Looking for a small DAC to hide off-desk

[ChaoscripT]

Hi,

I’m looking for advice on a small DAC that I can basically hide and keep off my desk.
I don’t mind at all if it has no volume knob.

Currently I’m using an SMSL D6, and I’m very happy with its performance.
The only reason I’m considering replacing it is purely desk minimalism - I want the desk as clean and empty as possible.

I’m likely going to buy Edifier M60 or Kanto Ora powered speakers. Both offer USB and analog inputs, but I still prefer this setup:

• USB from computer → external DAC
• RCA or 3.5mm from DAC → speakers

My assumption (please correct me if I’m wrong) is that the DACs built into these speakers are probably not on the same level as a decent standalone DAC.

Key requirements:

• Small form factor (easy to hide under/behind the desk)
• No need for a volume knob on the DAC itself
• Power can be USB-powered or externally powered – no strong preference, just want good engineering
• I plan to control volume using an external physical volume controller on the desk (example - https://aliexpress.com/item/1005008089410412.html )

Yes, I know that the external volume knob is overpriced, but I really like the design and the idea of having a unified controller with room for additional buttons (play/pause, etc).

DACs I’ve looked at so far:

• Topping D10s - $109 (Amir's Review for D10 version)
• Topping E30 II Lite - $99 (Amir's Review)
• SMSL SU-1 - $72 (Amir's Review)

Of course, I’m very open to other recommendations that fit this use case.

Questions:

1. I’ll be moving to macOS soon. Since macOS doesn’t require custom drivers, how do these DACs generally behave there? Any known quirks or limitations?
2. If I end up with multiple volume controls (DAC / speakers + external volume knob), what is the recommended gain structure?
   For example: should the DAC/speakers be set to max or some fixed level, and then control volume only from the external controller?

Thanks in advance - appreciate any measurements-based and experience-based input.

Regards.

 

[voodooless]

My assumption (please correct me if I’m wrong) is that the DACs built into these speakers are probably not on the same level as a decent standalone DAC.

Your assumption is wrong. Both are DSP speakers, meaning they do crossover in the digital domain. So any analog signal needs to be digitized first, and it always output via the internal DACs after processing.

Just use USB

 

[ChaoscripT]

Your assumption is wrong. Both are DSP speakers, meaning they do crossover in the digital domain. So any analog signal needs to be digitized first, and it always output via the internal DACs after processing.

Just use USB

Thanks for the note,
So the external DAC give me nothing here?

Just to understand, how I can know if the speakers are DSP or not?

 

[voodooless]

Thanks for the note,
So the external DAC give me nothing here?

Nothing at all.

Just to understand, how I can know if the speakers are DSP or not?

Usually, it's mentioned in the product page, otherwise do a quick internet search to find out. Giveaways are usually that there are seperate amps for each diver, combined with digital inputs. It's not 100% certianty, but it's a fairly reliable indicator.

 

[ChaoscripT]

Usually, it's mentioned in the product page, otherwise do a quick internet search to find out. Giveaways are usually that there are seperate amps for each diver, combined with digital inputs. It's not 100% certianty, but it's a fairly reliable indicator.

Get it,
In the Edifier M60 indeed mention,

Full digital signal processing with two-way active crossover and DRC

Maybe you can help me with the volume question?
The Edifier M60 have volume option, but I prefer to control it with external volume knob, then on the speakers which volume I need to put?

 

[Rosenbloom]

Since you are planning to move to Mac, another possibility is to use the 3.5mm output on Mac. Connect it to a passive volume control then to your active speakers. The internal dac of Mac is already good enough although I cannot provide any objective measurement. Just my 2 cents.

 

[ChaoscripT]

Since you are planning to move to Mac, another possibility is to use the 3.5mm output on Mac. Connect it to a passive volume control then to your active speakers. The internal dac of Mac is already good enough although I cannot provide any objective measurement. Just my 2 cents.

Thanks for that,
I have some height limit problem so I need some small speakers, alot of speakers that I checked are high and over my limit.
But if I can connect to USB I prefer, it will connect to Docking station that connects to Mac.

 

[voodooless]

The Edifier M60 have volume option, but I prefer to control it with external volume knob, then on the speakers which volume I need to put?

Get a USB or Bluetooth volume knob that controls the OS mixer volume

 

[ChaoscripT]

Get a USB or Bluetooth volume knob that controls the OS mixer volume

Yes I know that, but still the speakers can't be on volume 0 right?
I think I found some usb/bluetooth volume knob.

 

[voodooless]

Yes I know that, but still the speakers can't be on volume 0 right?

It can, it depends a little bit on the implementation. Often with these kinds of devices, the OS mixer volume will just proxy to the speaker volume control, but not always. It's not really an issue to set the speaker to full volume and control volume elsewhere.

 

[ChaoscripT]

It can, it depends a little bit on the implementation. Often with these kinds of devices, the OS mixer volume will just proxy to the speaker volume control, but not always. It's not really an issue to set the speaker to full volume and control volume elsewhere.

Thanks.

 

[IsaacOscar]

Yes I know that, but still the speakers can't be on volume 0 right?

Why can't they be? You'll just get no sound from them. Woops, the other guy is right: if the speakers have a separate volume, put that at 100%, and control the OS volume. Otherwise, if they are the same thing, 0% on the speaker sets 0% on the OS.

Either way, 0% on the OS should be 100% silent.

I think I found some usb/bluetooth volume knob.

That expensive volume knob you liked should work? Check the manual. (as long as it can control your OS's volume, you're good)

 

[ChaoscripT]

Why can't they be? You'll just get no sound from them. Woops, the other guy is right: if the speakers have a separate volume, put that at 100%, and control the OS volume. Otherwise, if they are the same thing, 0% on the speaker sets 0% on the OS.

Either way, 0% on the OS should be 100% silent.

Most of the speakers are have seperate volume no?

That expensive volume knob you liked should work? Check the manual. (as long as it can control your OS's volume, you're good)

You know other volume knob as well?

 

[IsaacOscar]

Most of the speakers are have seperate volume no?

No idea, I've had ones that do both. You'd have to check the manual or something. (My DAC/AMP even has its own volume, as does Spotify, but my policy is to set everything to 100%, except the OS; if I wanted to use the Spotify remote control however, I'd put the OS at 100%, and adjust spotifies volume)

You know other volume knob as well?

No, I just looked it up online. I have no use for a Knob as my Mouse has a gesture button that I've set to control the volume (you hold down the button and move the mouse up and down, sideways for previous/next track, and not moving, just pressing for play/pause). I also have a cable for my headphones and earphones with buttons, which is great for using them connected to my phone in my pocket.

 

[ChaoscripT]

No idea, I've had ones that do both. You'd have to check the manual or something. (My DAC/AMP even has its own volume, as does Spotify, but my policy is to set everything to 100%, except the OS; if I wanted to use the Spotify remote control however, I'd put the OS at 100%, and adjust spotifies volume)

I currently have SMSL D6 with volume knob, and I use oppsite from you (don't know if there some best way),
SMSL at volume 0 (this is the control volume), OS mixer at 100% all the time.

No, I just looked it up online. I have no use for a Knob as my Mouse has a gesture button that I've set to control the volume (you hold down the button and move the mouse up and down, sideways for previous/next track, and not moving, just pressing for play/pause). I also have a cable for my headphones and earphones with buttons, which is great for using them connected to my phone in my pocket.

Wait ... you bring here some good idea,
I have Logitech MX Master 3S with the horizontal scroll I can set this for the volume up/down of the OS mixer.

 

[IsaacOscar]

Wait ... you bring here some good idea,
I have Logitech MX Master 3S with the horizontal scroll I can set this for the volume up/down of the OS mixer.

Haha, that's exactly the same mouse I have.

 

[ChaoscripT]

Haha, that's exactly the same mouse I have.

And I saw now under Logitech software the Gesture option with volume up/down, it's really comfortable? to hold the click and drag the mouse up/down?

 

[IsaacOscar]

And I saw now under Logitech software the Gesture option with volume up/down, it's really comfortable? to hold the click and drag the mouse up/down?

Yes! (assuming you have a nice cloth mouse pad).

(Unfortunately for it to work, the Logitech software needs to be running, so you may have to wait a bit when turning your computer on or waking it from sleep for it to work. After several years of using the software, I've recently ha a problem with the software crashing a lot, but I managed to fix it; EDIT: I posted my solution on a reddit post containing other potential solutions as well, in the off chance it helps some random passersby)

 

[ChaoscripT]

Yes! (assuming you have a nice cloth mouse pad).

(Unfortunately for it to work, the Logitech software needs to be running, so you may have to wait abit when turning your computer on or waking it from sleep for it to work. After several years of using the software, I've recently ha a problem with the software crashing a lot, but I managed to fix it with a script. so let me know if it ever randomly stops working and I can explain what I did to fix it)

Yes, have mouse pad (large one),
I don't have (currently) problem with logitech software,
But I try now with the gesture button, it's not seems comfortable or I need to get used to this.

 

[IsaacOscar]

Yes, have mouse pad (large one),
I don't have (currently) problem with logitech software,
But I try now with the gesture button, it's not seems comfortable or I need to get used to this.

The MX Master 4 has a different gesture button, but I haven't tried it. (I only upgrade my mouse when the gunk in my scroll wheel gets too much)