KEF R3 alternative for lower volumes

[blg]

I recently bought a pair of KEF R3's as my first bookshelf speakers, and I dont really feel comfortable with them.
Particularly electronic music at lower volumes (~60 db) sounds way too snappy to me and at these volumes the speaker isn't really able to generate a big soundstage. Correcting the loudness via EQ only helped a bit and I consider returning them for a set of speakers the excels at lower volumes and has a warmer signature better suited for electronic music. I'm having my eyes on the Focal Aria 906s, and would appreciate a few other suggestions.

 

[ZolaIII]

A pair of sub's high crossed (120 Hz) with those or other speakers in 2.2 setup and proper implemented equal loudness compensation to low 60's fairly good and low 50's good enough (not to mention bass improvement in higher SPL). Not easy nor cheap but high low bass boost won't translate good to anything that isn't cut in transition area and in the way it doesn't leak in low mids. You still probably won't have sense of big sound stage in small room (as it's not large club) nor a kick in sensation until you crunch it up to 80's at least that's physics.

 

[caioferrari]

I recently bought a pair of KEF R3's as my first bookshelf speakers, and I dont really feel comfortable with them.
Particularly electronic music at lower volumes (~60 db) sounds way too snappy to me and at these volumes the speaker isn't really able to generate a big soundstage. Correcting the loudness via EQ only helped a bit and I consider returning them for a set of speakers the excels at lower volumes and has a warmer signature better suited for electronic music. I'm having my eyes on the Focal Aria 906s, and would appreciate a few other suggestions.

If you want listen to lower volume you MUST use loudness.
If you don’t have enough bass, consider buying a smaller speaker and a sub.
You will never get deep bass from bookshelf’s. If you find a bass heavy book you will get a bloomy bass around 100 Hz.

 

[Ron Texas]

In the Key R3 review on this site you will see the frequency response has a bump above 4k which could be your problem. Try to EQ that out.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/kef-r3-speaker-review.12021/

 

[blg]

If you want listen to lower volume you MUST use loudness.
If you don’t have enough bass, consider buying a smaller speaker and a sub.
You will never get deep bass from bookshelf’s. If you find a bass heavy book you will get a bloomy bass around 100 Hz.

Thx, really appreciate the feedback. Not sure I want to take the risk buying a sub only to end up with a 2.1 setup that I still dont like because of the KEFs.
What would be some great, smaller alternatives?

 

[TankTop]

Ascend Acoustics EX V2 are a measurably better speaker for a little less money but like someone else mentioned you probably need to use a little EQ or loudness when listening at low volume. The KEF R3 is a great speaker and likely not your issue

 

[ZolaIII]

Elac DBR62 as cheap and not much worse nor smaller regarding woofer size, again pair of sub's (2.2), capable DSP and lot of work.

 

[FrantzM]

It is not the speaker : It is human anatomy. A 20 Hz signal reproduced 60 db at the listening position, is almost inaudible. 1000 Hz at that level is very clearly heard. You need to use Loudness compensation.
I use Audyssey DynEQ, a game changer IMHO. There are others, among these that of RME ADI. Audyssey Dynamic EQ (DynEQ), available on Denon and Marantz AVR, is the one I use. I can't fathom listening to music without loudness compensation.
It is not your Kef R3, to repeat. You would get the best speaker in the world, and listening at such low volume without loudness compensation would be the same experience.

Peace.

 

[DJNX]

The R3s sound fine at lower volumes. Sounds like you are trying to fix your sound with gear (unfortunately a common misconception in Hi-Fi). It’s time to do some reading and learning, otherwise you‘ll always be lost chasing after something you can’t even properly describe.

First of all: all bookshelves need a sub. No matter what the specs say or what you hear in reviews, every bookshelf will have a massive gap at the lowest frequencies.

"Big soundstage". The soundstage you get, from any speaker, is 90% based on speaker positioning, including your own positioning (where you seat).

"warm signature better suited for electronica", unfortunately doesn’t make any sense at all, as that statement is really based on nothing.
Not trying to get at you here, just letting you know before you go chasing inexistent gremlins in your audio.

 

[DJNX]

It is not the speaker : It is physics or betyter human anatomy. a 20 Hz signal at 60 dB is almost inaudible. You need to use Loudness compensation. I use Audyssey DynEQ, a game change IMHO. There are others, anong these that of RME ADI. Dynamci EQ (DynEQ) is the one I use and I can't fathom listening to music at various volume without loudness compensation.
It is not your Kef R3, to repeat. You would get te best speaker in the world and listening at such low volume without loudness compensation would be the same experience.

Peace.

That’s definitely part of the answer, but even at 60~65dB, a sub does plenty to compensate the lack of bass in bookshelves (and even for towers). Specially for electronica.

 

[DSJR]

Umm - Why do some experienced speaker designers around the world put in a lower kHz recess (I hesitate to call it a suckout!) to aid listening comfort in some speakers. I recall the KEF LS50 'corrected' a slightly hot lower kHz region in the Meta version and people liked it...

By all means use eq carefully to reduce this area, giving a subtle lack of 'glare' at lower levels (my bigger boxes had this designed in as I recall) but a speaker with larger bass-mid driver (and maybe slightly larger box too) might just do it better with a less 'Hifi' kind of bright, crisp-n-shiny sound (as the KEF visuals suggest all on their own before the things are even connected - don't EVER think the sound is 'just' what we pick up with our ears, that's why blind listening is so important in comparisons).

 

[FrantzM]

That’s definitely part of the answer, but even at 60~65dB, a sub does plenty to compensate the lack of bass in bookshelves (and even for towers). Specially for electronica.

Provided that you correct the sub to play a bit louder at those frequencies.. if you turn up the volume, the balance is lost and you have an overbearing sub...

Loudness Compensation is an important , neglected aspect of sound reproduction. Audyssey implementation is good, not perfect. I am told there are other. I haven't experienced these so can't opine.


Peace.

 

[Vacceo]

Electronica employs an important amount of sound below 100hz. It does not matter what bookshelf plays it, they are not suited for low frequencies. Either larger speakers (and even with those it´s not guaranteed) or subwoofers.

Best realization I had of this fact was listening to Prodigy´s Breathe with and without a subwoofer. Even with tower speakers, it did not reach the constant low bass humming of the song.

 

[caioferrari]

Thx, really appreciate the feedback. Not sure I want to take the risk buying a sub only to end up with a 2.1 setup that I still dont like because of the KEFs.
What would be some great, smaller alternatives?

You are trying to fell bass and sub bass at low volumes. I can’t tell how demanding you are about fidelity. There are plenty of speakers out there with “fake” bass, which means a peaky response on 80-100 Hz region. Klipsch is an example but it’s a huge step back compared with your Kefs.
A speaker brand that cares about quality will not give you a chest shaking bass with a bookshelf.

If you really want a high quality bass, you must have a sub. Any 10” seald sub will give you high quality bass on low volumes in a small footprint.

Since you’re adding a sub, a 5” book is more than enough to play higher frequencies.

But, if you want to try something without replacing your speakers, try some dynamic EQ like audissey (present on Marantz / Denon receiver). It will heavily increase your bass in low volumes.

 

[Steven Holt]

My friend, you're chasing a Unicorn. You want Indy - car speeds while driving a Honda sedan. FranzM and DJNX are correct. My suggestion? Use headphones.

 

[caioferrari]

Another thing you could try is change you speaker distance to the wall. It heavily changes your bass response.
If your speaker is too close, like an inch or so, your speaker is essentially in sealed mode, that kills the bass.
If you speaker is too far from the wall, like 20”, you loose part of the gain you could get.

 

[ZolaIII]

Meh low self filter (PEQ) @ 100~105 Hz will do the job just fine (as it does with headphones) too a point when slight boost in highs is also needed (which also can be implemented with similar sloping filter up there). What it can't do is limit impact to transition range and ensure that it scales to a demand especially in case of larger boost. That's why there is a need for a pair of sub's in per chenel and positioned to it configuration (2.2) with 120~130 Hz crossovers.

 

[steve59]

Try all the suggestions, and if still not satisfied demo the next speaker at home b4 purchase to insure it's a loudspeaker issue and not room, boundary, component issue or any other possible contributing problem.

 

[Pinkynator]

Buy a Yamaha amp with a loudness *knob*.

 

[blg]

Buy a Yamaha amp with a loudness *knob*.

I have that, doesnt really satisfy me. Also tried fiddling around with the parametric EQ of my wiim.

Next I'll borrow a sub from a friend to test if this makes a significant difference to my perceived sound. In case it doesn't, I'd still very much appreciate recommendations for speaker performing particularly well at lower volumes to demo at the local hifi store