Looking for a good tube amp for my Massdrop x Fostex Thx00 purplehearts

[watchnerd]

The thing is, the choices below 1 ohm with sufficient output should provide the sound the Fostex was shooting for with your Purplehearts. The concern might be that you do not like the Purple hearts sound as envisioned by Fostex. So, my suggestion to a good match 1st. If you do not like what you hear, then you can either choose a different amp that provides a sound closer to what you like...or choose different headphones that sound the way you like when they are driven accurately.

Tubes are fun, but the more "tubey" they sound, the more they add color and, in effect, impart their signature heavily. For me, this eventually gets old.

My philosophy now is that amps shouldn't be effects boxes.

If you want a different sound, change transducers (headphones, speakers) or use EQ/DSP effects.

 

[Nobunaga]

Is the goal to drive the Purplehearts as transparently as possible?

Or is the goal to have a tube amp, period, even if it isn't a good match for the Purplehearts, because you'll switch headphones at some point?

Good question, in the end of the day what matters to me is what do i like best in terms of sound. I do like how tube amps sound, but i cannot say for certain if i like the unaltered sound of the purple hearts, because i never heard it like that.

I think my first goal is to find a tube amp that sounds great and matches with my Purple Hearts and then well i can decide between that and the THX .

Tube amps i have found so far that fit within my budget are:

Little Dot Mark III/SE, Little dot mark IV/SE (sale), darkvoice 336, Bottlehead crack + speedball, Garage1217 (don't really know which one), Elekit TU-8200, Megahertz amps (i live near Italy, dunno which one and neither prices), XDUOO TA-20

 

[Nobunaga]

Tubes are fun, but the more "tubey" they sound, the more they add color and, in effect, impart their signature heavily. For me, this eventually gets old.

My philosophy now is that amps shouldn't be effects boxes.

If you want a different sound, change transducers (headphones, speakers) or use EQ/DSP effects.

That's an interesting point, i avoid buying things that i risk not liking in the future. I would never buy an expensive sports car again, in the beginning its fun but then it gets boring and the high costs makes it a real pain to own (just as an example).

 

[M00ndancer]

That's an interesting point, i avoid buying things that i risk not liking in the future. I would never buy an expensive sports car again, in the beginning its fun but then it gets boring and the high costs makes it a real pain to own (just as an example).

Then you should get a proper amp like the Atom or the THX. Use EQ/DSP to change the sound of your purple hearts. You have alredy tried them with a Schiit Fulla and I quote:

I once tried the Schiit Fulla and it also sounded much better than my Asus essence stx, however differntly than the Technics.
The Fulla made the sound clearer, much punchier, and was more detailed, was more detailed. Also bassier and sharper in a pleasant way.

As we stated earlier, getting a tube adds stuff to you audio, with proper EQ/DSP you can change the sound w/o adding artifacts. Get the cheap Atom and try it out with your STX. Use the EQ/DSP in the STX to change the sound if you like. Don't get a tube amp that's not matching the impedance of your headphone. Then you have not invested in something that's making justice to your Purple hearts. I would start with something that makes them sound correct as massdrop/fostex intended before I got a tube amp.

 

[Nobunaga]

Is the goal to drive the Purplehearts as transparently as possible?

Or is the goal to have a tube amp, period, even if it isn't a good match for the Purplehearts, because you'll switch headphones at some point?

That's hard for me to answer, because i never heard the Purple Hearts

Then you should get a proper amp like the Atom or the THX. Use EQ/DSP to change the sound of your purple hearts. You have alredy tried them with a Schiit Fulla and I quote:


As we stated earlier, getting a tube adds stuff to you audio, with proper EQ/DSP you can change the sound w/o adding artifacts. Get the cheap Atom and try it out with your STX. Use the EQ/DSP in the STX to change the sound if you like. Don't get a tube amp that's not matching the impedance of your headphone. Then you have not invested in something that's making justice to your Purple hearts. I would start with something that makes them sound correct as massdrop/fostex intended before I got a tube amp.

Well a tube amp paired with a purple hearts is gonna sound different than the same tube amp with a pair of Grados.

And EQ/ESP is not tube sound. Asssuming, i want to go with a tube amp. Is there anyone that suits best from the candidates i listed before?

And if it's as you say, that a good amp should be completly transparent, what is the different between a 2.5k dollar amp and a 100 bucks?

 

[SIY]

And EQ/ESP is not tube sound.

Actually, it pretty much is, if you evaluate without peeking.

 

[watchnerd]

And EQ/ESP is not tube sound.

I have a mixing studio at home.

There are DSP-based plugins that not only emulate tubes, generally, but specific types of tubes (EJ88, EL34, etc.) as well as specific pieces of tube-based equipment.

It's all about a transfer function, and until a tube starts to go bad and act somewhat randomly, it's all very easy to model.

 

[M00ndancer]

And if it's as you say, that a good amp should be completly transparent, what is the different between a 2.5k dollar amp and a 100 bucks?

If we are talking in general terms: nothing.
The price does not in anyway or form tell you the performance or features of an headphone amp.
There are differences between amps, but a good amp will sound the same regardless of price.
What might differ on the other hand is things like outputs, power, impedance, looks, build quality and so on.

 

[M00ndancer]

That's hard for me to answer, because i never heard the Purple Hearts

HUH?
What's this then?

Looking for a good tube amp for my Massdrop x Fostex Thx00 purplehearts

 

[Nobunaga]

HUH?
What's this then?

I said that, i never heard the purplehearts unaltered sound, that's why i can't say if i like their raw signature sound or with a tube amp, better. But generally speaking i always like the tube sound better than a solid state, regardless if it's a guitar or headphone.

the sound of "A" is much more pleasant for me.

same here 2 and 4 sound much better to me than 1 and 3.

 

[watchnerd]

I said that, i never heard the purplehearts unaltered sound, that's why i can't say if i like their raw signature sound or with a tube amp, better. But generally speaking i always like the tube sound better than a solid state, regardless if it's a guitar or headphone.

the sound of "A" is much more pleasant for me.

same here 2 and 4 sound much better to me than 1 and 3.

You may not have realized that you just proved the point:

If you like the sound of digital + solid state simulating tubes (that's what you're hearing on YouTube over a computer, that you said you preferred) then you can combine tube emulation with solid state to get the same.

 

[DKT88]

I like tube amps and own several for headphones and speakers. The headphone tube amps have been the "budget" variety and have not been satisfying. The problem is that to get high performance from a tube amp costs "big money". I suggest that you look for a solid state headphone amp with a discrete output stage. I have a solid state headphone amp (opamp driver/Mosfet output stage) and it really sounds good, way better than inexpensive tube amps. I noticed that my SMSL M8a DAC has settings you can select: "Standard, Rich 1, Rich 2, Rich 3, Tube 1, Tube 2, Tube 3, Crystal 1, Crystal 2, and Crystal 3". Have only tried "standard" setting. You can try "opamp" rolling instead of tube rolling with some SS amps.

 

[Nobunaga]

I like tube amps and own several for headphones and speakers. The headphone tube amps have been the "budget" variety and have not been satisfying. The problem is that to get high performance from a tube amp costs "big money". I suggest that you look for a solid state headphone amp with a discrete output stage. I have a solid state headphone amp (opamp driver/Mosfet output stage) and it really sounds good, way better than inexpensive tube amps. I noticed that my SMSL M8a DAC has settings you can select: "Standard, Rich 1, Rich 2, Rich 3, Tube 1, Tube 2, Tube 3, Crystal 1, Crystal 2, and Crystal 3". Have only tried "standard" setting. You can try "opamp" rolling instead of tube rolling with some SS amps.

How much would i need to spend to get a good tube amp? Would a Little Dot MK III or MK IV serve the purpose?

 

[SIY]

Define "good." And I'm not being facetious.

 

[DKT88]

How much would i need to spend to get a good tube amp? Would a Little Dot MK III or MK IV serve the purpose?

Well I have one of those here in my office that I tried a few years ago. I've never seen any measurements of its performance other than manufacturers specs. I wasn't impressed with the sound, but it seems a lot of people are as I must have had some reason to buy it. Its a low power OTL amp and so paring with the right headphones is important. I just used it with what I had, Hifiman HE400i and Sennheiser HD650 headphones. I tried some NOS Mullard tubes also.

 

[DKT88]

Define "good." And I'm not being facetious.

Haha, good question. Good is not a well defined requirement, I should know better, I teach systems engineering. I would define good for a headphone amplifier as having the capability to drive a variety of headphones, and to sound clean, flat and dynamic. These are subjective terms so without measured performance they are still not good requirements. You can read about the important technical specs for an amp/headphone system like impedance (http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/02/headphone-amp-impedance.html ), online cause I would have to read it again too. I like powerful amplifiers and V8 cars.

 

[watchnerd]

Haha, good question. Good is not a well defined requirement, I should know better, I teach systems engineering. I would define good for a headphone amplifier as having the capability to drive a variety of headphones. and to sound clean, flat and dynamic.

To maximize either of those attributes (maximum variety of headphones, to sound maximally flat and dynamic on that same max variety of headphones), means pretty much "not tubes".

Or at least not purely tubes (i.e. excluding hybrids).

 

[SIY]

Well, if you want good drive capability into a variety of loads, you don't want tubes OR you'll need to have an amp with a multi-tap secondary output transformer. That will NOT be inexpensive. Designing a tube amp to drive 300-600 ohm is a lot easier, so presumably someone commercial has done that.

 

[DKT88]

To maximize either of those attributes (maximum variety of headphones, to sound maximally flat and dynamic on that same max variety of headphones), means pretty much "not tubes".

Or at least not purely tubes (i.e. not a hybrid).

right, that's why the Lil'Dot is gathering dust.

 

[watchnerd]

Speaking of hybrids:

I know Schiit makes a lot of garbage, but my Schiit Mjolnir 2 was fun with the right headphones and right tubes, until I realized tube rolling was driving me crazy, costing a fortune, and I could do much the same in DSP for free.

The headphone jacks objectively blow the hybrid Mjolnir 2 out of the water when it comes to driving a maximal variety of headphones cleanly. And I can get as tubey as I like.

Although I do miss the cool glow of the tubes, but not the fire risk from my cat sitting on it. Hot tubes + trapped cat hair = danger!