesting.

Otherwise i voted great

Jitter increases with the EQ enabled as shown in the review.

 

[Matt_Holland]

The DAC result IS the preamp result.

The result some are disappointed in is the SINAD when the analogue INPUT is used. The results are stellar when digital inputs are used.

Replying to my own post to say that calling the results of the analogue input the “pre-amp” tests is somewhat confusing in my opinion as some people are judging the product unfairly. As variable analogue output is available regardless of the input used, I would describe the product as a Pre-amp for all tests.

 

[OldManMatt]

The DAC result IS the preamp result.

The result some are disappointed in is the SINAD when the analogue INPUT is used. The results are stellar when digital inputs are used.

Thanks for the clarification. That is what I thought initially...some of these comments left me confused & had me even thinking about past products/reviews. Truly appreciate your reply.

 

[Robbo99999]

This is exactly it. I was in the demo room of an AV store at the weekend auditioning a pair of HD800S which I have never heard before so always wanted to and now finally did it. The amp they used was the recent Cambridge Audio EXA100, a big integrated amp BUT I didn't feel like it looked or felt like a £2000 amp. The CA marketing makes some bold claims about how it is tuned in London and represents the pinnacle of audio fidelity from the ESS chips but again I didn't think I was hearing anything remarkable that sounded on the same level as to what I am hearing back at home on my Arya Stealth and X9 setup.

It could well be that the EXA100 has a crap headphone stage of the amp I don't know as no specs for it are available, but even still, the whole thing did not represent to my hands and eyes and ears something that is £2000 whereas the X9 absolutely does at its price point given all of the features and high res display animation and how hefty the unit and controls feel.

I think people just see words on a page, notice the brand they have never heard of before and think it must price itself low as a "newcomer" as it has no right to be higher priced against all the big brands that market based on name badge primarily and so on.

Or it could be the HD800s sounds like ass without EQ, ha! No, but seriously, the reason the headphone sounds like it does is because of it's measured frequency response - in broad terms. So there's not much magic there associated with the amp or DAC - it's the easiest & first thing to look at - I mean the frequency response of the headphone or speaker. There's a bit more to headphones than just the measured frequency response, but it's the main thing. (By no means is the HD800s listened to at stock a revelation in sound quality or experience, it's just not, which goes for the almost every headphone).

 

[robbiekhan]

Or it could be the HD800s sounds like ass without EQ, ha! No, but seriously, the reason the headphone sounds like it does is because of it's measured frequency response - in broad terms. So there's not much magic there associated with the amp or DAC - it's the easiest & first thing to look at - I mean the frequency response of the headphone or speaker. There's a bit more to headphones than just the measured frequency response, but it's the main thing. (By no means is the HD800s listened to at stock a revelation in sound quality or experience, it's just not, which goes for the almost every headphone).

It's just not a headphone that I seemed to not gel with, I had the HD6650 (unmodded half the time, then last half modded) which I liked a lot, but then tried planar headphones and it was game over for dynamic, the HD650 and HD660S2 I owned for a short while just sounded fun-less by comparison to the super wide range of sound that was coming out of the Hifimans I tried and it's to the point now that the Arya Stealth is my personal reference headphone. If a new pair I try or buy isn't able to beat the Arya Stealth at its £550 asking price then why even bother with any other headphone is my question.

I have the new Fosi i5 coming in August and the Audeze LCD-5 coming in a couple of weeks. That is a massive chasm of a price gap between them, and am I expecting the LCD-5 to be £3500 better sounding than the Arya? Nope! But will there be differences that could justify the cost? Remains to be seen.

The HD800S just didn't live up to the expectation I had given everything I read about them in comments on reddit and forums painting a picture of a near perfect headphone, just lacking the deep bass planars have spades of.

I don't EQ any more, it's direct bypass to speakers and headphones, so for me either of these two must produce the type of sound I'm now used to and favour the most with minimal intervention, changing pads to improve comfort and tone down the brightness peak that hifiman is known for is one thing, but EQing and filtering until patience wears thin trying to find perfection is just too much energy to waste when I just want an excellent sound.

This also bears a lot of pressure on the DAC and power amp I put in that chain, because I'm bypassing EQs and filters/effects, and only rolling a pair of OpAmps for the power amp, the physical tuning matters a lot for my ears. Thankfully that hardware is no issue here.

 

[A Surfer]

If you think you are achieving any audible effects by rolling opamps ...

 

[ocinn]

On my wish list for a future update would be adjustable delay on the sub outputs.

+1

The existing APF ability on the main outputs is fantastic for sub integration as well, and in many cases could negate the need for a main output delay feature.

 

[Panelhead]

I used a preamp/dac with DRC (PEQ) for about ten years. The inputs were all digitized to 96/24. Undefeatable. The DRC ran at 96/24. Analog inputs took a hit.

 

[Luxsin]

Guessing there is an ADC conversion to digital for DSP functions such as PEQ. Perhaps the Bypass setting needs to be turned on for testing the Analog input's true performance through the Preamp stage without ADC/DAC intervention.

Or perhaps there is absolutely no way to avoid the ADC. @Luxsin would have to clarify on exactly what path the Analog input signal takes through the unit.

You are right.
Analog input to the X9 will go through ADC conversion, this is to ensure DSP functions can be applied for all input sources. The bypass setting cannot avoid the ADC.

 

[Mnyb]

I wonder how many brand names Chi-Fi gear is sold under vs. how many factories actually exist to build the gear?? Way more of the former than the latter is my guess.

That’s often true anywhere for many industries . Fridges , vacuum cleaners , food ( friends worked in a burger bun and hotdog bread factory, they just put them in different bags with different brands on them they where all the same )