KEF R3 meta Measurements

[abdo123]

In what bizarro world is wider dispersion always superior?

I have enjoyed literally every wide dispersion experience i have had more than narrow dispersion.

 

[Steve Dallas]

I have enjoyed literally every wide dispersion experience i have had more than narrow dispersion.

Data point of one. Of course, this is not always the case:

KEF R3 vs. Philharmonic BMR Grudge Rematch to the Probably not Death Thread

As none of you recall, I tested the roadshow BMRs that Dennis was kind enough to ship all around the country last year and posted a lengthy thread about the experience. And, I ended up liking them enough to buy a pair. They even unseated my KEF R3s, which I sold shortly after receiving the...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[abdo123]

Data point of one. Of course, this is not always the case:

KEF R3 vs. Philharmonic BMR Grudge Rematch to the Probably not Death Thread

As none of you recall, I tested the roadshow BMRs that Dennis was kind enough to ship all around the country last year and posted a lengthy thread about the experience. And, I ended up liking them enough to buy a pair. They even unseated my KEF R3s, which I sold shortly after receiving the...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Well you asked in what world and i have answered that in mine it does

 

[Steve Dallas]

Well you asked in what world and i have answered that in mine it does

Fair enough. Bizarro World has a population of at least one!

 

[Vacceo]

In what bizarro world is wider dispersion always superior?

To my ears, smooth directivity trumps wide dispersion, and narrower dispersion often works better in small rooms, reflective rooms, etc.

I also prefeer narrow dispersion. It is easier to tune a multichannel system when the interaction of a lot of speakers with the room is a bit lighter.

 

[dogmamann]

Why would you assume someone has only used KEFs? If that is directed at me, you are hugely mistaken.

There is such a thing as a soundstage that is too wide. Lighting up the side walls in a small room creates reflections that smear that wide soundstage to the point many people would choose narrower dispersion.

And you did not answer the question. Why does a speaker having a single better trait automatically make it superior as a matter of fact?

Even if there is one category for which the much cheaper r series doing better than the references its a huge win, considering their price gap. In this case they are quite similar (old reference and new r metas) and metas has lower tweeter resonance due to the meta material (that’s what Kef claims, though I dont see it in measurements!!) also directivity is wider. The old references while tonally was an ok speaker, lacked soundstage width of many speakers under 1000 dollars.

 

[exm]

Even if there is one category for which the much cheaper r series doing better than the references its a huge win, considering their price gap. In this case they are quite similar (old reference and new r metas) and metas has lower tweeter resonance due to the meta material (that’s what Kef claims, though I dont see it in measurements!!) also directivity is wider. The old references while tonally was an ok speaker, lacked soundstage width of many speakers under 1000 dollars.

Can I ask you how would you know? Have you demoed them? Owned them? I have owned the Reference Fours (1990s), R900s, R11s and now Reference 5s (non-meta) as well as Model 100c, 200c, 204/2c, R2c, Reference 2c and now Reference 4c. For sides I have owned Reference Twos (1990s), R3s and now R3 Metas. So I can say with some authority that I have experience with Kef speaker. To say the lack soundstage width is utter (I want to use another "b" word, but I'll use): baloney.

 

[geox]

I'd like to hear comparisons with Polk R200 - which is nearly 1/3rd the price (here in Australia)

 

[dogmamann]

Can I ask you how would you know? Have you demoed them? Owned them? I have owned the Reference Fours (1990s), R900s, R11s and now Reference 5s (non-meta) as well as Model 100c, 200c, 204/2c, R2c, Reference 2c and now Reference 4c. For sides I have owned Reference Twos (1990s), R3s and now R3 Metas. So I can say with some authority that I have experience with Kef speaker. To say the lack soundstage width is utter (I want to use another "b" word, but I'll use): baloney.

You don’t need to demo them, you look at the graphs and you know the whole story

 

[Alexx]

I read that the new Meta series has a different crossover and also the components (especially capacitors) are of better quality than the previous series.

@geox: I listened to R 3 (not meta) with Polk R200, for my taste better Kef, it remained less tiring and more "warm" in the medium-high range.

Polk R200 too detailed and forward in the high range (the tweeter too present) reminded me of the Dali Opticn 6 MKII.

I repeat they are personal sensations but polk after a while listening tired due to the too present tweeter.
See you soon.

 

[dogmamann]

I read that the new Meta series has a different crossover and also the components (especially capacitors) are of better quality than the previous series.

@geox: I listened to R 3 (not meta) with Polk R200, for my taste better Kef, it remained less tiring and more "warm" in the medium-high range.

Polk R200 too detailed and forward in the high range (the tweeter too present) reminded me of the Dali Opticn 6 MKII.

I repeat they are personal sensations but polk after a while listening tired due to the too present tweeter.
See you soon.

Crossover parts should work, there is no audible difference between capacitor brands and cables. Kefs r series crossover is in the image attached. Looks well made imo to the specs they are needed. Exotic parts is needed for marketing, beyond which they don’t do anything.

 

[jackocleebrown]

Crossover parts should work, there is no audible difference between capacitor brands and cables. Kefs r series crossover is in the image attached. Looks well made imo to the specs they are needed. Exotic parts is needed for marketing, beyond which they don’t do anything.

Just going to leave this here:

 

[thewas]

You don’t need to demo them, you look at the graphs and you know the whole story

But there exist no comparable measurements from the R Meta and other KEF loudspeakers from the same source yet?

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

Just going to leave this here:
View attachment 275672

Hi
What does mean the green line? The red line in the first image can mean poor componentens and the blue the components from the r meta, but the green line?
Ty

 

[thewas]

Just going to leave this here:
View attachment 275672

Very interesting and surprisingly high differences, could it be that the ones with the high distortion were electrolytic capacitors and/or iron core inductors?

 

[jackocleebrown]

Hi
What does mean the green line? The red line in the first image can mean poor componentens and the blue the components from the r meta, but the green line?
Ty

These graphs are from the Reference white paper in 2014, they're not specific to the R-series or R-series META. But it's plainly false to say that "there is no audible difference between capacitor brands".

 

[jackocleebrown]

Very interesting and surprisingly high differences, could it be that the ones with the high distortion were electrolytic capacitors and/or iron core inductors?

It's a while ago so I can't remember exactly which components are in the graphs. But yes, electrolytic capacitors have easily measurable distortion and the distortion level varies from manufacturer to manufacturer for components with exactly the same spec. in Fig 54 the red and greed are most certainly two different types of electrolytic cap. I suspect the blue is a PP cap (PP caps all have very low distortion indeed). Cored inductors also have easily measurable distortion but there's big variation for components with the same specification depending on the core type, geometry and material.

 

[dogmamann]

. But it's plainly false to say that "there is no audible difference between capacitor brands".

Did you mean there are audible differences outside the measured parameters mostly discussed here ?

 

[Soniclife]

Just going to leave this here:
View attachment 275672

What were the filter frequencies for these tests? I'm guessing the distortion is highest at what would be the crossover frequency, and not at a frequency that is rolled off.

 

[jackocleebrown]

Did you mean there are audible differences outside the measured parameters mostly discussed here ?

I mean exactly what I wrote: it's plainly false to say that "there is no audible difference between capacitor brands" and I backed this up with objective data showing clear THD differences.