There is! Just not on those particular cables to the midrange.
I would rather Dacron or polyester fibrefill in the cabinet. There is only light foam on the walls.
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Kali audio IN-8 V2 measurements
- Thread starter Nuyes
- Start date
There is! Just not on those particular cables to the midrange.
I would rather Dacron or polyester fibrefill in the cabinet. There is only light foam on the walls.
Do you think 160hz seems a little low for an undamped woofer/baffle interface issue?Rub/fuzz is not an uncommon problem and usually manifests as high order distortion. I’m talking 5th, 6th, 7th harmonics, 9th harmonics. They are totally unrelated to the musical signal.
The thing is, they are easily audible to the human ear. You don’t need a Klippel, but you need to know what to see if you’re measuring your speaker (usually with ear muffs on- who can bear that brrrrrrzzzzzup after the n-th time?)
And one must not lump all higher order distortion together.
Reference:
What can happen when a driver is “fixed” to the baffle without a vibration absorbing gasket:
A 3 way design study
But there looks like slight increase in distortion (not much though) at some other places too.. :D Maybe I am trying the wrong notch filter for this driver. Maybe I should target the 1st breakup peak at the start of 3kHz instead of somewhere in the middle of that breakup shelf. :) Distortion...www.diyaudio.com
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It doesn’t occur to all samples.
I wonder whether they were products purchased locally? I bought mine before they were available locally. So it had come all the way from Germany to Australia.
Wouldn't port resonance be much higher in frequency in this size box/tuning? Internal standing waves or some panel resonance? Would be nice if there were an easy diy fix.
oh lord, there's No foam in the lp-8 either! means the whole lineup is like that, every model can get problem like this thread this measurement mentioned
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This is such a worried-well-world.
The problem is really overblown.
Thin vibrating cables inside a speaker cabinet may or may not be an audible problem, because there are a ton of things in your room that vibrate ALL the time.
And guess what happens when things in our room go brrr, bzzz or boom?
“Look what my speaker did?!
That’s just Awesome!!!”
The problem is really overblown.
Thin vibrating cables inside a speaker cabinet may or may not be an audible problem, because there are a ton of things in your room that vibrate ALL the time.
And guess what happens when things in our room go brrr, bzzz or boom?
“Look what my speaker did?!
That’s just Awesome!!!”
serious design fault can be overlooked and blow in the wind like nothing
let's say the final word: why bother,
there're many $5 earbuds with great deisgn
Your comparison to packed-in or $5 earbuds doesn’t make sense to me.
This is a speaker. And well designed one at that.
Have you got a IN8 V2 speaker okok?
Well I do.
Did you see the time stamp?
July 17.
I bought this myself, with my own money, for my own personal use (home gym) in June 2022.
And was blown away a how Kali were able to sell such a great speaker for such a low retail price.
@KaliAudio_Official
So I deconstructed it in an attempt to see if I can finally put away my tools, give away that work bench, and rest my arms and back, not bother with DIY.
That was the the goal. Is it better than what I can build (for US$300). And the answer is an emphatic YES!
No other agenda.
I felt no need to post measurements or do a review of it.
I listened to mine.
I measured it.
And Listened some more.
No problems whatsoever.
I don’t have that “200-400Hz HOHD issue”
I thought I had a narrow band resonance issue, but having listened it for hours both soft and loud, its not audible.
Taking measurements is hard, interpreting them is even harder. The thing about the Klippel MFS is that it’s a heartbreaker- because it sees everything is ULTRA-HIGH resolution.
Is it a problem, or are you going looking for a problem.
When you buy a new car.
Whats the first thing you do? drive it?
Or do you take it to your mechanic and ask him/her to put it on the dyno, blast it, then take it apart and point out all its little issues, and critique at how well it’s been put together, it’s looks, it’s value, or how it could be done better, or differently?
Of course no one does the latter, but if you did,
I guarantee you that if you looked under a microscope, every car that comes off the production line has a problem.
Nothing is 100% perfect. But does it matter? Because as long as it does its job, then that’s then that’s fine.
When and if minor issues manifest in a problem that’s when you should take it up with your vendor and seek advice/assistance.
So whatever was the concern from the speaker- it wasn’t there until Nuyes pointed it out, and from there forward the owner couldn’t un-see or un-hear it.
Isn’t it unfair to be making generalisations as being a manufacturing problem when you’ve tested only 2 samples?
It is deserving of:
“Oh lord!”
“Serious design fault”?
Get real.
IMHO it’s making a mountain out of a molehill.
@Zvu Don’t ever invite a a builder into your house, and ask him to point out all the defects and flaws, before you even noticed them. And you’ll never sleep again.
Just giving a bit of perspective on this “issue”
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OP
- Thread Starter
- #49
These are from owners who purchased the Kali audio's latest product (IN-5) .
It is wired and foam processed.
Kali audio is a great manufacturer.
They recognized the problem, improved the product, and are manufacturers who can communicate with consumers quickly and correctly.
This is ideal, and I think many manufacturers should follow suit.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #51
The problem would have been solved because the manufacturer improved it in the manufacturing process.
I just ask Kali about issue in this thread . The original question is not about that. Thing just pop up in my head, and I just ask as convenient
Nate Baglyos reply like that . The answer helps a bit but not totally
I will receive Kali IN8 V2 in the next 2 months or so. Will open its back and have a look. It should make a confirmation for all of us
Nate Baglyos reply like that . The answer helps a bit but not totally
I will receive Kali IN8 V2 in the next 2 months or so. Will open its back and have a look. It should make a confirmation for all of us
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Are you using those (either model) in a nearfield monitoring position or for general music listening? We will be downsizing in the foreseeable future from a big home to a smaller place where I won't have room for a big system and have been considering the IN-8v2 as a good option. Goal is a miniPC music server, running software based room correction, to a USB DAC with volume control with balanced out to some powered monitors with adequate low end to not use a sub.
I'm in the middle of setting up a modest multichannel system with IN-8 v2 as the LCR. I only have the left and right speakers set up, so far. My "room" is modest in size, but with a vaulted ceiling and being completely open to the rest of the entire home. MLP is approximately 2.5m from the LR speakers. I'm no SPL fiend but have no issues getting enough SPL to be satisfied. This is with anechoic EQ applied, which makes you lose a couple db off the tap. I do have the system crossed over to 2 subwoofers, though. Will eventually be 3-4 subwoofers once I get the wiring laid down. This not really for spl reasons, though. Again, I'm not a spl fiend.
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Thanks because my distances are similar, and if I want to listen loud, I use headphones.
My MLP is likewise 2.4-2.5m from my mains, which are 2.0m apart. Unfortunately this is a basement room that is 2.13m high and exactly 6.39m long, so the height and length modes pile on top of each other. I use an old Radio Shack sound meter that measures the same on pink noise as does a UMIK-1/REW when I am setting levels. If I use the RS meter during listening, I find I probably run around 80-82 dB average.
Hi there,
After have to listen to V1 demo for more than 2 months. Just get my V2 today . Before open the back, I find that I should spend time to listen to the system for a time
The V1 demo I just return to the distributor of my country . One of my V1 did have resonance because of PCB and back-plate not sit tight enough. I use the screwdriver to tight them at much as possible, but still, don't completely remove resonance . Resonance only audible at high volume
V2 arrive. I test sine-sweep right away . Nothing strange to me . I find that the cabinet is more resilience than V1, they rumble a lot less compare to V1 . I use my hand to touch their cabinet . Don't know if it's because of the boost of high frequency according to measurement , but I could say I hear above 20khz, even 20100hz, hope it's not my hallucination. I did hear it from Genelec 8361A, but not the V1 nor Genelec 8030C
Track on. The sound from them is different from V1. Using same dipswitch setting (I only use dip switch for the speaker at the corner of the room). The sound imaging is better, easier to track instrumental . I should hear more before confirming this is not my delusional. But in general, I feel right about them, closer to 8361A , I should believe this V2 pair than V1
According to the serial number, they are manufactured at mid November last year 2022
So, I could say, we shouldn't worry no more . Kali did improve a lot from V1 to V2, I couldn't ever experience earlier version of V2
I promise I will open the back someday to uninstall the LED anyway, but that day should be a month a later the soonest
I need to be sure I don't fuck up the sound from doing it
After have to listen to V1 demo for more than 2 months. Just get my V2 today . Before open the back, I find that I should spend time to listen to the system for a time
The V1 demo I just return to the distributor of my country . One of my V1 did have resonance because of PCB and back-plate not sit tight enough. I use the screwdriver to tight them at much as possible, but still, don't completely remove resonance . Resonance only audible at high volume
V2 arrive. I test sine-sweep right away . Nothing strange to me . I find that the cabinet is more resilience than V1, they rumble a lot less compare to V1 . I use my hand to touch their cabinet . Don't know if it's because of the boost of high frequency according to measurement , but I could say I hear above 20khz, even 20100hz, hope it's not my hallucination. I did hear it from Genelec 8361A, but not the V1 nor Genelec 8030C
Track on. The sound from them is different from V1. Using same dipswitch setting (I only use dip switch for the speaker at the corner of the room). The sound imaging is better, easier to track instrumental . I should hear more before confirming this is not my delusional. But in general, I feel right about them, closer to 8361A , I should believe this V2 pair than V1
According to the serial number, they are manufactured at mid November last year 2022
So, I could say, we shouldn't worry no more . Kali did improve a lot from V1 to V2, I couldn't ever experience earlier version of V2
I promise I will open the back someday to uninstall the LED anyway, but that day should be a month a later the soonest
I need to be sure I don't fuck up the sound from doing it
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Hi there,
My Kali IN8-V2 internal for ya, Produced at November 2022.
Feel free to let me know what you think. I'd love to know your opinions. I don't really know much about speaker, electronics than an average consumer. Is the speaker solid enough?
Edit: A link to my folder at Google Drive, for all image, video recorded during this section. I should had laid the speaker on the side, and open the back like the way Nuyes do
drive.google.com
My Kali IN8-V2 internal for ya, Produced at November 2022.
Edit: A link to my folder at Google Drive, for all image, video recorded during this section. I should had laid the speaker on the side, and open the back like the way Nuyes do
kali-in8-v2-internal - Google Drive
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I think my IN-8 V2 have a similar problem. I have not noticed a problem previously when listening to music on the speakers. But yesterday I was doing some fault finding on my subwoofer and decided to listen to the bass from the IN-8 with a 95Hz 4th order Low Pass Filter applied. Doing so I heard a sort of scratching noise coming from the woofers on both my speakers on most drum beats, and pretty consistently too (as in, always at the same time when replaying a track). I've just been mucking around with Windows settings and different devices to make sure there wasn't a problem on the signal side of things, and it seems there isn't, as the problem remains.
So I grabbed my UMIK-1 mic and placed it about 10cm from the woofers dust cap (at 90 degrees with cal applied), and I can hear the noise when the music goes above 80dB Z-weighted+slow in REW. I then turned the volume up to ~92dB and the noise is more apparent (louder and more frequent, because it is also between drum hits). So I have made a recording with my UMIK in Audacity, and I then applied a 200Hz 4th order High Pass filter to the audio stream, to somewhat isolate the noise. The file is attached, and the noise is very apparent.
I have now tried listening to the song to see if I can hear the noise, and I don't think I can. It is hard to know though, because I'm listening to heavy metal and getting ~90dB of "full spectrum" music means it might be blending in. But I then applied a 500Hz 4th order Low Pass, and the noise was obvious. So it is there. I wonder if it is a wire problem, or a "tinsel"/lead problem, because it does sound like something touching/rubbing on the woofer face itself, as the noise is similar to if you rub your nail gently on the woofer face. The sound is also very forward, not like it's in the box and coming out the port.
My speakers were purchased Aug 2022 from Thomann.
So I grabbed my UMIK-1 mic and placed it about 10cm from the woofers dust cap (at 90 degrees with cal applied), and I can hear the noise when the music goes above 80dB Z-weighted+slow in REW. I then turned the volume up to ~92dB and the noise is more apparent (louder and more frequent, because it is also between drum hits). So I have made a recording with my UMIK in Audacity, and I then applied a 200Hz 4th order High Pass filter to the audio stream, to somewhat isolate the noise. The file is attached, and the noise is very apparent.
I have now tried listening to the song to see if I can hear the noise, and I don't think I can. It is hard to know though, because I'm listening to heavy metal and getting ~90dB of "full spectrum" music means it might be blending in. But I then applied a 500Hz 4th order Low Pass, and the noise was obvious. So it is there. I wonder if it is a wire problem, or a "tinsel"/lead problem, because it does sound like something touching/rubbing on the woofer face itself, as the noise is similar to if you rub your nail gently on the woofer face. The sound is also very forward, not like it's in the box and coming out the port.
My speakers were purchased Aug 2022 from Thomann.
I think my noise is getting worse (or maybe I'm just more aware of it now), because I hear it every time I do a sweep now, and sometimes in very specific moments of songs (like when there is just 1 instrument playing slowly with bass). Sometimes I don't know if its distortion in the song (which happens in some of my music) or the noise.
Anyway, that's not why I'm posting here again. Actually, I've been wondering what the inherent Group Delay of the speakers is, and if the controls on the back affect it. So I did some sweeps close to the woofer (at ~3oclock +1cm position of woofer dust cap) and port;
I tweaked the SPL of the port until the sum of woofer+port was close to the Klippel data;
I made up some filters for the woofer that looked about right (I had it my head that the specs were 330Hz XO, but it didn't look like that so I did what I did, but now I see the website says 280Hz anyway);
And then I looked at those 2 plots on the GD overlay;
The sum seems to track pretty well. Maybe it could be a bit cleaner in the 150Hz area, and ~73Hz peaks? Under 50Hz probably not such a big deal because its getting below the F3. I'm not sure if it means anything that the GD is slightly worse when looking only at the woofer?
Those sweeps were all to 2kHz, so then I did a full 20Hz-20kHz sweep of the woofer and the coax (mic at about same position = 3oclock + 1cm).
That doesn't seem to show anything different. It is interesting that the coax sweep shows a sort of "comb filtering" in the woofers range though. That might be some sort of distance to woofer vs frequency length problem? That might explain what I noticed about Kali LP6 measurement in the step response thread?
Next I went back to sweeping the woofer, this time testing out the config switches on the back. The switches seem to activate 3 different EQ filters. The pics are pretty self explanatory;
I also tested the trim switches;
Activating any of the trims (high or low, boost or cut) did change the GD a bit around 140Hz, which seems a bit strange.
Anyway, that's not why I'm posting here again. Actually, I've been wondering what the inherent Group Delay of the speakers is, and if the controls on the back affect it. So I did some sweeps close to the woofer (at ~3oclock +1cm position of woofer dust cap) and port;
I tweaked the SPL of the port until the sum of woofer+port was close to the Klippel data;
I made up some filters for the woofer that looked about right (I had it my head that the specs were 330Hz XO, but it didn't look like that so I did what I did, but now I see the website says 280Hz anyway);
And then I looked at those 2 plots on the GD overlay;
The sum seems to track pretty well. Maybe it could be a bit cleaner in the 150Hz area, and ~73Hz peaks? Under 50Hz probably not such a big deal because its getting below the F3. I'm not sure if it means anything that the GD is slightly worse when looking only at the woofer?
Those sweeps were all to 2kHz, so then I did a full 20Hz-20kHz sweep of the woofer and the coax (mic at about same position = 3oclock + 1cm).
That doesn't seem to show anything different. It is interesting that the coax sweep shows a sort of "comb filtering" in the woofers range though. That might be some sort of distance to woofer vs frequency length problem? That might explain what I noticed about Kali LP6 measurement in the step response thread?
Next I went back to sweeping the woofer, this time testing out the config switches on the back. The switches seem to activate 3 different EQ filters. The pics are pretty self explanatory;
I also tested the trim switches;
Activating any of the trims (high or low, boost or cut) did change the GD a bit around 140Hz, which seems a bit strange.
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