Kef R Meta Series Release

[dogmamann]

To me is is the relation price vs what you gonna get, and this relation is worse now

You don’t know what are you getting now, from the company specs. Atleast that’s what you learn here after few days. So may be too early to judge. Also this is initial pricing, you never RRP at the dealer most of the times.

 

[abdo123]

Guys every single component has been changed, it’s not just the Uni-Q.

 

[Kachda]

The list price for R3 in the US seem similar to previous generation. All other models have gone up by 25% or so.

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

You don’t know what are you getting now, from the company specs. Atleast that’s what you learn here after few days. So may be too early to judge. Also this is initial pricing, you never RRP at the dealer most of the times.

Thats the thing, i bought the r7 when the prices didnt increase..
If you didnt have the previous series and you are looking at buying a new speaker shouldnt be a problem, but basically i have to pay much money for not so much

I really wanted to see a woofers with the p flex tech from the kc62

 

[holbob]

Guys every single component has been changed, it’s not just the Uni-Q.

Especially the price "component".

Picked up my R3 two weeks ago for only £899.

 

[dogmamann]

dimensions and woofers are same. Cabinet weight is somehow less. Croosvers and uniq is new.

Especially the price "component".

Picked up my R3 two weeks ago for only £899.

Can do the same with these after 4,5 years

 

[pjn]

Thats the thing, i bought the r7 when the prices didnt increase..
If you didnt have the previous series and you are looking at buying a new speaker shouldnt be a problem, but basically i have to pay much money for not so much

I really wanted to see a woofers with the p flex tech from the kc62

Based on the specs, there do seem to be some new damping materials in the cabinets of the new R-meta series - the "constrained layer damping" which basically looks like bass trap material - "converts vibration into heat". Not mentioned in the previous description. This would likely explain the reduced weight - less internal bracing. Impedance is 8ohm -> 4 ohm. Harmonic distortion numbers are not directly comparable - R7 old <0.3%, 120-20kHz; R7 meta <1% 76 Hz and above <0.5% 110 Hz - 20 kHz. Upper crossover - 2.9kHz -> 2.4 kHz, weight 69.2 lbs -> 64.6 lbs
Those titanium finish R7 metas sure are purty...

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

Based on the specs, there do seem to be some new damping materials in the cabinets of the new R-meta series - the "constrained layer damping" which basically looks like bass trap material - "converts vibration into heat". Not mentioned in the previous description. This would likely explain the reduced weight - less internal bracing. Impedance is 8ohm -> 4 ohm. Harmonic distortion numbers are not directly comparable - R7 old <0.3%, 120-20kHz; R7 meta <1% 76 Hz and above <0.5% 110 Hz - 20 kHz. Upper crossover - 2.9kHz -> 2.4 kHz, weight 69.2 lbs -> 64.6 lbs
Those titanium finish R7 metas sure are purty...

The constrained layer damp is also in the previous r series, maybe they reduce the wood around the uniq since it has MaT

https://assets.kef.com/uploads/cm/r2018_infosheet_en.pdf

Cabinet bracing All the cabinets in the new R Series benefit from Constrained Layer Damping bracing. Originally developed for the multiple award-winning LS50, this system utilises internal braces joined to the panels by a lossy interface rather than being adhered to it rigidly. This approach is highly effective at dissipating unwanted vibrations.

 

[dogmamann]

The constrained layer damp is also in the previous r series, maybe they reduce the wood around the uniq since it has MaT

So mat is basically a way to improve profit, while providing the same sound ?

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

So mat is basically a way to improve profit, while providing the same sound ?

To me it's both, the previous solution is not near as good as the MaT for it's work.

 

[tecnogadget]

So mat is basically a way to improve profit, while providing the same sound ?

Not exactly. Its a more refined and clever way to absorbe backwaves in comparison to vented tweeter, plus its a patented and proprietary tech.
The thing is that solely based on that upgrade, the difference between generations isn’t going to be pronounced. And the fault of that is that the previous R series was already an incredible speaker, so much that you can only marginaly improve it (the same with Blades & Reference).
Edit: Of course I expect a little bit of “voicing” upgrade by means of little tweaks in the UniQ driver and crossover. Im sure it’s not as simple as “sticking” the MAT to the back.

A refreshment of the R series with META technology is the right way to keep innovation on the segment mostly for future customers. A small percentage of 2018 R series will feel the urge to upgrade. It makes more sense for original series R owners circa 2011.

A hifi speaker isn’t like a smartphone, you don’t need to upgrade every September…unless you are not satisfied with the speaker to begin with

 

[pjn]

The constrained layer damp is also in the previous r series, maybe they reduce the wood around the uniq since it has MaT

https://assets.kef.com/uploads/cm/r2018_infosheet_en.pdf

Cabinet bracing All the cabinets in the new R Series benefit from Constrained Layer Damping bracing. Originally developed for the multiple award-winning LS50, this system utilises internal braces joined to the panels by a lossy interface rather than being adhered to it rigidly. This approach is highly effective at dissipating unwanted vibrations.

Ah, yes - I see that mentioned in Crutchfield's description. Odd that it isn't mentioned in the old Kef R series 2018 brochure. A stealth upgrade?

 

[dogmamann]

Not exactly. Its a more refined and clever way to absorbe backwaves in comparison to vented tweeter, plus its a patented and proprietary tech.
The thing is that solely based on that upgrade, the difference between generations isn’t going to be pronounced. And the fault of that is that the previous R series was already an incredible speaker, so much that you can only marginaly improve it (the same with Blades & Reference).
Edit: Of course I expect a little bit of “voicing” upgrade by means of little tweaks in the UniQ driver and crossover. Im sure it’s not as simple as “sticking” the MAT to the back.

A refreshment of the R series with META technology is the right way to keep innovation on the segment mostly for future customers. A small percentage of 2018 R series will feel the urge to upgrade. It makes more sense for original series R owners circa 2011.

A hifi speaker isn’t like a smartphone, you don’t need to upgrade every September…unless you are not satisfied with the speaker to begin with

When you look at the graphs, of course there is a difference but then when there is a difference in crossover, how can anyone reliably show the meta really improved something. Can anyone point out the “issues” the old version had that can be solved with the meta material.

May be future references will have a stack of metas working well for low frequencies as well then, eliminating the need of a sponges. One thing I always felt good about such materials is how well the manufacturing process can be controlled. When we arrange the damping material inside the boxes, depending upon how you arrange it, the sound changes as per my diy experience. With these things, you don’t have to worry about if. your factory worker screws up something.

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

When you look at the graphs, of course there is a difference but then when there is a difference in crossover, how can anyone reliably show the meta really improved something. Can anyone point out the “issues” the old version had that can be solved with the meta material.

May be future references will have a stack of metas working well for low frequencies as well then, eliminating the need of a sponges. One thing I always felt good about such materials is how well the manufacturing process can be controlled. When we arrange the damping material inside the boxes, depending upon how you arrange it, the sound changes as per my diy experience. With these things, you don’t have to worry about if. your factory worker screws up something.

seeying the ref meta series, the crossover change is for wider dispersion. imho

 

[dogmamann]

The constrained layer damp is also in the previous r series, maybe they reduce the wood around the uniq since it has MaT

https://assets.kef.com/uploads/cm/r2018_infosheet_en.pdf

Cabinet bracing All the cabinets in the new R Series benefit from Constrained Layer Damping bracing. Originally developed for the multiple award-winning LS50, this system utilises internal braces joined to the panels by a lossy interface rather than being adhered to it rigidly. This approach is highly effective at dissipating unwanted vibrations.

Honestly this thing was done by other companies in the past, this is a just a pet name Kef calls it. Nothing new they found here.

By the way he is the guy who is the developer of epos es14n in the other thread here.

 

[tecnogadget]

When you look at the graphs, of course there is a difference but then when there is a difference in crossover, how can anyone reliably show the meta really improved something. Can anyone point out the “issues” the old version had that can be solved with the meta material.

May be future references will have a stack of metas working well for low frequencies as well then, eliminating the need of a sponges. One thing I always felt good about such materials is how well the manufacturing process can be controlled. When we arrange the damping material inside the boxes, depending upon how you arrange it, the sound changes as per my diy experience. With these things, you don’t have to worry about if. your factory worker screws up something.

There isn’t any issue per se with the former Non Meta R series. As I pointe out before, it’s a refinement over something that worked already fine.

As a rough and hypothetical example: if A speaker has 0.150% distortion over most of the working audio band, and you manage to lower it to 0.100% for speaker B, you have slightly improved something that was already great, the improvement will be welcome even though discerning it by ear will be quite difficult.

Speaker design/manufacturing has reached the diminishing returns point in where there is little room for improvement, unless you come up with a very disruptive conception that “changes it all”.

If we don’t cheer up this kind of small but progressive improvements, then we could have stopped when 10% distortion was considered great decades ago…thanks fully not.

 

[wgb113]

Meta meh. A little disappointed that there's not more to differentiate them from the outgoing R series, even different aesthetics (other than the two new options) would have been welcome. I was awaiting this announcement to see if it'd be a worthwhile upgrade but alas it is not. I will instead be on the lookout for the non-Meta Reference 5 or 3 as potential replacements to my R11.

 

[Opal]

Meta meh. A little disappointed that there's not more to differentiate them from the outgoing R series, even different aesthetics (other than the two new options) would have been welcome. I was awaiting this announcement to see if it'd be a worthwhile upgrade but alas it is not. I will instead be on the lookout for the non-Meta Reference 5 or 3 as potential replacements to my R11.

Well i dont think the R Metas are targeted towards original R owners nor are they marketed or targeted as an upgrade from the R series. They are jus improving their line of products to make it even better for consumers who are looking to buy speakers at this price range.

 

[Zvu]

Unlike 2018 R series, R meta has better coax. It's motor has underhung voice coil, double gap, copper ring between the gaps, polymer chassis, meta absorber.

The only difference between R meta series and Reference meta series coax motors is ferrite magnet vs neodimium (in Reference).

I'm not sure in what world this isn't a substantial improvement ?

 

[sweetchaos]

They are jus improving their line of products to make it even better for consumers who are looking to buy speakers at this price range.

100%.

Kef employee said in a youtube interview that Kef is going "All in with Meta material", so I would expect every part of their lineup refreshed at some point.