Kii THREE versus Dutch&Dutch 8C

[Purité Audio]

Dutch&dutch 8C versus kii THREE, there can be only one!
http://www.puriteaudio.co.uk/blog
Keith

 

[Sal1950]

Dutch&dutch 8C versus kii THREE, there can be only one!
http://www.puriteaudio.co.uk/blog
Keith

Well that was a dirty trick, there's no shootout results posted. (Yet?) LOL
Very nice blog machine, extremely professional and handsome design.
I salute you for your post and position on boutique expensive cables!

 

[Purité Audio]

Sorry they arrive next week!
Thanks for the compliment I wish I could say it was all my creative genius but modern website design software ,I used Wix is really cool and easy to use.
Keith

 

[watchnerd]

Sorry they arrive next week!
Thanks for the compliment I wish I could say it was all my creative genius but modern website design software ,I used Wix is really cool and easy to use.
Keith

Do you know why Dutch & Dutch uses plywood instead of MDF?

 

[Purité Audio]

I think the final production the ones we are receiving might be solid oak, but I will check .
Keith

 

[watchnerd]

I think the final production the ones we are receiving might be solid oak, but I will check .
Keith

Ack...that's probably worse than plywood! Solid wood has huge inconsistencies in terms of density structure.

 

[Sal1950]

Do you know why Dutch & Dutch uses plywood instead of MDF?

I still question the claims of MDF being more rigid than something like a quality marine grade plywood. I'm sure there are conclusive tests out there that I haven't investigated but I have a feeling there's a bit of cost involved in the choice of MDF

 

[watchnerd]

I still question the claims of MDF being more rigid than something like a quality marine grade plywood. I'm sure there are conclusive tests out there that I haven't investigated but I have a feeling there's a bit of cost involved in the choice of MDF

I've never heard rigidity as the rationale. I've heard it's due to more predictable and uniform density.

 

[Purité Audio]

New photographs of the 8C here,
http://www.puriteaudio.co.uk/blog

Keith

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

I still question the claims of MDF being more rigid than something like a quality marine grade plywood. I'm sure there are conclusive tests out there that I haven't investigated but I have a feeling there's a bit of cost involved in the choice of MDF

Agree with @watchnerd. Rigidity is not an issue in a properly engineered speaker cabinet, though I am not aware of claims as to MDF's rigidity in any case. Plywood is also much stronger than MDF in many ways, but we do not need that added strength in audio applications, like speaker cabinets.

MDF is higher in density than plywood, hence it may have more desirable resonant properties. It is also a much more consistent material and therefore easier to cut and fabricate.

That it is also cheaper is a bonus. I really do not see anything wrong with it in speakers or other audio gear if properly engineered. It just lacks a sense of exclusivity - the parallels to Ikea furniture, etc. - hence it lacks high end sex appeal. Surely, if a cabinet is made from 13-layer Finnish birch plywood instead, it must be better, easily justifying its much higher cost.

 

[Sal1950]

New photographs of the 8C here,
http://www.puriteaudio.co.uk/blog
Keith

"Excitement reaches fever pitch as D&D release new photographs of the 8C, the cabinet has been slightly redesigned one slot instead of two and their are changes around the back too!"

My heart is all a-twitter over this ground shaking news. One slot instead of two, Holy mechanical marvel Batman!

 

[Sal1950]

Agree with @watchnerd. Rigidity is not an issue in a properly engineered speaker cabinet, though I am not aware of claims as to MDF's rigidity in any case. Plywood is also much stronger than MDF in many ways, but we do not need that added strength in audio applications, like speaker cabinets.

MDF is higher in density than plywood, hence it may have more desirable resonant properties. It is also a much more consistent material and therefore easier to cut and fabricate.

That it is also cheaper is a bonus. I really do not see anything wrong with it in speakers or other audio gear if properly engineered. It just lacks a sense of exclusivity - the parallels to Ikea furniture, etc. - hence it lacks high end sex appeal. Surely, if a cabinet is made from 13-layer Finnish birch plywood instead, it must be better, easily justifying its much higher cost.

Well I can't quote any such claim so maybe it was the result of my fertile mind?
But in any case I would believe that rigidity and the resistance to the cabinet walls flexing and becoming radiators of their own would be a very high priority.
IMO MDF has become as popular as it is due to the cost savings.

 

[Purité Audio]

"Excitement reaches fever pitch as D&D release new photographs of the 8C, the cabinet has been slightly redesigned one slot instead of two and their are changes around the back too!"

My heart is all a-twitter over this ground shaking news. One slot instead of two, Holy mechanical marvel Batman!

And the changes to the rear of the cabinet don't forget those!
Keith

 

[watchnerd]

And the changes to the rear of the cabinet don't forget those!
Keith

Do you have close-ups of the connectors on the back?

 

[watchnerd]

Theoretical question:

(might need help from @dallasjustice justice for this)

If the Kii Three and Dutch & Dutch 8C tame in-room bass by firing to the sides / back, couldn't I get similar effects with a set of multiple subwoofers that is pointing in similar directions?

Or, differently, is what they're doing actually superior to just using 2 to 4 subwoofers in one of the recommended configs?

 

[Cosmik]

Theoretical question:

(might need help from @dallasjustice justice for this)

If the Kii Three and Dutch & Dutch 8C tame in-room bass by firing to the sides / back, couldn't I get similar effects with a set of multiple subwoofers that is pointing in similar directions?

Or, differently, is what they're doing actually superior to just using 2 to 4 subwoofers in one of the recommended configs?

Without knowing anything definitive, I would guess that it is necessary to have the cancellation drivers in close proximity to the drivers they are cancelling. Once the wavefronts have escaped into the wild, it would not be possible to cancel them out so completely and without unwanted side effects (are all of these systems free of unwanted side effects anyway?)

 

[Purité Audio]

The Kii's controlled directivity stretches from 50H to 2kH reducing thereafter, so you would need subs and mid range units cancelling the off axis and the DSP to control everything, they are ingenious speaker, the Kii's, Beolab and hopefully the Dutch& Dutch are well ahead of the pack at the moment.
Keith

 

[dallasjustice]

There's really nothing that special going on with the kii audio speakers.DSP is used to cancel the waves in certain directions. This results in the cardoid pattern. This idea was reported on in AES journal decades ago. It should not be compared with mode cancelling subwoofer setups. In fact, it's a gimmick when compared to what multiple subs can actually do to smooth and tighten bass response.

Theoretical question:

(might need help from @dallasjustice justice for this)

If the Kii Three and Dutch & Dutch 8C tame in-room bass by firing to the sides / back, couldn't I get similar effects with a set of multiple subwoofers that is pointing in similar directions?

Or, differently, is what they're doing actually superior to just using 2 to 4 subwoofers in one of the recommended configs?

 

[Purité Audio]

Dream on Mike dream on.
Keith

 

[dallasjustice]

Dream on Mike dream on.
Keith

What, you thought Bruno invented this idea?