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KEF LS50 Meta vs KEF R3

BrokenEnglishGuy

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Can you specify please? What does this shadow flare does?
The shadow flare can change the directivity, lower the distortion a bit and change a bit the FR.
SPL%20Horizontal.png


SPL%20Horizontal.png
 

BoredErica

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Difference in preference score between LS50 and Meta is 0.7 w/ sub+eq which is enough to be significant, and 1.1 without either which is very significant.
 

alitomr1979

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My summary of listening to the R3s, LS50s (og, meta, actives): for big room/distance use r3. Else ls50. I cannot find a huge difference in the sound signature beyond the simple neutral KEF sound.

When I really want something substantially better, I will get B&W 805d3/4 as they are a step above all the KEFs I have listened to for the genre of music I like (vocals, jazz etc). For instrumentals, the KEFs are as good for my ears.
I wasn’t impressed by the previous flagship Diamond series. I then Heard an RBH that costs 39k usd and that thing was amazing, but to be fair I must say the RBH were powered by much more expensive and supposedly much better electronics. With that said, the Diamonds were powered by an all McIntosh system.

And will that said, I couldn’t let pass a 50% discount on a pair of 706 s2, and now I have a pair of LS50W about to go on sale…
 

envydd

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I wasn’t impressed by the previous flagship Diamond series. I then Heard an RBH that costs 39k usd and that thing was amazing, but to be fair I must say the RBH were powered by much more expensive and supposedly much better electronics. With that said, the Diamonds were powered by an all McIntosh system.

And will that said, I couldn’t let pass a 50% discount on a pair of 706 s2, and now I have a pair of LS50W about to go on sale…
Where did you see the 706s go for 50% less? That’s way better than the current deal on the R3s (which is pretty good too!)
 

alitomr1979

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Where did you see the 706s go for 50% less? That’s way better than the current deal on the R3s (which is pretty good too!)

The deal lasted for a couple hours in Best Buy. I found out on Reddit and try to share it here in these forums but apparently nobody here could take advantage of the discount. Basically all Bowers and Wilkins bookshelf speakers were discounted 50%. Even the Formation Duo went at 2500usd.
 

f1shb0n3

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You do know that physics have changed since 2019 right ;)
Just pulled the trigger on R3 while still on sale. Struggled with the fact that they will probably release a successor to R3 this year based on their track record of product updates and I will regret not waiting, but hey - how much is left to improve in R3, what would a potential "R3 Meta" do significantly better? Physics won't change, a good speaker today will be a good speaker for quite a long time (e.g. Salon 2)
 

alitomr1979

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Where did you see the 706s go for 50% less? That’s way better than the current deal on the R3s (which is pretty good too!)

The deal lasted for a couple hours in Best Buy. I found out on Reddit and try to share it here in these forums but apparently nobody hear could take advantage of the discount. Basically all Bowers and Wilkins bookshelf speakers were discounted 50%. Even the Formation Duo went at 2500usd.
Just pulled the trigger on R3 while still on sale. Struggled with the fact that they will probably release a successor to R3 this year based on their track record of product updates and I will regret not waiting, but hey - how much is left to improve in R3, what would a potential "R3 Meta" do significantly better? Physics won't change, a good speaker today will be a good speaker for quite a long time (e.g. Salon 2)

For me, "improvement" would be a little more energy on the top, which will make it sound "more transparent" to some, and will make them "intolerably piercing" to others. Basically I think they are trying to identify what would be preffered by a majority or some of those who dislike the current version to work in a voicing that pleases them, while improving some metrics that human hearing might or might not be able to appreciate. And then add some real, most likely incremental improvements that are the result of experience and research, and you will likely have a better product.

It is the same with everything. It is likely that the new version, when it comes out, be that 2022 or 2024 will retail at 2500USD, or maybe more, and then it is not that you have an inferior product, it is that you have 90-98% of the flavor of the month after paying 68% of its price and after having been enjoying them for several months/years.

You just bought one of the best bookshelf speakers one can buy. Just enjoy them!
 

BoredErica

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Just pulled the trigger on R3 while still on sale. Struggled with the fact that they will probably release a successor to R3 this year based on their track record of product updates and I will regret not waiting, but hey - how much is left to improve in R3, what would a potential "R3 Meta" do significantly better? Physics won't change, a good speaker today will be a good speaker for quite a long time (e.g. Salon 2)
Outside of something like cardioid pattern speakers like D&D, if R3m is going to be a good bit better than R3 then that preference score ought to be a decent clip over 9, which would make R3m the best speakers measured yet by that metric. Possible, but I find that unlikely. That is asking a ton from Kef.

I think you can't go wrong with R3 right now.
 

f1shb0n3

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For me, "improvement" would be a little more energy on the top, which will make it sound "more transparent" to some, and will make them "intolerably piercing" to others.
With directivity that great R3 should be incredibly EQ-able speaker and allow for customization of treble to taste.
I myself prefer a slightly sloping down treble (-1dB at @1kHz, -3dB at 20kHz), while R3 seems to be a bit elevated instead. I trust Dirac Live though will mold R3 to perfect adherence to my taste.

Outside of something like cardioid pattern speakers like D&D, if R3m is going to be a good bit better than R3 then that preference score ought to be a decent clip over 9, which would make R3m the best speakers measured yet by that metric. Possible, but I find that unlikely. That is asking a ton from Kef.
If R3's smooth but narrow radiation is widened a bit it will be a win. If physics allow it.
 

BrokenEnglishGuy

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With directivity that great R3 should be incredibly EQ-able speaker and allow for customization of treble to taste.
Yes, the speaker can change very easily with EQ, their directivity it's very nice if you know how to work with

If you know how to use the EQ basically you can change the FR from R series very easilly because of their very nice directivity control.
Personally i like the mids and highs from my R7. It's a bit smooth and i like it.
 

alitomr1979

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Has anyone three R3 in a home theater setting?

Get them already! haha. Seriously, for home theater the LS50 Meta dont stand a chance against the R3. I´d get the R2C just because it will be very hard to find another person who wants a third R3, and that would make the R3 as LCR almost 4k at current pricing.

This remained saved as a draft. I wrote it a couple days ago when the special pricing was still going. @Descartes I would still get the R3 at regular pricing above the metas if the main usage is home theater.
 

tifune

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Pictures please

Sure. Usually I keep the fireplace a little more tidy but been very sick this week - basically wake up, make a fire for ambiance, take meds, lay down and listen to Depeche Mode or Bjork surround mixes, get up to take meds and stoke fire, repeat. Just discovered Electric Ladyland in 5.1 this morning, so that's been nice. You know it's bad when you work from home and still had to take off the whole week. Tested negative for COVID, flu A/B plus I'm vaccinated+boosted and got my flu shot so no idea what's up...

I have a R2C as well but I can't decide what to do with it. Option 1 is right above the screen in a more traditional center arrangement. Problem there is I never seem to like centers with music whether it's native multichannel or upmixed. I'm also not sure how it would blend with what's already present - it's a hell of a lot of work for it to end up sounding bad. And I can't just undo it because I'd have holes in the wall.

Option 2 is put it way up high as a center height channel. Downside is I'd have to hire. I don't have the gall or the tools to lift 44lbs of speaker 10ft high. Also, not a whole lot of center height material out there. Atmos doesn't even recognize it.

What say you all?

Yes, those are LS50 Meta as rear Dolby. I can't find a means of mounting any sort of rear height that scores acceptably in the WAF unless I drill into that stone, which I prefer not to do. I originally bought them for front height, but they did not blend at all with the R3 or R5. I was taken aback how distracting it was - I now know exactly what people mean when they say multichannel needs to be timbre matched. With the R3/R5 combo it's like my whole wall is a speaker, it's the epitome of "speakers that disappear.". That's my hesitation around adding R2C, nervous I'll ruin that effect.

If I can ever find a screaming deal on R11 I plan on moving the R5's to surround but using these little KH80s for now because their cute stature got them just high enough on the WAF score to pass muster. I tried some LSX's there but the software is AWFUL. At that point, the only upgrade I would consider is Be or Ultima but even setting aside the exorbitant cost I'm not sure 70+ degrees of beamwidth will sound good in this room. As you can see, it's highly reverberant and we don't want to add any treatment unless we can find something that augments the aesthetic rather than detracts.

Finally, I'm sure someone will ask. The R3's have threaded holes in the bottom so I used eye bolts and 75lb carabineers to hang then upside down. Yes, this is a risk. No, I do not advocate that *you* do it - it's a calculated risk on my part and obviously they weren't intended to be used this way. I tested in my office by letting them hang in the closet for 2 weeks and saw no noticeable signs of stress, so I went for it. Because the R5's are almost directly under the R3's it's highly improbable anyone would ever be standing there should they fall. When I get around to adding the R2C I'm also going to add another layer of R3 support just in case, maybe some ratchet straps on another eye hook in the beam - not sure yet.
 

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Ataraxia

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Sure. Usually I keep the fireplace a little more tidy but been very sick this week - basically wake up, make a fire for ambiance, take meds, lay down and listen to Depeche Mode or Bjork surround mixes, get up to take meds and stoke fire, repeat. Just discovered Electric Ladyland in 5.1 this morning, so that's been nice. You know it's bad when you work from home and still had to take off the whole week. Tested negative for COVID, flu A/B plus I'm vaccinated+boosted and got my flu shot so no idea what's up...

Bravo with health and audio/video ingenuity. Sometimes zero is the answer or there is no answer. Excellent room I can imagine the tranquility and relaxation at late evening.
 

dshreter

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I have a R2C as well but I can't decide what to do with it. Option 1 is right above the screen in a more traditional center arrangement. Problem there is I never seem to like centers with music whether it's native multichannel or upmixed. I'm also not sure how it would blend with what's already present - it's a hell of a lot of work for it to end up sounding bad. And I can't just undo it because I'd have holes in the wall.
I think I'm seeing a projector and screen there. Could you use an acoustically transparent screen and place another R5 or R3 behind it? That seems ideal.
 
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