Great, in that case you can calculate if the inductance of the wire changes the frequency response any further than 200pF worth of capacitance already at the load for MM cartridge.
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Kimber Silver Streak & Neo d+ Review (XLR Cables)
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Why do expensive cables so often look like something a 12-year-old made?
Moises
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Hi!
Sorry to bother
I was doing a frequency response test using two different brands of XLR cables connected to my Scarlett Audio Interface using Audiolense XO.
So here are the results.
Cable A shows more balanced result on both channels compared to Cable B
The big hump on the right channel is my subwoofer next to my right speaker
So which cable is telling the truth?
Sorry to bother
I was doing a frequency response test using two different brands of XLR cables connected to my Scarlett Audio Interface using Audiolense XO.
So here are the results.
Cable A shows more balanced result on both channels compared to Cable B
The big hump on the right channel is my subwoofer next to my right speaker
So which cable is telling the truth?
Attachments
Speedskater
Major Contributor
I think that there is some overlooked uncontrolled variable in your test.
Moises
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Any hint?
staticV3
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The two images show functionally identical measurements, just a different scale (stretch factor) and the usual run-to-run (and channel) variation in the low bass.Hi!
Sorry to bother
I was doing a frequency response test using two different brands of XLR cables connected to my Scarlett Audio Interface using Audiolense XO.
So here are the results.
Cable A shows more balanced result on both channels compared to Cable B
The big hump on the right channel is my subwoofer next to my right speaker
So which cable is telling the truth?
Martini
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LOL
Moises
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I’m embarrassed
I am curious why people still measure the performance of a straight piece of metal wire in a lab environment. It has nothing to do with cable performance in real life. To me, it’s like comparing different kinds of gasoline based on color.
In real life, the duty of any interconnect is to deliver the payload without distortion. In that respect, all cables — from a coat hanger to a quadrillion-dollar diamond-pixie-dust-emulsion, cryogenically treated in the Chernobyl nuclear reactor, quantum cable from a garage in Iowa — work exactly the same.
But there is another task: minimizing the addition of signals that should not be there. And that is where many cables behave differently.
The problem is that a lab environment is not the same as a real installation in a modern house, with a full spectrum of heavy electromagnetic pollution: from 60 Hz induced by AC wiring all the way to multi-gigahertz RF from nearby radio relays, Wi-Fi, 432 MHz from “smart” devices, your friendly ham radio operator neighbor, your wireless AC controller, and so on.
All of these sources induce some current in every conductor, and those unwanted signals, one way or another, get into your electronics. To make things even more complicated, sometimes a small movement of a cable may change the whole picture. Thus, most so-called “A/B tests” are totally irrelevant.
Makers of trillion-dollar cables are targeting people who have no idea how cables really work, and that makes both sides happy. I do not want to spoil their businesses, or their customers’ satisfaction with the brilliant deals they think they are getting.
As for real performance, one simply needs good shielding. Although well-made cables with good shields are not dirt cheap, they are not exorbitantly expensive either. I use Mogami, Canare, and Gotham cables in all my systems, and they provide adequate protection from RF pollution in all my locations.
Considering that I am a ham radio operator myself, running multiple 1+ kW transmitters on many frequencies from 1.8 to 450 MHz, plus complex Wi-Fi networks and hundreds of RF-controlled Lutron wall switches, my EMI situation is much worse than in most places.
I have performed a lot of measurements of signals throughout my systems, and I know where the real noise and distortion are coming from. But to transform such research into a scientifically satisfactory study, the test bench and measurement process would cost hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars. That is absolutely not feasible just to satisfy the curiosity of a small group of hobbyists, especially when the outcome is already known and will not lead to new scientific discoveries.
I am a physicist by training, so I know how to build complex measurement systems. In the audio world, I am a hobbyist too, so these matters are my toys, not my tools of the trade.
So let everyone enjoy their own perceived worlds and be happy with their choices. Those who know, know.
In real life, the duty of any interconnect is to deliver the payload without distortion. In that respect, all cables — from a coat hanger to a quadrillion-dollar diamond-pixie-dust-emulsion, cryogenically treated in the Chernobyl nuclear reactor, quantum cable from a garage in Iowa — work exactly the same.
But there is another task: minimizing the addition of signals that should not be there. And that is where many cables behave differently.
The problem is that a lab environment is not the same as a real installation in a modern house, with a full spectrum of heavy electromagnetic pollution: from 60 Hz induced by AC wiring all the way to multi-gigahertz RF from nearby radio relays, Wi-Fi, 432 MHz from “smart” devices, your friendly ham radio operator neighbor, your wireless AC controller, and so on.
All of these sources induce some current in every conductor, and those unwanted signals, one way or another, get into your electronics. To make things even more complicated, sometimes a small movement of a cable may change the whole picture. Thus, most so-called “A/B tests” are totally irrelevant.
Makers of trillion-dollar cables are targeting people who have no idea how cables really work, and that makes both sides happy. I do not want to spoil their businesses, or their customers’ satisfaction with the brilliant deals they think they are getting.
As for real performance, one simply needs good shielding. Although well-made cables with good shields are not dirt cheap, they are not exorbitantly expensive either. I use Mogami, Canare, and Gotham cables in all my systems, and they provide adequate protection from RF pollution in all my locations.
Considering that I am a ham radio operator myself, running multiple 1+ kW transmitters on many frequencies from 1.8 to 450 MHz, plus complex Wi-Fi networks and hundreds of RF-controlled Lutron wall switches, my EMI situation is much worse than in most places.
I have performed a lot of measurements of signals throughout my systems, and I know where the real noise and distortion are coming from. But to transform such research into a scientifically satisfactory study, the test bench and measurement process would cost hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars. That is absolutely not feasible just to satisfy the curiosity of a small group of hobbyists, especially when the outcome is already known and will not lead to new scientific discoveries.
I am a physicist by training, so I know how to build complex measurement systems. In the audio world, I am a hobbyist too, so these matters are my toys, not my tools of the trade.
So let everyone enjoy their own perceived worlds and be happy with their choices. Those who know, know.
RetroStereo
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You're correct that a home environment is different from a lab. However, Amir's lab is in his home and, I suspect, includes just about every type of interference likely to be encountered.
Also, I guarantee you the every imaginable form of interference was included when the engineering company that tested various audio cables from two companies a
gainst ones from Radio Shack back in the early '80's (see my post elsewhere). The man running the company (now deceased) was a bit overeducated: he had a double major undergraduate degree, two masters degrees and THREE doctorates in physics, chemistry & electrical engineering. NASA had him on speed dial. He's the person who pinpointed the O-ring failure in the Challenger explosion and the Kepton insulation failure in the middle fuel tank of the TWA flight 800 explosion.
He once had lightning strike his home and do thousands of dollars of electrical damage. He put in a claim with his insurance company. They put off settling for months. After he had called several times complaining, the person handling his claim said, "I'm sorry, Mr *****, we've contacted IEEE and they've given us the name of one of the foremost authorities in damage in electrical systems, a Dr ***** --- oh, uh, never mind, Dr *****, we will pay your claim today."
Also, I guarantee you the every imaginable form of interference was included when the engineering company that tested various audio cables from two companies a
gainst ones from Radio Shack back in the early '80's (see my post elsewhere). The man running the company (now deceased) was a bit overeducated: he had a double major undergraduate degree, two masters degrees and THREE doctorates in physics, chemistry & electrical engineering. NASA had him on speed dial. He's the person who pinpointed the O-ring failure in the Challenger explosion and the Kepton insulation failure in the middle fuel tank of the TWA flight 800 explosion.
He once had lightning strike his home and do thousands of dollars of electrical damage. He put in a claim with his insurance company. They put off settling for months. After he had called several times complaining, the person handling his claim said, "I'm sorry, Mr *****, we've contacted IEEE and they've given us the name of one of the foremost authorities in damage in electrical systems, a Dr ***** --- oh, uh, never mind, Dr *****, we will pay your claim today."
Speedskater
Major Contributor
Which other post might that be?
You post about every day.
RetroStereo
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Sorry, from the early '80's: An attempt by #2 to usurp #1 in the snake oil wire industry. I'm retired, dealing with failing & being replaced knees, and have too much time on my hands while mostly stuck at home. Worse, about 2/3rds of my vintage stereo equipment is still off being refurbished. <SIGH>
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