JBL SDP-55 Audio/Video Processor Review

[jhaider]

I'm beginning to think not. The HTP-1 thread does not collect an organised list of bugs and plenty of bugs seem to be known and although acknowledged not collected together.

Examples?

 

[HTNut1975]

I'm beginning to think not. The HTP-1 thread does not collect an organised list of bugs and plenty of bugs seem to be known and although acknowledged not collected together.

I was going to chime in and say the same, but then I refrained. I would not consider the current firmware iteration of the Arcam/JBL/Audiocontrol units a bug-ridden mess. The unique features with the JBL (Dante and Logic 16) are the primary functions left to "get right." There are a couple of issues that pop up with some folks, but they're relatively narrow (and you can find the working list that Krobar has continually updated, as noted above), and there's good reason to think that even those will get ironed out.

 

[HTNut1975]

Examples?

That would require going back and reading through the HTP-1 thread, but there are bugs (perhaps an HTP-1 owner can chime in?).

 

[jhaider]

The unique features with the JBL (Dante and Logic 16) are the primary functions left to "get right." There are a couple of issues that pop up with some folks, but they're relatively narrow (and you can find the working list that Krobar has continually updated, as noted above), and there's good reason to think that even those will get ironed out.

Another way to look at that is, the only software/hardware that actually distinguishes this product from competitors is still vaporware. It’s also completely missing a major feature - PEQ per channel.

 

[jhaider]

(perhaps an HTP-1 owner can chime in?).

One is, and asking for examples of these bugs.

 

[HTNut1975]

One is, and asking for examples of these bugs.

DLBC doesn't set it apart? I don't know all of the differences, but I imagine there are a variety of different hardware tidbits that vary between the units. Are you saying that there are no bugs at all, so no need for additional firmware (but for adding a new feature, or something of the like)?

 

[jhaider]

DLBC doesn't set it apart?

Why would it? That is available on multiple products, some cheaper including the extra cost, some more expensive. The only things that make SDP unique are Logic upmixing and Dante. Neither one seems to be a currently working thing. Compared to HTP-1 it also has two big gaps in its feature set: PEQ and a really well done loudness compensation.

FWIW when the current gen launched I thought I would go JBL, mostly on the promise of Logic as much of my use is listening to upmixed 2 channel. But I waited, because Arcam’s previous generation came out of the gate terribly sorted and still has unacceptable gaps in its feature set (e.g, no support for on wall heights).

Are you saying that there are no bugs at all, so no need for additional firmware (but for adding a new feature, or something of the like)?

None unique to it that I am aware of or that affected my enjoyment or use so far. All of the promised-at-launch features are actually implemented to my knowledge. There may be some DTS something that I don’t really know or care about? At any rate I’ll have a lot more to say about HTP-1 shortly. Stay tuned.

 

[HTNut1975]

Why would it? That is available on multiple products, some cheaper including the extra cost, some more expensive. The only things that make SDP unique are Logic upmixing and Dante. Neither one seems to be a currently working thing. Compared to HTP-1 it also has two big gaps in its feature set: PEQ and a really well done loudness compensation.

FWIW when the current gen launched I thought I would go JBL, mostly on the promise of Logic as much of my use is listening to upmixed 2 channel. But I waited, because Arcam’s previous generation came out of the gate terribly sorted and still had unacceptable gaps in its feature set (e.g, no support for on wall heights).



None unique to it that I am aware of or affect my enjoyment or use. All of the promised-at-launch features are actually implemented to my knowledge. There may be some DTS something that I don’t really know or care about? At any rate I’ll have a lot more to say about HTP-1 shortly. Stay tuned.

You had said there wasn't any hardware/software that distinguished it--the JBL comes with DLBC natively, along with any future Dirac upgrades. Comparing internet direct to msrp dealer prices isn't commensurate, to the best of my knowledge (e.g., I'm unaware of getting a good "deal" with Monoprice, where it is 20 percent or more off msrp, etc.). That Dirac feature was probably the major selling point for me when it came to this model because the price difference between the JBL and the HTP-1 or an Emotiva model changes radically when you add that feature, along with dealer discounts (take any Harman product's msrp and consider the discounts you can typically find at a dealer during certain seasons of the year, and you'll get the idea).

There are no bugs with the JBL that affect my enjoyment of it as well (at least, the way I use it, I don't experience the bugs listed). The only feature I'm looking forward to that hasn't been implemented for me is Logic 16 (but that's more icing on the cake--I'm skeptical it is going to be my go-to). I think there are a few more features the JBL (or Arcam, etc.) may have that are in its favor, but I imagine they're not deal-breakers/makers for a lot of folks (e.g., IMAX, MQA, Airplay 2, Chromecast, analogue bypass). I'm not for sure if the HTP has those features or not (a VERY quick glance on its website didn't show those as features). I guess I could go back and re-read through posts on AVS about some of the bugs on the HTP-1, but I don't really care enough to. Perhaps they've all been fixed and there are no bugs--that wasn't my impression, before.

 

[HTNut1975]

Ok, just doing a very quick glance on the last page of the HTP thread on AVS--there's a bug being discussed (evidently the Auro 3D VOG channel isn't available, and there's some sort of delay with the simulated VOG channel, and the newest updated firmware has killed the rear heights in that format). I'm sure there are more, if I keep going back (I sort of keep up, but not so much on that thread).

 

[TimoJ]

One is, and asking for examples of these bugs.

- Few users still report random reboot issues.
- Few users report firmware corruption after AC power interruption.
- DTS with 4.2.4 speaker setup produces loud noise.
- Auro upmixer with 6 upper channels doesn't seem to work correctly, rear channels are not working.

 

[jhaider]

You had said there wasn't any hardware/software that distinguished it--the JBL comes with DLBC natively, along with any future Dirac upgrades.

So what? Others have the DLBC available too. And I discount to present value, so speculative unknown “future upgrades” are effectively worthless.

Comparing internet direct to msrp dealer prices isn't commensurate,

Nobody’s actually talking about purchase prices here, just features and usability.

There are no bugs with the JBL that affect my enjoyment of it as well (at least, the way I use it, I don't experience the bugs listed).

That’s good to read! While the cynic might say “about damn time” re current owners, that’s a useful data point for people considering a new AVP now and in the future.

I think there are a few more features the JBL (or Arcam, etc.) may have that are in its favor, but I imagine they're not deal-breakers/makers for a lot of folks (e.g., IMAX, MQA, Airplay 2, Chromecast, analogue bypass). I'm not for sure if the HTP has those features or not (a VERY quick glance on its website didn't show those as features).

I don’t think so. I don’t know what IMAX is in this context. Analog bypass is a demerit rather than a feature IMO - the equivalent of putting a parallel port on a MacBook Pro. It only indulges user stupidity - removing everything from the signal path that makes a processor from 2021 sound better than a preamp from 1985. MQA seems problematic as well. HTP-1 doesn’t have built in streaming, except for Roon (?). Some might consider that a demerit, though everyone is going to have an AppleTV or similar hooked up to the AVP for streaming, and Apple is a lot better at UI than AVR makers.

As for VOG bugs, maybe. Don’t know about that. Reading a little on that thread the thing that seems academically (for most) unfortunate to me on HTP-1 that I didn’t previously know is center height doesn’t seem an option! I don’t imagine Dr. Toole installed his on an earthquake resistant mount for nothing. If SDP supports center height that could be a difference maker for some. However, I can confirm rear heights do work in Auro on a 7.1.4h setup in current fw - because I’m currently listening and just checked them.

 

[HTNut1975]

So what? Others have the DLBC available too. And I discount to present value, so speculative unknown “future upgrades” are effectively worthless.



Nobody’s actually talking about purchase prices here, just features and usability.



That’s good to read! While the cynic might say “about damn time” re current owners, that’s a useful data point for people considering a new AVP now and in the future.

Out of curiosity, why would you discount the present value of a future upgrade from Dirac being free? They do plan on releasing future updates with additional modules. It seems to me that adds to the resale value of it. As far as the "about damn time"--my experience with it has been for the most part bug-free almost the entire time I've owned it.

 

[Sal1950]

All I wanted was a new LCD or Oled to be happy with my Onkyo TX SR-875 THX ultra, as I didn't care for Dolby Atmos upgrading and what a mistake Dolby Atmos is such a con. Yeah flipping Onkyo wasn't happy with the new tv, cos of these blasted encoding on the HDMI it wouldn't handshake in 1080p, forcing me to buy a new AVR that I didn't care for.

Wow, so much negativity. Not sure what your problem is with your Denon but I can tell you your opinion of Atmos is way off base.
Atmos music and movies provide an immersive listening experience that takes multich playback to a whole new level. It adds much more than any silly THX certification ever has.
BTW, your handshake issue is probably related to your HDMI cable. Get a decent one from Monoprice Premium for only a few bucks.

 

[jhaider]

Out of curiosity, why would you discount the present value of a future upgrade from Dirac being free? They do plan on releasing future updates with additional modules.

Your presumption is that promised future releases will exist and are timely, useful, compatible with current hardware, and expensive add ons for other people not on the buffet plan. I am not willing to make that many leaps of faith. I don’t even think Dirac has released a roadmap. They’re a very smart and talented firm with great ideas, but I don’t any speculative future value add from Dirac or anyone else merits discussion now.

 

[HTNut1975]

Your presumption is that promised future releases will exist and are timely, useful, compatible with current hardware, and expensive add ons for other people not on the buffet plan. I am not willing to make that many leaps of faith. I don’t even think Dirac has released a roadmap. They’re a very smart and talented firm with great ideas, but I don’t any speculative future value add from Dirac or anyone else merits discussion now.

Yes, I do have an assumption that there's a probability it will happen, though I wouldn't be my life on it or anything. Dirac has publicly stated that they planned to release future upgrades on a yearly basis. But, it is certainly understandable to be skeptical of that because DLBC was released a bit later than we all original thought! All of this interaction was in response to a poster asking about the JBL, and a couple of owners have chimed in to let people know that yes, it is functioning quite well (and it isn't the case that the HTP doesn't have bugs). You asked if there were additional hardware/software features that it offered that might be unique to it (compared to others in the price-range), and there are.

 

[mv038856]

I was playing around a little with my SDP-55 and a cheap oscilloscope that I had acquired some time ago. Not that I could claim that really know what I am doing… I still got a couple of sine waves on the screen. When measuring the two phases of the XLR out, I noticed that one appears to carry a 10% higher voltage than the other. Wouldn‘t one expect an identical voltage or the common noise reduction of the symmetrical transmission would be unnecessarily reduced?
One phase measures 4.2 volts peak to peak, the other 4.64 volts. I also switched the probes, but the difference is not probe related.

Is this something that is normal on XLR outs?

Another question, when talking about 2v output for an asymmetrical source, the 2v mean +2v to -2v on a sine wave, i.e. 4v difference peak to peak, correct?

Thanks!

Markus

 

[Andysu]

I was playing around a little with my SDP-55 and a cheap oscilloscope that I had acquired some time ago. Not that I could claim that really know what I am doing… I still got a couple of sine waves on the screen. When measuring the two phases of the XLR out, I noticed that one appears to carry a 10% higher voltage than the other. Wouldn‘t one expect an identical voltage or the common noise reduction of the symmetrical transmission would be unnecessarily reduced?
One phase measures 4.2 volts peak to peak, the other 4.64 volts. I also switched the probes, but the difference is not probe related.
View attachment 131484
Is this something that is normal on XLR outs?

Another question, when talking about 2v output for an asymmetrical source, the 2v mean +2v to -2v on a sine wave, i.e. 4v difference peak to peak, correct?

Thanks!

Markus

You need to connect the probes to test signal generator that should be the scope and using a trim probe to adjust the signal. The signal will be generated by the scope and should I think produce a square wave and adjust for smoothness or focus so the edges look smooth and not out of focus. I did this with my, Rigol DS1054Z, few years with all my four probes its rather exciting when doing it. I also hardly use the scope. So it maybe one of the probes you have may need tiny adjustment then check XLR amp lead what ever it is you testing again to see if the signal is or you can Swap the probes around and if the signal is different then the probes need tiny adjustment.

 

[mv038856]

You need to connect the probes to test signal generator that should be the scope and using a trim probe to adjust the signal. The signal will be generated by the scope and should I think produce a square wave and adjust for smoothness or focus so the edges look smooth and not out of focus. I did this with my, Rigol DS1054Z, few years with all my four probes its rather exciting when doing it. I also hardly use the scope. So it maybe one of the probes you have may need tiny adjustment then check XLR amp lead what ever it is you testing again to see if the signal is or you can Swap the probes around and if the signal is different then the probes need tiny adjustment.

Thanks for your reply!

I did the probe adjustment at the 5V 1kHz square wave connector of my scope (it is an OWON SDS7102V) prior to making the measurements mentioned above. The 1kHz test sine signal was generated through REW and went from my Acer notebook via HDMI to the SDP-55 that has been measured.

 

[Zooqu1ko]

[...] The 1kHz test sine signal was generated through REW and went from my Acer notebook via HDMI to the SDP-55 that has been measured.

Have you disabled Dirac, all trims and EQ (if any) and upmixers?

 

[mv038856]

I was playing around a little with my SDP-55 and a cheap oscilloscope that I had acquired some time ago. Not that I could claim that really know what I am doing… I still got a couple of sine waves on the screen. When measuring the two phases of the XLR out, I noticed that one appears to carry a 10% higher voltage than the other. Wouldn‘t one expect an identical voltage or the common noise reduction of the symmetrical transmission would be unnecessarily reduced?
One phase measures 4.2 volts peak to peak, the other 4.64 volts. I also switched the probes, but the difference is not probe related.
View attachment 131484
Is this something that is normal on XLR outs?

Another question, when talking about 2v output for an asymmetrical source, the 2v mean +2v to -2v on a sine wave, i.e. 4v difference peak to peak, correct?

Thanks!

Markus

When I do the same kind of measurement going through Dante on my Tascam ML-16D converter, all settings besides volume (had to go to 69 from 77) unchanged, both phases measure the same… 4.1v peak to peak, so it appears to be a SDP-55 only issue that the phases are not 100% identical in voltage.

Not sure if the 10% difference on the SDP-55s XLR out (left main channel measured) is a manufacturing tolerance that is to be expected.
Another measurement on the XLR out, this time the right channel, showed the exact same values and no delta through Dante/Tascam ML-16d, but the SDP-55s XLR out showed a much smaller delta between the two phases:

Long story short, it appears that the SDP-55s manufacturing tolerances might just be bigger than the Tascams. While a volume setting of 69 leads to exactly the same output voltages on both outputs and phases on the Tascam, a 77 setting on the SDP-55 leads to peak to peak voltage differences on the phases of up to 10% in the left channel.
As one of the phases gets inverted and added to the other the resulting output voltage of my left channel should end up at 8.64v peak to peak, while the right channel adds up to 8.72v, so there should not be an audible difference, and if there is, the level mandatory level adjustments should accommodate for any remaining difference.
My initial concern that this could affect common noise rejection might not be valid, as the noise injected into the wire should be unaffected from the voltage of the signal sent from the processor and be eliminated after the phase inversion in the receiving amp.