KH 750 KH 80 can‘t hear the sub / ma1

[morello777]

Hi
would appreciate some help
i set up my kh 750 and calibrated the sub with my kh 80 speakers via ma1.

is it normal that i almost can‘t hear the sub? if i turn off the sub i hear that some low end is missing in my speakers so i surely feel the sub but not really hearing it. does ma1 level the volume of sub and speaker automatically?
thanks a lot

 

[Jim Taylor]

Hi
would appreciate some help
i set up my kh 750 and calibrated the sub with my kh 80 speakers via ma1.

is it normal that i almost can‘t hear the sub? if i turn off the sub i hear that some low end is missing in my speakers so i surely feel the sub but not really hearing it. does ma1 level the volume of sub and speaker automatically?
thanks a lot

What you've described sounds essentially like the perfect augmentation of a sub. If you wish, try to play some organ music to make the difference more obvious. You'll hear how the sub fills out the presentation without bringing attention to itself. That's exactly how a full-range loudspeaker would sound, is it not?

Jim

 

[morello777]

hi jim
yeah i guess thats true then i hear people say you gotta feel the sub so i guess then everything is cool just never had a sub and was a bit confused i thoght maybe the sub is damaged lol but glad you made it clear to me thanks a lot jim

 

[Timcognito]

Some music at the bottom of this page.

SLOW REDUCTION (THE HI-FI COLLECTIVE) [DIGITAL DOWNLOAD]

theaudiophilesociety.com

 

[Jim Taylor]

i hear people say you gotta feel the sub

I know people who thrive on highly boosted bass. Dubstep, techno, psytrance and goa all have levels of bass that are extreme ... and extremely boosted. But ... those will sound the same on a full-frequency-range floor-standing speaker as they do on a sub/sat system.

There are several things I look for regarding bass characteristics in a speaker setup. Distortion (frequently overlooked) is one of the most important. Some subs advertise that they go down to 16Hz or 20Hz, but they produce very high amounts of distortion. Reproduction of clean, low-distortion 40Hz bass at high levels will (IME) blow those grunge boxes away, both in the sensation of low bass and high SPL bass.

I feel that a high-quality sub is the cheapest route OVERALL to high-quality bass that goes deep and integrates well. Yours does.

Jim

 

[morello777]

cool good points thanks. you think the kh 750 should be well enough then?

 

[Jim Taylor]

cool good points thanks. you think the kh 750 should be well enough then?

Absolutely!
One thing I would advise is for you to play bass while walking around the room. You will discover constructive peaks and destructive nulls. Don't sit in the one of the nulls.

Jim

 

[morello777]

cool good point gonna try that out

 

[vamp]

Lol, same. Had a cheap multimedia sub and pair of Edifier speakers and got my self kh120II+750+ma1 and it felt like there is no BOOM at all, and was a bit disappointed of the $2000+ i spent on the sub. Almost one year after I like many other people who bought those speakers had to send them back to manufacture for repair and had to use Edifier speakers along with kh750 sub, I had to realign MA1 software and the BOOM came back lol, seems like speakers are not capable to produce sound below 80HZ so the sub does the job and it has greater SPL so I can feel the BOOM. It is nice for games, but music sounds muddy.
Also the positioning of kh750 in the room matters. I think ideally you need 2 kh750 one on the floor and one on the level of the listener, as at the bottom of the floor you get more clear sound and on the level of the listener you get the air pressure sensation.

 

[morello777]

glad you experienced the same i get used to it i think. at least when i bypass the sub i hear some low end is missing so that is a good sign.

i once testet the genelec sub and there i could really hear the sub much better which is not necessary better as like jim said with kh 750 it more sounds like a fullrange speaker which is good too i think

 

[Visor]

Hi all, so how are you doing now with the KH 750 DSP? I run into the same issue/disappointment. I had the KH 120 II and i wanted to make the set compleet and bought the KH 750 DSP G D. I run the MA-1 alignment and i was negatively surprised aswell, no boom and overall no + on the set of KH 120 II stand alone for me. Also a huge dip at 30HZ. I have contacted Neumann about this and waiting there response.

When i put the whole set on Local and i reduce the volume of the speakers then you will get the boom out of the sub. For me its important that i also can hear how my mix sounds in my car or other devices with subs. With the MA-1 alignment it was not representative for that. What are your thought on this?

 

[unpluggged]

When i put the whole set on Local and i reduce the volume of the speakers then you will get the boom out of the sub

Looks like you are misunderstanding the purpose of using a sub and of room EQ. The MA 1 did an excellent job for your listening conditions.

If you want "boom" (whatever that could mean), you need to use other means.

 

[dl95]

Here's how I see it:

There's two camps. Some who want to hear the boom from the sub and those who want the sub to blend in. For home theater you typically want the former with as much SPL as you can get but many people prefer the latter for more strictly music listening. KH 750 seems to fit in the latter camp along with subs from brands like Rythmik, REL while the former is brands like SVS, RSL. Bigger subs are better if you want that impact.

 

[Visor]

Looks like you are misunderstanding the purpose of using a sub and of room EQ. The MA 1 did an excellent job for your listening conditions.

If you want "boom" (whatever that could mean), you need to use other means.

You might be right that i am currently looking more for a listening set then a mix/mastering set. I have did the allignement today again and the results are indeed pretty good except the huge dip at 30Hz. Is there anything i can do about that?

 

[Visor]

Here's how I see it:

There's two camps. Some who want to hear the boom from the sub and those who want the sub to blend in. For home theater you typically want the former with as much SPL as you can get but many people prefer the latter for more strictly music listening. KH 750 seems to fit in the latter camp along with subs from brands like Rythmik, REL while the former is brands like SVS, RSL. Bigger subs are better if you want that impact.

Yes i think so aswell. Is there anyway you recommend for me to get a better result at 30Hz? This is the only thing i really do not like. I think further i must try to getting used to the flap respons and see what it brings me in my mixes. I really do like the neutral sound that Neumann gives. I had a set of Genelec8030CP with the 7050C and this set was banging the hell out of my room and overall the speakers were not my thing how the sounded.

 

[Kyle_PL]

I run the MA-1 alignment and i was negatively surprised aswell, no boom

... buy some cheap bommbox.

I have did the allignement today again and the results are indeed pretty good except the huge dip at 30Hz. Is there anything i can do about that?

You can change sobwoofer position in the room, and/or listetning point position.

 

[unpluggged]

except the huge dip at 30Hz

Actually this dip is corrected as much as is feasible, according to your MA 1 screenshot. And without the sub, I doubt there would be any response at 30 Hz, with dip or without. To avoid the dip, you should experiment with the sub's placement and your listening position in your room. But if this is not possible, I would not bother too much. You still got a very good result.

Genelec8030CP with the 7050C and this set was banging the hell out of my room

Then you must have done something wrong (considering no GLM in that set, that's more than likely).

 

[Visor]

... buy some cheap bommbox.


You can change sobwoofer position in the room, and/or listetning point position.

Thanks!

 

[Visor]

Actually this dip is corrected as much as is feasible, according to your MA 1 screenshot. And without the sub, I doubt there would be any response at 30 Hz, with dip or without. To avoid the dip, you should experiment with the sub's placement and your listening position in your room. But if this is not possible, I would not bother too much. You still got a very good result.


Then you must have done something wrong (considering no GLM in that set, that's more than likely).

Thanks! I indeed did not have a GLM. I think you guys are all right and my view of the working of a sub in my studio must be wrong. I do like the sound overall, very flat. Would you consider this 30Hz dip as not very noticeable?

 

[Mort]

Thanks! I indeed did not have a GLM. I think you guys are all right and my view of the working of a sub in my studio must be wrong. I do like the sound overall, very flat. Would you consider this 30Hz dip as not very noticeable?

That's a big and broad dip. Depends on the music you listen to. EDM and organ music won't sound as deep and full.