Surprised it got this faror banned
Surprised it got this faror banned
They are not bad, but objectively reference 3 has no performance improvement that’s audible over r11. They are very very similar from graphs. Even though driver configuration is not same.
Nevertheless his point is still valid. There is a bigger different departing from Q series to R series, than comparing R series to The Reference line. The diminishing return rules can’t be changed.You can't just look at a bunch of frequency response curves and think they sound the same.
Erin from Erin's audio corner has hinted on YouTube that he's got a new KEF Reference 1 meta speaker at his place and I assume he will measure it soon.Nevertheless his point is still valid. There is a bigger different departing from Q series to R series, than comparing R series to The Reference line. The diminishing return rules can’t be changed.
I wouldn’t say the difference between the two aint audible. But is very difficult to proof that the percentage increase in price tag follows the percentage in gained performance, IMHO simply impossible.
This isn’t a bad or a good thing, just the result of a marketing mix, production costs and profits, basically a corporate strategy that is quite widespread among most of the players in the hifi scene.
You got different line ups for different clients, and that’s it. Every user segment will fit into their different series of products.
Same brand and almost similar directivity, they should sound similar. Atleast thats what I learned from here..You can't just look at a bunch of frequency response curves and think they sound the same.
what is interesting would be the non meta Reference 1 vs R3 as both of them doesnt have meta material.Erin from Erin's audio corner has hinted on YouTube that he's got a new KEF Reference 1 meta speaker at his place and I assume he will measure it soon.
Once he's done, we will be able to compare his previous measurements of KEF R3 vs the new Reference Meta, along with his subjective opinion.
I'm looking forward to his measurements and comments.
One of the goals of a product development/manufacturing organization is to make a new product cheaper than in the past with equal, or perhaps better, performance. Margins are all about investment and finally piece price. Remember, they're in business to make Sterling, not necessarily to make audio nirvana.Reference series came up in 2014 if m not wrong. Then in 2018 came up the current R series. Looking at the measurements, it looks like both are flat enough. I have not seen dircetivity measurements of Reference Series.
But from a technological standpoint isn’t R series more advanced as it would have incorporated whatever kef found between 2014 and 2018? Reference line never got an update if I am not wrong. Also no shadow flare on reference if m not wrong. So, can’t we safely say R11 is the best speaker out of KEFs square box design speakers ? I couldn’t find any flaw whatsoever on the R11. Is there any reason now still to conosder a reference series over the R in 2022?
The ref3 is new? If the answer if yes go for itLooking for new speakers to replace my R900 to match my new NAD M23. The R11 pair is now €3998 and the Ref 3 (2014) only €5950. What to choose? listening mostly to music like Max Richter, Johann Johannsson and Philip Glass.
Yes, but the version with the metal front, only.The ref3 is new? If the answer if yes go for it
Post pics backYes, but the version with the metal front, only.
M13? Do you know something I don't? If that is a real product coming soon, that sounds like a solid plan. However, if you're just hoping NAD releases something like that, why not spring for the M33, and have a nice 1400 watt system?My room is a bit of a challenge. 7x10 meter with the stereo in the corner. Got extra discount for the R11, only €3,289 for the pair. I am very satisfied, these fill the room with balanced HF and LF. NAD M23 pairs really well. Now waiting for the M13 to replace my C658.View attachment 220721
If The Reference 3's are new, go with those. Better bassresponse and (if you find it important), the buildquality is on another level.Looking for new speakers to replace my R900 to match my new NAD M23. The R11 pair is now €3998 and the Ref 3 (2014) only €5950. What to choose? listening mostly to music like Max Richter, Johann Johannsson and Philip Glass.
The NAD dealer told me it should already have been launched. But many high-end hifi brands are delaying their product launches due to the disrupted supply chain. End of the year or beginning next year.M13? Do you know something I don't? If that is a real product coming soon, that sounds like a solid plan. However, if you're just hoping NAD releases something like that, why not spring for the M33, and have a nice 1400 watt system?
I should have but suddenly it was €3289 vs €5950. But my decision will haunt me for a long time.If The Reference 3's are new, go with those. Better bassresponse and (if you find it important), the buildquality is on another level.
lolI should have but suddenly it was €3289 vs €5950. But my decision will haunt me for a long time.
Cool, happy for you.I’ve just found this thread, so I know it’s been a while since the last reply, but there’s a large audio store nearby where I live that hosts three completely acoustically treated rooms, with the largest one hosting the high-end speakers. They had the non-meta R11’s right next to the Reference 5’s.
I auditioned them a few months ago, side-by-side, and upon listening to them in a complete A/B test on the same Denon amplifier, it was almost laughable how little difference it made. It was so small, in fact, that my wife and I looked at each later a few times whenever he switched, simply shocked at how little difference there was sonically. There WAS a difference, however, but just so unimportant that it simply made no difference. The biggest difference was the 4x more expensive price, which instantly made us decide to go for the R11’s without any doubt (the Reference finish was black-glossy with the dirt-ugly brass drivers… ugh).
The dealer himself admitted it was criminal how little difference there was, and he was slightly concerned that KEF was undercutting their top speakers so many times since their release. It’s literally just a question of whether you can’t stand having Chinese-produced elements in the speakers or not.
Curious to test them sometime in the near-future to compare them against the meta versions instead. I expect almost no real difference, but I could be wrong.