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KEF LS50 Meta vs KEF R3

strummr

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Is there anything I need to adjust on my avr aka Denon s760h. I have and svs sb 1000pro when testing these two out? Or will audessy take care of offloading bass onto the sub?
You need to run the Audyssey setup every time with speaker changes, but it will set 'reference' settings based on the new configs. (the crossovers, levels, and speaker configs always need a little manual tweaking afterwards IMO)
 

sweetchaos

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Klipsch RP-504c is 2,5-way design which should be little better than 2-way MTM if listeners sitting wider on couch, right?
Don't think it will be better. It's still a MTM design, so it will have the same issues as other MTM center channels.

The only way around this is to get either:
1. Coaxial center, like the Kef Q/R series
2. 3-way W(T/m)W center
 

hch

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Where I live, the R3 pair alone are the same price as LS50Metas+KC-62. There is no contest at the same price point, the latter pairing blows away the R3 in every way imaginable (but requires a great deal more care in setting up/placement).

Not sure why KEF have such wildly varying prices from one country to the next…but your decision may depend on where you live.
Very strange price policy, here (Norway) the R3 is only 12.7% more expensive and right now the R3 is on sale for less than the LS50 Meta.
 

sweetchaos

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right now the R3 is on sale for less than the LS50 Meta.
When is the next flight out to Norway?

R3's for everyone!
You get an R3, you get an R3...everybody gets an R3!

you-get-a-6b314a3495.jpg
 

Ataraxia

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I think listening too close is not good for sound quality. For example here is a page by Genelec about sitting too close to their speakers harming sound quality: https://www.genelec.com/correct-monitors

There they even give estimates based on specific models, with larger models needing you to sit further away from the different drivers so the sound is more coherent. Neumann has minimum listening distance recommendations for their speakers and they increase as their speakers get larger.

I bring this up because I sit very close to my speakers currently out of nessesity. 19-20in away. The LS50 Metas don't go as loud in the bass but I'm already sitting so close. The R3 have better preference score but it's for far field. I wonder if at such short listening differences the LS50 Meta can eek out an advantage, especially since I'm comparing R3 to a speaker where the tweeter and the normal driver are at the same spot.

Also, page 9 of the R3 manual states the minimum recommended distance of the R3 from the wall is 9 inches. I can do like 3 inches away, that's it.
I'm listening to my Metas right now sitting at the desk in the picture. Just sublime nearfield IMO. PC runing Tidal or FLAC > USB Schiit Modi 3+ > Emotiva BasX A-100 > LS50 Metas


I'm still getting my impressions and it could be the amp and DAC but the Metas seem smoother and a little more smoother tonally than my R3's in my living room setup. However not apples to apples because I'm running the R3's with my Yamaha A2080 AVR, mostly Tidal controled by Mconnect.

 

pielover74

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I ended up returning the r3’s. I don’t know if I’m crazy. I couldn’t tell the difference between the two. They both sounded excellent no matter what content I played. I have an svs sb1000 pro and R2C as center with q150’s as rears. The r3’s looked better on my stand, but were much heavier and were larger. The ls50 meta is what I kept. Just don’t want any regrets and am hoping I didn’t miss anything with the R3’s
 

BrokenEnglishGuy

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I ended up returning the r3’s. I don’t know if I’m crazy. I couldn’t tell the difference between the two. They both sounded excellent no matter what content I played. I have an svs sb1000 pro and R2C as center with q150’s as rears. The r3’s looked better on my stand, but were much heavier and were larger. The ls50 meta is what I kept. Just don’t want any regrets and am hoping I didn’t miss anything with the R3’s
You only missed
Much less distortion
Less IMD
Maximum SPL




You won
better point source


But, if you like both speakers you won anyway
 

pielover74

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You only missed
Much less distortion
Less IMD
Maximum SPL




You won
better point source


But, if you like both speakers you won anyway
Are they both pretty similar if the db/volume isn’t really high? I honestly couldn’t tell a difference between the two.
 

phoenixdogfan

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The imd problem gonna be more problematic at higher volumes.

So if you doesn't crank the volume from these ls50m you are fine. Just keep the volume reasonable.
In a smaller room, I don't see why you would need the R3's. The Metas image as well as anything I've ever heard, and with a sub play as loud as most peope could want. No I don't crank them to rock concert levels b/c I do not wish to damage my hearing. Though if I want to I can just capture them on a PRIR on my A16 Realizer (and, yes I've a;ready done this) and play them at ear splitting levels over my HD 800s or LCD Xs.

The Purifi Eigentact is the perfect amp for these speakers. Probably the Hypex NC252 could also fill the bill.
 

BrokenEnglishGuy

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In a smaller room, I don't see why you would need the R3's. The Metas image as well as anything I've ever heard, and with a sub play as loud as I could want. No I don't crank them to rock concert levels b/c I do not wish to damage my hearing. Though if I want to I can just capture them on a PRIR on my A16 Realizer (and, yes I've a;ready done this) and play everything at ear splitting levels over my HD 800s or LCD Xs.

The Purifi Eigentact is the perfect amp for these speakers. Probably the Hypex NC252 could also fill the bill.
I have the R7+Purifi eigantakt in my smallish room
 

Ron Texas

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I ended up returning the r3’s. I don’t know if I’m crazy. I couldn’t tell the difference between the two. They both sounded excellent no matter what content I played. I have an svs sb1000 pro and R2C as center with q150’s as rears. The r3’s looked better on my stand, but were much heavier and were larger. The ls50 meta is what I kept. Just don’t want any regrets and am hoping I didn’t miss anything with the R3’s
With a sub(s) LS50's even the originals are hot stuff.
 

Ataraxia

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Soundstage is bigger with the R3's IMO.
In a smaller room, I don't see why you would need the R3's. The Metas image as well as anything I've ever heard, and with a sub play as loud as most peope could want. No I don't crank them to rock concert levels b/c I do not wish to damage my hearing. Though if I want to I can just capture them on a PRIR on my A16 Realizer (and, yes I've a;ready done this) and play them at ear splitting levels over my HD 800s or LCD Xs.

The Purifi Eigentact is the perfect amp for these speakers. Probably the Hypex NC252 could also fill the bill.

Have you compared to any class A/B amplifiers?
 

phoenixdogfan

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Soundstage is bigger with the R3's IMO.


Have you compared to any class A/B amplifiers?
Unless it were a blind A-B test with levels matched within .1db, what would be the point? I can tell you that the set up I have sounds impeccably clean, powerful, and non-fatiguing, and I don't know what more anyone could expect from sighted listening impressions.
 

BoredErica

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Unless it were a blind A-B test with levels matched within .1db, what would be the point? I can tell you that the set up I have sounds impeccably clean, powerful, and non-fatiguing, and I don't know what more anyone could expect from sighted listening impressions.
I'd just go for whatever looks better. Or cheaper. Metas are a bit smaller than R3 as well.

imo they're both fabulous looking and nice speakers either way. Can't do too poorly with either.
 
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Ataraxia

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Unless it were a blind A-B test with levels matched within .1db, what would be the point? I can tell you that the set up I have sounds impeccably clean, powerful, and non-fatiguing, and I don't know what more anyone could expect from sighted listening impressions.
The point is I'm trying to figure out a solid upgrade in electronics (and add Dirac) for my Metas and R3's. Since I have not heard every amp and don't really want to demo multiple amps at many thousand dollars each I'm asking for subjective impressions of LS50, Meta, and R3 owners.

Maybe I'll shoot for NAD M33, also been considering Arcam SA30. Maybe miniDSP SHD or studio with Purifi E....
 

BrokenEnglishGuy

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The point is I'm trying to figure out a solid upgrade in electronics (and add Dirac) for my Metas and R3's. Since I have not heard every amp and don't really want to demo multiple amps at many thousand dollars each I'm asking for subjective impressions of LS50, Meta, and R3 owners.

Maybe I'll shoot for NAD M33, also been considering Arcam SA30. Maybe miniDSP SHD or studio with Purifi E....
Just buy a Purifi eigentakt power amp, and you done. That power amp have been reviewed here.
 

pielover74

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Any advice on my center channel. I got the kef r2c along with my ls 50 metas and svs sb 1000pro. I felt like sometimes content sounded better without a center channel and the left and right don’t do as much when watching content with the R2C being used in center. Also can’t figure out how to turn down the bass on the FR/FL and Center channel on my Denon s760h. Seems I can only turn down my subwoofer level
 

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KMO

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Any advice on my center channel. I got the kef r2c along with my ls 50 metas and svs sb 1000pro. I felt like sometimes content sounded better without a center channel and the left and right don’t do as much when watching content with the R2C being used in center. Also can’t figure out how to turn down the bass on the FR/FL and Center channel on my Denon s760h. Seems I can only turn down my subwoofer level

First of all, reposition the R2C so it's at the front edge of your cabinet. Sound reflections from the top of the cabinet will be generating an uneven response. (Then you'll just need to worry about the light reflections from the top of the R2C...) And readjust distance/level settings and/or rerun Audyssey.

Certainly the centre's going to be doing more work than the L+R.

If listening to 2.0 music via the Dolby Surround upmix, you probably want to turn on "Centre Spread". Should normally be off for TV stuff where you want the centre focus on the screen.

But it may be the case that you ultimately prefer sticking with Stereo mode for 2.0 music. The centre channel is primarily there to anchor dialogue and other sound effects to the screen for off-centre viewers. That anchoring can have the effect of excessively collapsing the stereo image in a music upmix, hence the "Centre Spread" option (similar to Dolby Pro Logic II Music mode), which compromises by using all 3 fronts for "centre" signals.

Multichannel music can choose how to use the 3 fronts - so the mixer effectively has a "width" control in addition to basic panning - but when you're feeding it 2.0 stereo, then any use of the centre is deviating from the original mix intent. Music in multichannel film and TV will often also be using just L+R.

The S760H does have a tone control, but apparently it doesn't work with Audyssey Dynamic EQ enabled. You should be able to achieve tone shifts via the Audyssey editor app if necessary.
 
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