Let's be a little nicer, especially to newcomers

[AdamG]

Not as if it's some big secret, Adam I used to be admin for another forum, so I know about those tools. I would wager that a lot of people on ASR would know that too, and it is not hard to look at Xenforo's webpage to see what features are available.

BTW, there might be a mechanism for you to screen new members. You can change the forum setting so that ALL first posts (or first x number of posts) are hidden until approved by a moderator. This could be accompanied with a quick message saying that it is necessary to screen first posts to cut down on spam. Given the size of ASR this might involve a lot of work.

We already do this Keith. Appreciate the advice though. Most of this screening activity is set up by Amir. Brad and I just man the phones!

 

[Multicore]

How about a new user's forum? All threads started by anyone with less than 20 posts goes there.

I might help but 20 seems like quite a lot. If I come here looking for help choosing, say, an AVR I have to post 20 times in the noobs' corner before gaining permissions. I might not have 20 things to say there. So then I either make stuff up to get to the quota or stop when I have the answer.

 

[OnLyTNT]

Newcomers should try reading the room, avoid having an attitude and use common sense. Saying that as a newcomer whose first language is not English and haven't got any problem so far . May be the text at the main forum page header should be extended, and have bigger fonts. I mean this one:

If there is not, a small community guide would also be helpful, linked from that header with a warning.

 

[Multicore]

There is no reason to gate or control posts by new members. They are not just new and uninitiated. We also have industry people join to complain or to post very interesting technical comments a few times.

If we're more patient and take the time to answer things as much as we can it'll be worth it in the end.

My preference is also for the peer group to cultivate the behavior norms it prefers. Trying to legislate and enforce good behavior in a top-down manner isn't easy. But Amir's OP in this topic is about a pattern of more-or-less established members behaving badly towards newcomers. That's unlikely to correct itself without some intervention but I'm not sure limiting the actions of the newcomers is the fix.

 

[Multicore]

Newcomers should try reading the room, avoid having an attitude and use common sense.

Amir's OP asserts that the room is behaving badly to newcomers. I agree and can point to a recent example where I was the first to reply to a new user's first post, then in the following it went all to hell and I regretted being any part of it.

If newcomers read the room and adapt to that kind of room, that's not really the outcome I would want. Is that the culture ASR wants to indoctrinate new users into?

 

[Curvature]

Sometimes I think a lot of it is just selfish laziness on our part. It takes a long time to type a detailed response for a proper answer. Easier to mock, deride, assume bad faith.

 

[antcollinet]

Sometimes I think a lot of it is just selfish laziness on our part. It takes a long time to type a detailed response for a proper answer. Easier to mock, deride, assume bad faith.

It is actually a lot easier to ignore and move on

 

[Curvature]

It is actually a lot easier to ignore and move on

Not for keyboard warriors like myself

 

[Multicore]

Not for keyboard warriors like myself

That's a psychology worth investigating. What's the reward for mocking and deriding? There must be something motivating this behavior. Everyone has all sorts of other things they could do besides online bullying so why do they choose to do that? There are reasons for behaving like that. What are they?

 

[mhardy6647]

It is actually a lot easier to ignore and move on

Yeah, but train wrecks (and really bad auto accidents along the motorway) catalyze what is known, in the US at least, as rubbernecking.
One simply cannot look away.

 

[TheBatsEar]

I wrote a lengthy paragraph insulting all the regulars and new members alike, but then realized they aren't worth my premium, first class, highly advanced insults.

That said, new members and regulars, all in all, seem to interact in a civilized manner, i don't see any reason to make changes. Just remind everyone that

1. being offended is a choice, and
2. there is a report link.

 

[OnLyTNT]

Amir's OP asserts that the room is behaving badly to newcomers. I agree and can point to a recent example where I was the first to reply to a new user's first post, then in the following it went all to hell and I regretted being any part of it.

If newcomers read the room and adapt to that kind of room, that's not really the outcome I would want. Is that the culture ASR wants to indoctrinate new users into?

Then community guidelines should involve both parties or every user and Amir's OP actually can be a part of it which shouldn't be forgotten in time and lost in old posts. Because, it is going to reoccur after a while I believe.

 

[JayGilb]

 

[OnLyTNT]

That's a psychology worth investigating. What's the reward for mocking and deriding? There must be something motivating this behavior. Everyone has all sorts of other things they could do besides online bullying so why do they choose to do that? There are reasons for behaving like that. What are they?

"This is the forum where we try to impress each other with how much we know about audio" may be this is promoting that in a wrong way

 

[Curvature]

"This is the forum where we try to impress each other with how much we know about audio" may be this is promoting that in a wrong way

When we forget that's a joke, or if we make jokes that are too personal/inaccessible/onesided, then we get the current situation.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I might help but 20 seems like quite a lot. If I come here looking for help choosing, say, an AVR I have to post 20 times in the noobs' corner before gaining permissions. I might not have 20 things to say there. So then I either make stuff up to get to the quota or stop when I have the answer.

You don't need 20 posts to start a thread. You can start a thread with post number 1. But your first one would be in a new posters forum where you still get questions answered or other help from everyone.

 

[TheBatsEar]

if we make jokes that are too personal/inaccessible/onesided, then we get the current situation.

Some people feel offended, no matter what. Nothing can be done about it. It's a risk we have to take if we want open discussion.
Consider the r/audiophile echo chamber as a bad example.

I see senior members wanting to have their account deleted at times

It's a choice to be offended, they can use the report link like anyone else. Regardless, there should be a link to delete your profile on your own.

But your first one would be in a new posters forum where you still get questions answered or other help from everyone.

And then they are offended there. If you go for total harmony, discussion stops. If you remove the risk that someone is offended, all interaction becomes bland.

Change nothing. If new members feel offended, offer the report link.
If you feel offended, use the report link.
If someone offends you by simply existing, use the ignore function.

 

[sarumbear]

That’s a great idea! @amirm is this something we can do? I support the idea and say we should set this to 30 posts before they can Start New Threads. I just spent several hours this morning hunting down new Member Spam Threads. They grow like weeds during the night hours.

Horrible idea!

 

[TheBatsEar]

I just spent several hours this morning hunting down new Member Spam

I suspect these are not "regular" peoples posts, but spam then, like viagra links?
There are technical solutions to make sure people are real people.

 

[Curvature]

Some people feel offended, no matter what. Nothing can be done about it. It's a risk we have to take if we want open discussion.
Consider the r/audiophile echo chamber as a bad example.


It's a choice to be offended, they can use the report link like anyone else. Regardless, there should be a link to delete your profile on your own.


And then they are offended there. If you go for total harmony, discussion stops. If you remove the risk that someone is offended, all interaction becomes bland.

Change nothing. If new members feel offended, offer the report link.
If you feel offended, use the report link.
If someone offends you by simply existing, use the ignore function.

It's worth engaging people who feel offended. I am not bothered by their offense, since behind offense is usually the interesting stuff that makes a person worth knowing.