Loudspeaker cable test and comparison

[balletboy]

I will survive ;-). But thanks! We do the best we can.

At least if you get hounded here (and I enjoyed reading your group test), you can go listen to the organ at St Bavo. Possibly the most extraordinary sound I've ever heard in my life.

 

[dominikz]

Thanks for picking up our test. Appreciate it.

We did the best we can. The point of the livestream was to show 100% transparency. The listeners don't look during swapping (you can see that on camera). Measurements are all described in the article.

The whole point of this test is check if there is actually a difference in speaker cables. Is it audible (samples / listening) and can it be measured? (with the LCR and speaker response). Well... we tried. You can decide on the results.

Can we improve? Sure... No doubt. We don't claim that we are the best scientific instutute in the world. But at least we try to test stuff in a decent way.

Effort put into improving test methodology is always appreciated!

If I may I'd suggest to read this great article on listening test methodology by @SIY.

 

[ROOSKIE]

Thanks for picking up our test. Appreciate it.

We did the best we can. The point of the livestream was to show 100% transparency. The listeners don't look during swapping (you can see that on camera). Measurements are all described in the article.

The whole point of this test is check if there is actually a difference in speaker cables. Is it audible (samples / listening) and can it be measured? (with the LCR and speaker response). Well... we tried. You can decide on the results.

Can we improve? Sure... No doubt. We don't claim that we are the best scientific instutute in the world. But at least we try to test stuff in a decent way.

It would not have been hard to mitigate obvious issues.
WTF, why? Why why why can't adults who are going to claim they are putting in effort just actually put in effort? Why fake it, why half A it? A hour of research online or 20 minutes of advise from a competent researcher and you could have run a decent test vs a useless one.

I hope you do care.
Prove you actually care and do it over.

Seriously redo it with better controls and execution even if you still have a small sample of listners.

Please and thank you.

 

[ROOSKIE]

Thanks man! We do use reader- / viewer feedback. We try to improve every test. Tests like these are very expensive (we actually bought extra equipment) and take a LOT of time. So, next time - probably interlinks - we will see where we can improve.

I already said as much but "reader/viewer" feedback is an inappropriate way get a published test to be baseline meaningful. Maybe to enhance a already competent test or fix a minor overlook.
You need a solid baseline before publishing.
You don't have basic understandings in line with the test execusion. It is not yet a skilled attempt. Yet, you will be fooling some people who will believe naively that you are skilled.
Is that what you want?

 

[delta76]

I don't want to be overly critical, it seems you have spent considerable amount of time (and possibly money) on this test. However:
- It's hard to build a reputation of objective reviewers like Amir or Erin, it takes years and years, and as always, reputation is hard to built, but easy to ruin. Especially for this forum where most people have critical thinking of some level. We usually are skeptical. And you have quite non sense claim on your website regarding "audiophile network switch" which does not spark confidence.
- Your methods were flawed as pointed out, and that raised skeptics even more.
- The premise is flawed. The BEST speaker wire is the one that sounds like nothing. Completely transparent. A bad wire could add noise, and potentially distortions if it's badly made, too thin, bad material quality. A good wire should get rid of those. The premise that wires sound different is just absurd, and border line snake oil.

 

[TabCam]

I don't want to be overly critical, it seems you have spent considerable amount of time (and possibly money) on this test. However:

you are stating that you are overly critical

- It's hard to build a reputation of objective reviewers like Amir or Erin, it takes years and years, and as always, reputation is hard to built, but easy to ruin. Especially for this forum where most people have critical thinking of some level. We usually are skeptical. And you have quite non sense claim on your website regarding "audiophile network switch" which does not spark confidence.

Not everybody needs to have the same approach. For it to be scientifically proven requires more than what a webmagazine normally provides. Amir also does not publish peer reviewed reviews. However, they both provide transparency which I find important interpeting their results.

- Your methods were flawed as pointed out, and that raised skeptics even more.

I highly doubt if their subjective listening test was intended as scientific. I happen to like the combination of measurements and subjective impressions. Accepting their conclusion is another matter. There are always skeptics, even when the science points in other directions. I like the signature of Rooskie, the post above yours.

- The premise is flawed. The BEST speaker wire is the one that sounds like nothing. Completely transparent. A bad wire could add noise, and potentially distortions if it's badly made, too thin, bad material quality. A good wire should get rid of those. The premise that wires sound different is just absurd, and border line snake oil.

What do you think the premise is? Funny thing, they unanimously chose the most flat measuring wire as the best. I am kinda lost on how speaker wire can dd noise except when heated.

I can only find it commendable that Alpha Audio measures the differences. It shows a possible reason for the controversy, limited hearability. Maybe that means that some will hear differences that others don't which makes using statistics to prove anything very, very complicated.

Another hypothesis of mine is that your brain makes it easier to hear differences in a room you are familiar is and that all previous attempt to test it were in rooms unfamiliar for most participants.

To also be critical, the absence of proof does not mean it is not true! I try to keep an open mind for strange system interactions which do not show up on individually testen components. That is also what I like about this Alpha Audio test.

 

[delta76]

I was trying to explain to Alpha Audio why their test was not very well received here. that's it. Several people have pointed out flaws in their test, I don't need to repeat them or myself. If they come back to drawing board and design a better test, it'll be greatly appreciated.

 

[Spkrdctr]

Yes reading SIY's article would be a great help. Asking a few guys who have been there done that on this site would also quickly give you some good ideas. If you ever want any ideas we can help. I will say right now that it is not all that hard and if you test more scientifically, it will be easier to do. Your test was hard to do and lengthy. I say do it the easy way and get pretty solid information. Good Luck and thanks for sharing your test info.

 

[Recluse-Animator]

Supra Sword is directional cable according to the manufacturer...
Maybe there's others too on that list with the same claim I don't know.
If not that then surely many other ludicrous claims.
Or are they...

 

[DonR]

Supra Sword is directional cable according to the manufacturer...
Maybe there's others too on that list with the same claim I don't know.
If not that then surely many other ludicrous claims.
Or are they...

So... you are saying they built the cable factory on top of an ancient Indian burial ground!?!?

 

[Recluse-Animator]

So... you are saying they built the cable factory on top of an ancient Indian burial ground!?!?

Wasn't sure anyone would get the reference.

 

[JeremyFife]

Kudos to @Alpha Audio for attempting a blind test and also for exposing themselves to scrutiny here. That's an attitude to be supported.

I won't add to the comments on the test method.

It's especially brave since it's highly likely that a well run test will show that there's no point in selling expensive cable.

If @Alpha Audio can stick with this approach it can only make them a better retailer - I'd be knocking on their door if I was local and buying. better reviewers - I may even subscribe (** edited after my error was pointed out)

 

[NYfan2]

Kudos to @Alpha Audio for attempting a blind test and also for exposing themselves to scrutiny here. That's an attitude to be supported.

I won't add to the comments on the test method.

It's especially brave since it's highly likely that a well run test will show that there's no point in selling expensive cable.

If @Alpha Audio can stick with this approach it can only make them a better retailer - I'd be knocking on their door if I was local and buying.

For your information, Alpha Audio is not a retailer but an audio review site.

 

[JeremyFife]

For your information, Alpha Audio is not a retailer but an audio review site.

I stand corrected (thank you) ... principle stands; if they keep going like this and learn from early tests then their reviews will be worth watching

 

[Deleted member 29551]

I noticed this thread is still alive. I read all comments and we promise we will try to implement them. Note that we never claimed to be a scientific platform. We try to show both sides of audio: measurements and listening tests. That's because we believe in both.

For those who wonder why I don't reply on most of the comments here: I don't feel like replying on people that are just here to bash anyone trying to do something different or try a different approach. Feedback: yes... just poking holes in an article... no.

But for all those that gave some feedback that we can actually use and implement: thank you!

 

[Spkrdctr]

Supra Sword is directional cable according to the manufacturer...
Maybe there's others too on that list with the same claim I don't know.
If not that then surely many other ludicrous claims.
Or are they...

That is a future Audio Reviewer doing some training. Another YouTube wonder coming in the future, but at least she is female........

 

[Andysu]

who is this ASR guy ? he keeps mentioning ? not me .

 

[Andysu]

Supra Sword is directional cable according to the manufacturer...
Maybe there's others too on that list with the same claim I don't know.
If not that then surely many other ludicrous claims.
Or are they...

can you hear that sound on the surround when she places her hands against the tv , make sure use the region 1 dvd out of print . takes golden ear to have the balance LCRS or MS for this format 42 movie . can you hear that sound on the surround with correct left-half right-half surround arrays .

 

[Andysu]

this debate i think ps is not being honestly transparent and yet no tests on ps end all that gear in the shop and doesn't use it ? ethen gets down to it with the test gear .

 

[Andysu]

the null tester , with sensing the snaky snake manufacturers pure snake oil cable as pure bs