Looking to get started in the hifi world

[SarcasticVelociraptor]

Hello,

I would like to make my very first hifi setup, i'm pretty new to basically everything regarding this big big world.
So after doing research and research, not understanding most of everything I made a list of what I would like to get me started with.
Of course being my first ever setup it will be cheap(and not so cheap) so don't kill me because I choose some weird things.
Where all of this stuff will go? Well in a 20 m2 room, on my desk, but it's possible in the future to move into a bigger place...

OK so the list:
- Speakers I have been looking at the ELAC Uni-Fi 2.0 UB52 -535 euros (a lot of review say they are god like) or an alternative would be the well known and much much cheaper Sony SSCS5 -222 dollars with all the taxes. Ever since I was little and my dad got some chinese Bluetech amp and speakers I have been obsessed with 3-way speakers, I just enjoyed how they sound, same for car audio, call it obsession ;
- Headphones these is hard to really choose because I want them to sound good but also be comfortable because they will be used to listen to music while I work, while I play video games but also sound good, of course that depends also on the rest of the components, I have chosen HiFiMAN HE-400i - 199 euros and Philips Fidelio X2HR - 172 euros, no idea if the DAC I choose will power any of these, still researching. I currently have a pair of Sony WF-1000xm3 which are awesome for outside and in airplanes because of the ANC, but too much bass and nothing else while at home;
- Phono I have been struggling to find something that made sense to me but in the end I narrowed down to Pro-Ject Phono Box E - 69 euros and the Ifi Zen Phono - 159 euros;
- DAC(Headphone AMP) for this one I found just one solution that makes sense to me because of the Headphones, it's the iFi ZEN DAC V2 - 159 euros;
- AMP ok so with this one I have been looking at different AMPS and I have arrived at this one AIYIMA A07 - 86 euros(don't laugh). Seems to have the most power and a lot of reviewers are saying it's very good;
- AMP with DAC and HeadPhone AMP even a SubOut here is where I'm currently in conflict, if with the others I want your opinion and if what I have picked would actually work(most of you will say buy all of them and see if you like it). With this one there is only one I really like because it has everything I would need minus the phono and it's the LOXJIE A30 - 186 euros, it has everything I would need into one device, headphone amp, speaker amp, dac, bluetooth, remote, subout(maybe in the future) and paired with a Phono it would be the cheapest combo also. But will it sound as good as the separate components? Will it be able to power the speakers? Will it be able to power the headphones? Will it be the holy grail? I don't know, this is why I'm asking .

Ok so after a lot of laughing on your part what would you choose out of these? I'm in France by the way so all of these are available here, also the budget is a maximum 1000 euros for everything(also cables) but that can fluctuate because there is no point in getting the most expensive stuff and have them sound worse than the cheaper ones, right? I might not get the headphones in that budget due to the Elac's but that's why I'm not sure what to choose(the Sony SSCS5's would have to be imported from the US and are still cheaper if I buy them from France ).
I have heard all good things about each one of the components separately but I don't know how well they would go together. I know probably I will have to experiment and see for my self but I would appreciate the help.

Other questions, I cannot find anywhere how to connect everything, in which order? I will use my PC usb as a source, maybe the Bluetooth from my Phone.
So in which order? I have seen some people saying stuff like PC -> DAC -> Phono -> AMP -> Speaker but I don't feel that is the right order, maybe PC->Phono->DAC->AMP->Speakers?

Ok that would be all of my craziness so thank you for spending time to read and for the help, cheers.

 

[RickSanchez]

the LOXJIE A30 - 186 euros, it has everything I would need into one device, headphone amp, speaker amp, dac, bluetooth, remote, subout(maybe in the future) and paired with a Phono it would be the cheapest combo also. But will it sound as good as the separate components? Will it be able to power the speakers? Will it be able to power the headphones? Will it be the holy grail? I don't know, this is why I'm asking

The best place to start (I'm assuming this is why you're on ASR) is to look at the measurements of the Loxjie A30:

Loxjie A30 Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the multifunction Loxjie A30 power (speaker and headphone) amplifier with integrated USB DAC and Bluetooth input. It was kindly sent to me by a member and costs US $159 plus $7 shipping on Amazon. The A30 sports a high resolution and high contrast...

www.audiosciencereview.com

That review answers all of your questions. Or, more accurately, it will answer your questions once you decide on speakers and headphones. A little more detail:

• No one can answer whether an amp has enough power when you haven't decided on which speakers you'll be using. You have to make that decision first.
• To decide if a headphone amp has enough power (and low enough output impedance) for your headphones you need to determine how much power your headphones need for your preferred (max) SPL. This tool should help.
• To understand some of the various DAC/amp measurements on ASR and what they mean this thread is helpful: Audibility thresholds of amp and DAC measurements
• In general I'd suggest ignoring subjective reviewers, whether those are folks who make money doing subjective reviews (e.g. on YouTube) or customer reviews on sites like Amazon. You've got hundreds of products -- DACs, amps, headphone amps, pre-amps, AVRs, headphones, speakers, etc. -- on ASR that have objective measurements.

 

[ZolaIII]

Ufff I don't think you're on the right path.
Take a look at Kali in 8 V2 studio monitors (400$ each) and Topping EX5 DAC/AMP combo (400$). That's around 1000€ so far and you will nead only additional balanced cable to patch them up.
Start with budget hedaphones such as Philips SPH 9500 (75~85$).

 

[Slayer]

Hello,

I would like to make my very first hifi setup, i'm pretty new to basically everything regarding this big big world.
So after doing research and research, not understanding most of everything I made a list of what I would like to get me started with.
Of course being my first ever setup it will be cheap(and not so cheap) so don't kill me because I choose some weird things.
Where all of this stuff will go? Well in a 20 m2 room, on my desk, but it's possible in the future to move into a bigger place...

OK so the list:
- Speakers I have been looking at the ELAC Uni-Fi 2.0 UB52 -535 euros (a lot of review say they are god like) or an alternative would be the well known and much much cheaper Sony SSCS5 -222 dollars with all the taxes. Ever since I was little and my dad got some chinese Bluetech amp and speakers I have been obsessed with 3-way speakers, I just enjoyed how they sound, same for car audio, call it obsession ;
- Headphones these is hard to really choose because I want them to sound good but also be comfortable because they will be used to listen to music while I work, while I play video games but also sound good, of course that depends also on the rest of the components, I have chosen HiFiMAN HE-400i - 199 euros and Philips Fidelio X2HR - 172 euros, no idea if the DAC I choose will power any of these, still researching. I currently have a pair of Sony WF-1000xm3 which are awesome for outside and in airplanes because of the ANC, but too much bass and nothing else while at home;
- Phono I have been struggling to find something that made sense to me but in the end I narrowed down to Pro-Ject Phono Box E - 69 euros and the Ifi Zen Phono - 159 euros;
- DAC(Headphone AMP) for this one I found just one solution that makes sense to me because of the Headphones, it's the iFi ZEN DAC V2 - 159 euros;
- AMP ok so with this one I have been looking at different AMPS and I have arrived at this one AIYIMA A07 - 86 euros(don't laugh). Seems to have the most power and a lot of reviewers are saying it's very good;
- AMP with DAC and HeadPhone AMP even a SubOut here is where I'm currently in conflict, if with the others I want your opinion and if what I have picked would actually work(most of you will say buy all of them and see if you like it). With this one there is only one I really like because it has everything I would need minus the phono and it's the LOXJIE A30 - 186 euros, it has everything I would need into one device, headphone amp, speaker amp, dac, bluetooth, remote, subout(maybe in the future) and paired with a Phono it would be the cheapest combo also. But will it sound as good as the separate components? Will it be able to power the speakers? Will it be able to power the headphones? Will it be the holy grail? I don't know, this is why I'm asking .

Ok so after a lot of laughing on your part what would you choose out of these? I'm in France by the way so all of these are available here, also the budget is a maximum 1000 euros for everything(also cables) but that can fluctuate because there is no point in getting the most expensive stuff and have them sound worse than the cheaper ones, right? I might not get the headphones in that budget due to the Elac's but that's why I'm not sure what to choose(the Sony SSCS5's would have to be imported from the US and are still cheaper if I buy them from France ).
I have heard all good things about each one of the components separately but I don't know how well they would go together. I know probably I will have to experiment and see for my self but I would appreciate the help.

Other questions, I cannot find anywhere how to connect everything, in which order? I will use my PC usb as a source, maybe the Bluetooth from my Phone.
So in which order? I have seen some people saying stuff like PC -> DAC -> Phono -> AMP -> Speaker but I don't feel that is the right order, maybe PC->Phono->DAC->AMP->Speakers?

Ok that would be all of my craziness so thank you for spending time to read and for the help, cheers.

First off, welcome to the forum.
Welcome to the wonderful world of hifi.
You have started on the right path by asking questions. Take the time and do as much research as you can before making unnecessary purchases.
Plan on spending more than you usually want to or have in your budget. Plan on the constant feeling for the need to upgrade, even when it's usually not needed. Plan on the time it takes to set things up and properly calibrate them.
Most importantly, when all that is down, plan on many hours of enjoyment.

 

[DVDdoug]

The main thing that affects sound quality (or sound "character") is speakers (or headphones). I recommend you go to an audio/video store and listen to a variety of speakers. That's just to generally educate yourself about how different speakers sound. You don't have to buy speakers from that store. (And they will sound different in a different room.)

Don't get too obsessed with the design choices (2-way, 3-way, ported, sealed, type of tweeter, etc.). Speaker design involves lots of choices and trade-offs and there are lots of ways to make a good speaker (and lots of ways to make a bad speaker). Size matters... It takes a large woofer and a large cabinet to get bass. But of course, if you're using a (large) subwoofer for the bass the main speakers can be smaller. But that doesn't mean that every large woofer or every large cabinet has better bass than every smaller speaker.

If you have a 12-inch woofer it's likely that you need a 3-way speaker because there is likely a "gap" between woofer's upper range and the tweeter's lower range.

With headphones, different people have different preferences and opinions so again it's best if you can listen (and check the comfort) for yourself, although the reviews here are a good place to start. With headphones there isn't much correlation between price and sound quality.

For your electronics a receiver is often the best option. You might need an AVR (audio video receiver) instead of a "stereo receiver" in order to get digital inputs. That's the easiest way to get a subwoofer output and you can configure it for stereo if you're not planning on surround sound. Note that a "standard" AVR has powered speaker outputs for the main/surround speakers and a line-level output for an active/powered subwoofer.

...An AVR is pretty-much required if you want to get the "point one" LFE channel from DVDs & Blu-Rays. The stereo downmix includes the regular bass but the LFE (low frequency effects channel) gets thrown-away.

A receiver is also a "control center" so you select from different sources and you (almost always) get a remote control, etc.

Receivers have a reputation for "imperfect" headphone-outputs so you might want to add a dedicated headphone amplifier, maybe later if you're not satisfied.

Do you already have vinyl? Do you really need or want to play records? You can spend LOTS of money but you'll NEVER get sound quality equal to a cheap CD player. The record itself is the limiting factor and records seem to deteriorate even if you are careful with them. I grew-up with vinyl and the "snap", "crackle", and "pop" always annoyed me even though most people didn't seem to be bothered by it. I could live with the other vinyl limitations but since we have digital there's no need to put-up with any of it. I still have my turntable but I only use it to occasionally digitize a record that's not available digitally.

 

[ZolaIII]

@DVDdoug easiest way to get a sub out is a converter (stereo to 2.1~5.1) and it cost's couple of bucks.
@SarcasticVelociraptor there are record players with integrated phono preamp if you ever need one.

 

[escape2]

@DVDdoug easiest way to get a sub out is a converter (stereo to 2.1~5.1) and it cost's couple of bucks.

But does it come with bass management?

 

[ZolaIII]

But does it come with bass management?

For the ability to cut it as you like you will need a PC surround card that supports that. And PC (X86) is by far most scalable platform to work with. Most AVR's don't do the job correctly and are very expensive trash in every way. Most integrated bass outputs are just that (pasive switches). Bass management... Most deacent stereo amplifiers and active speakers have bass/trable (ISO 226) equal loudness controls that fit the need (when you learn to use them).

 

[tvrgeek]

I was surprised how good the Elac's were for the price.
I am not a big headphone fan, so no comment.
So, source is the PC? You can use free software to do all the EQ. APO, REW etc.
I am quite happy with both SCHIIT and JDS products, but shipping may be an issue with you as you mention prices in Euro's.
I get close to a class D amp, and then they just leave me cold. Not terrible like they were a few years ago, but I like my old MOSFETs better. Just decided to finally go active crossover, so grabbed another Hafler SE120 to mod.
I am a firm believer in HIGH PASS filters for everything. Mains, subs. Fortunately, I am a DIY guy so I just build them.
I am also a very firm believer is sealed subs. Not ported. They blend with the room so much better. You don't always even need bass management as you are not that sensitive down low anyway.
Generic cables are as good as they get. Plain old lamp cord actually the best speaker cable.

 

[tvrgeek]

For the ability to cut it as you like you will need a PC surround card that supports that. And PC (X86) is by far most scalable platform to work with. Most AVR's don't do the job correctly and are very expensive trash in every way. Most integrated bass outputs are just that (pasive switches). Bass management... Most deacent stereo amplifiers and active speakers have bass/trable (ISO 226) equal loudness controls that fit the need (when you learn to use them).

Anthem AVR's do a quite decent job with EQ. Far better than Audessey to my ears.
I do wish more receivers, preamps had "loudness" controls. I like tone controls too.

 

[ZolaIII]

@tvrgeek he is a bit on the tight budget or I would have mentioned Yamaha amplifier/streamer (AB class preferably) instead. The Yamaha active monitor's actually use similar AB class amps as their amplifiers but speakers are not quite there and HS8 is actually little cheaper than Kali but are two way (he should still try them). How really good are those Elac's? They look a bit small and are 6 Ohm's rated. Think Kali's will fit him (with a three way desire) if he like them (trying before buying is a must).

 

[DWPress]

Like @DVDdoug said - the transducers will affect what you hear more than anything else either speakers or headphones so I would put the bulk of my budget there from the start. A good speaker will still sound good when paired with a sub par amp but a great amp will sound like crap with cheap speakers. If you want to integrate a sub down the road there are lots of ways to do it so if you don't need the AV part and are focusing on 2 channel music an amp + DAC headphone amp and volume control is all you need to get started. As mentioned, computer as source opens up a lot of possibilities for EQ and routing.

 

[tvrgeek]

Speakers are 90% of it. Correct to focus on them.

 

[hdspeakerman]

Look at Kali speakers.

 

[SarcasticVelociraptor]

Ufff I don't think you're on the right path.
Take a look at Kali in 8 V2 studio monitors (400$ each) and Topping EX5 DAC/AMP combo (400$). That's around 1000€ so far and you will nead only additional balanced cable to patch them up.
Start with budget hedaphones such as Philips SPH 9500 (75~85$).

Those Kali's look more than good and paired with the DAC/AMP for the headphones they would make for a stelar 2.0 setup
Regarding headphones I have been looking after you said at the SPH 9600(86 euros) compared to the 9500 which are 115 euros, might get those, thanks a lot for the help .

 

[SarcasticVelociraptor]

The best place to start (I'm assuming this is why you're on ASR) is to look at the measurements of the Loxjie A30:

Loxjie A30 Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the multifunction Loxjie A30 power (speaker and headphone) amplifier with integrated USB DAC and Bluetooth input. It was kindly sent to me by a member and costs US $159 plus $7 shipping on Amazon. The A30 sports a high resolution and high contrast...

www.audiosciencereview.com

That review answers all of your questions. Or, more accurately, it will answer your questions once you decide on speakers and headphones. A little more detail:

• No one can answer whether an amp has enough power when you haven't decided on which speakers you'll be using. You have to make that decision first.
• To decide if a headphone amp has enough power (and low enough output impedance) for your headphones you need to determine how much power your headphones need for your preferred (max) SPL. This tool should help.
• To understand some of the various DAC/amp measurements on ASR and what they mean this thread is helpful: Audibility thresholds of amp and DAC measurements
• In general I'd suggest ignoring subjective reviewers, whether those are folks who make money doing subjective reviews (e.g. on YouTube) or customer reviews on sites like Amazon. You've got hundreds of products -- DACs, amps, headphone amps, pre-amps, AVRs, headphones, speakers, etc. -- on ASR that have objective measurements.

Thanks for the headphone tool, it really saves and shows me what I need to drive different headphones

 

[ZolaIII]

Those Kali's look more than good and paired with the DAC/AMP for the headphones they would make for a stelar 2.0 setup
Regarding headphones I have been looking after you said at the SPH 9600(86 euros) compared to the 9500 which are 115 euros, might get those, thanks a lot for the help .

Nope 9600 are pure trash. Anyway SPH 9500 is only basic entry line which EQed will sound decent enough (for a start). I told you current best Amazon price.
The EX5 is a little pricy but its a very nice package (to me at least).