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KEF Blade 2 vs Ascend ELX Towers as End Game

You posted Buchard's measurement, right? I've seen it before.

Otherwise I checked Erin's measurements for the A700 since it's complete and the speaker structure hasn't change that much between A700 and A700 LE, also looked at the A700 LE measurements from Buchardt themselves, and also cross checked Erin's measurements of the small bookshelves with their new tweeter and waveguide since this is present in the 700 LE.
So you looked at the 2022 Neutral/Stock tuning?

I'm not sure of the specifics, but it looks like the current tuning is different.

At any rate, it's a cool idea, running a speaker like this off the preouts instead of an amp (with most AVRs like the Denons, you have to externally amplify 2 of the speakers to do 7.1.4). The only question it would leave is, what do you do for a center channel.
 
So you looked at the 2022 Neutral/Stock tuning

I'm not sure of the specifics, but it looks like the current tuning is different.

At any rate, it's a cool idea, running a speaker like this off the preouts instead of an amp (with most AVRs like the Denons, you have to externally amplify 2 of the speakers to do 7.1.4). The only question it would leave is, what do you do for a center channel.
To be honest, I don't consider frequency response the most important in a DSP controlled speaker, it's something you can EQ yourself later too. I was more interested in the directivity of the tunings Buchardt provided.
 
To be honest, I don't consider frequency response the most important in a DSP controlled speaker, it's something you can EQ yourself later too. I was more interested in the directivity of the tunings Buchardt provided.
This is true.

And the constant directivity from the waveguide helps a lot, at least above the crossover. You can see it in the S400 MKII as well. They should be very similar, once you flatten the frequency response. XO is at 1800 Hz on this speaker:


CEA2034 -- Buchardt S400 MKII.png



Buchardt S400 MKII Horizontal Contour Plot (Normalized).png


Buchardt S400 MKII_360_Horizontal_Polar.png
 
Yes, Buchardt can make very well measuring speakers.
 
Call Ascend and they will say the ELX towers are endgame. Erin refers to the Blades as end game. Not trying to get anybody to say who is right as I know this is subjective but is the law of diminishing returns very evident here? Would it be worth spending $5000 more or so to get a used pair of Blade 2’s over the ascends? Both would be used for music and HT with subs in a large room.
I realized that this thread is almost 1 year old, so not sure if you made any purchase yet.

If not the Ascilab are very much end game as well. And they have passive towers on the horizon.
 
Will absolutely give it a try.

But I want to emphasize that the ELX RAAL is absolutely a beast of a speaker and better than any other speakers that I previously own, including a pair of Revel F226Be. You simply cannot go wrong with the ELX RAAL even when compared to much more expensive speakers.
How is the ELX better than the f226be?
 
Larger sound stage, sharper imaging and better bass. . .much better. . .by miles.

I fired up an old Al Di Meola CD, "Kiss My Axe", the other day and could not believe the HUGE, broad, deep soundstage. Compared to my old fronts it was night and day. I have the RAAL tweeter. If you want to hear dynamics, that CD and ELX rock.
 
Kef Blades for me because they are my EQ-able and have better vertical dispersion.
You are not wrong about the vertical directivity. But it's not too much of an issue if you are staying tweeter level.

As for EQ-ability. That is determined by the DI, the ELX DI is pretty good.


15244.png
 
You are not wrong about the vertical directivity. But it's not too much of an issue if you are staying tweeter level.

As for EQ-ability. That is determined by the DI, the ELX DI is pretty good.


View attachment 550209
Ascend Acoustics is definitely a speaker brand I would consider buying.

Since I’m British, Kef is easier to buy in the UK and do I prefer wide vertical dispersion so I don’t have to worry about being exactly ear height or being able to sit back in my chair.
 
I just went for the ELX Ribbons despite living in Europe and decided to switch from a silent reader to a contributor.
Having a special connection to ASR since the Klippel NFS is put into focus for speaker measurements, I did my studies in the home town of Wolfgang Klippel and even attended on lecture he gave at my university. I did not go the audio path rather than radio frequency engineering, but it is interesting to see that everything in the audio signal chain seem to be solved except for the loudspeaker and most similarities apply to what we call „antenna“ in RF, except an antenna typically does not generate any kind of distortion.
What catched me: it is quite obvious that Dave from Ascend knows what he is talking about if he addresses any source of audible distortion from drivers or why he went for a specific choice for cabinet, driver or his interpretation of measurement data. Everything in a very transparent way, just good engineering.
That is why I first wanted to go for the Sierra some years back but I got a very good deal on Revel F228Be 2 hours away. The Revels replaced my Kef Reference 3, because if one general statement can be derived from this website (and studies): Go for wide dispersion. Back than, the review of F328Be and F228Be were top notch. And I absolutely agree: Wide dispersion is recognized immediately, no A/B level matched zero delay comparison needed, it is too obvious. I moved houses and my glossy white F228Be did not fit to rest. I also do not like build quality of Revel, that is why I did not but F328Be on my shortlist.
I put my Revels for sale and looked into Ascilab C8C, Kef Blade 2 (used), Perlisten S5T or Arendal 1528 Tower. Given shipping, import, taxes tariffs (drivers imported from Europe and imported back as towers) and what not, the Ascends are not the clear price winner in this comparison but I pulled the trigger, waiting about 2 months, waiting for restock of the natural finish. I had the Kef LS60 for some days in the meantime as the preference score is one of the highest and I like the look and quality. After side-by-side comparison to the Revels, I decided to return them due to narrow dispersion, they did not catch me in any way, especially that I was forced to use an app. One guy on this forum went for LS60 to Colibri, I understand his motivation.

Now the ELX are here and I enjoyed them for 1 week, not yet room corrected with MiniDSP Dirac.
First thing I noticed was the lower sensitivity to my Revels, but luckily I could add one additional preamplifier in my Audiophonics S400ET by closing a jumper. Enough power now (max volume 70% till now).

My impression is that F228Be is (no surprise) a very good speaker. The ELX do not add anything outer space to my listening experience but I think I get the specialities of the ribbon tweeter and most importantly, the speakers seem to harmonize way better to my room in the bass. My favorite song to test bass is "Marian Hill - Play" as those little shock waves, transients, pulses you name it: This is physical bass to your chest and the ELX seem to reproduce those way clearer than the Revels. I will do measurements coming week to compares both room responses. The bass is interesting as I remember the Revels to dig a little deeper but the ELX seem to have cleaner bass which maybe does not sound „deep“.
 
I just went for the ELX Ribbons despite living in Europe and decided to switch from a silent reader to a contributor.
Having a special connection to ASR since the Klippel NFS is put into focus for speaker measurements, I did my studies in the home town of Wolfgang Klippel and even attended on lecture he gave at my university. I did not go the audio path rather than radio frequency engineering, but it is interesting to see that everything in the audio signal chain seem to be solved except for the loudspeaker and most similarities apply to what we call „antenna“ in RF, except an antenna typically does not generate any kind of distortion.
What catched me: it is quite obvious that Dave from Ascend knows what he is talking about if he addresses any source of audible distortion from drivers or why he went for a specific choice for cabinet, driver or his interpretation of measurement data. Everything in a very transparent way, just good engineering.
That is why I first wanted to go for the Sierra some years back but I got a very good deal on Revel F228Be 2 hours away. The Revels replaced my Kef Reference 3, because if one general statement can be derived from this website (and studies): Go for wide dispersion. Back than, the review of F328Be and F228Be were top notch. And I absolutely agree: Wide dispersion is recognized immediately, no A/B level matched zero delay comparison needed, it is too obvious. I moved houses and my glossy white F228Be did not fit to rest. I also do not like build quality of Revel, that is why I did not but F328Be on my shortlist.
I put my Revels for sale and looked into Ascilab C8C, Kef Blade 2 (used), Perlisten S5T or Arendal 1528 Tower. Given shipping, import, taxes tariffs (drivers imported from Europe and imported back as towers) and what not, the Ascends are not the clear price winner in this comparison but I pulled the trigger, waiting about 2 months, waiting for restock of the natural finish. I had the Kef LS60 for some days in the meantime as the preference score is one of the highest and I like the look and quality. After side-by-side comparison to the Revels, I decided to return them due to narrow dispersion, they did not catch me in any way, especially that I was forced to use an app. One guy on this forum went for LS60 to Colibri, I understand his motivation.

Now the ELX are here and I enjoyed them for 1 week, not yet room corrected with MiniDSP Dirac.
First thing I noticed was the lower sensitivity to my Revels, but luckily I could add one additional preamplifier in my Audiophonics S400ET by closing a jumper. Enough power now (max volume 70% till now).

My impression is that F228Be is (no surprise) a very good speaker. The ELX do not add anything outer space to my listening experience but I think I get the specialities of the ribbon tweeter and most importantly, the speakers seem to harmonize way better to my room in the bass. My favorite song to test bass is "Marian Hill - Play" as those little shock waves, transients, pulses you name it: This is physical bass to your chest and the ELX seem to reproduce those way clearer than the Revels. I will do measurements coming week to compares both room responses. The bass is interesting as I remember the Revels to dig a little deeper but the ELX seem to have cleaner bass which maybe does not sound „deep“.
Welcome to ASR! Enjoy your Ascend ELX Ribbons!
 
Larger sound stage, sharper imaging and better bass. . .much better. . .by miles.
Sorry. I find that hard to believe. Erinsaudiocorner has a review of the F226Be. He has stated that the soundstage width encompasses the side walls and he believes stage width doesn't go further than that. So best chance the soundstage is the same with a difference in imaging and bass. Revel f226be also has a waveguide, hard to imagine it imaging worse than the ELX.
 
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My impression is that F228Be is (no surprise) a very good speaker. The ELX do not add anything outer space to my listening experience but I think I get the specialities of the ribbon tweeter and most importantly, the speakers seem to harmonize way better to my room in the bass.
So there wasn't a big difference between your revels and the elx? That's what im hearing from most non-biased opinions.
 
Sorry. I find that hard to believe. Erinsaudiocorner has a review of the F226Be. He has stated that the soundstage width encompasses the side walls and he believes stage width doesn't go further than that. So best chance the soundstage is the same with a difference in imaging and bass. Revel f226be also has a waveguide, hard to imagine it imaging worse than the ELX.

From my recollection, soundstage was bigger. Data shows slightly wider radiation at higher frequency.

15299.png

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I also do not like build quality of Revel
100%, at first sight, they seemed to be great quality. After owning them for a while and really getting to scrutinized them, built quality is poor.
 
The ELX ... speakers seem to harmonize way better to my room in the bass.
That's not surprising, as the ELX Ribbon Tower speakers have a much lower F3 than do the F228Be speakers.
My favorite song to test bass is "Marian Hill - Play" as those little shock waves, transients, pulses you name it: This is physical bass to your chest and the ELX seem to reproduce those way clearer than the Revels.
As shown below, the frequency content of that track has got lots of energy in the 40–48 Hz range. This is in a region where the F228Be speakers are rolling off, while the ELX Ribbon Towers are still relatively flat in their response.

1786354704263.png
 
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