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I've heard Subwoofer auto calibration with Dirac doesn't do that well?

Audiochap786

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I asked Rel for help with dual Subwoofers setup with my speakers and Dirac and got this response. I've also watched a few YouTube videos on the Rel subs (TX7) and creators have mentioned they preferred without Dirac.

Anyone else confirm? should I stay away from Dirac?

:)
"
Honestly - i got better results doing a manual set up and not using Dirac. You need to set the speaker to large and use Hi level plus LFE as i think we mentioned, and then you dial in manually so that the stereo side is set first

Then for LFE its just a case of turning up the LFE volume on the REL to balance. Far more open and lifelike without Dirac.

If you use Dirac it will do what it thinks is correct with the bass - which normally means it sets it to the wrong level. You need to go back and set the sub up after Dirac really. Dirac is good for setting distances though "
 

Everett T

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I asked Rel for help with dual Subwoofers setup with my speakers and Dirac and got this response. I've also watched a few YouTube videos on the Rel subs (TX7) and creators have mentioned they preferred without Dirac.

Anyone else confirm? should I stay away from Dirac?

:)
"
Honestly - i got better results doing a manual set up and not using Dirac. You need to set the speaker to large and use Hi level plus LFE as i think we mentioned, and then you dial in manually so that the stereo side is set first

Then for LFE its just a case of turning up the LFE volume on the REL to balance. Far more open and lifelike without Dirac.

If you use Dirac it will do what it thinks is correct with the bass - which normally means it sets it to the wrong level. You need to go back and set the sub up after Dirac really. Dirac is good for setting distances though "
Sounds like you have already made up your mind, and REL CS would never give the wrong advice, *rolls eyes*
 

Adi777

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Aren't REL's subwoofers far too expensive for what they offer? On Polish forums I often read that REL is great and better than, for example, SVS for music, because it is "fast" - whatever that means. It's probably bullshit.
 

Kal Rubinson

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I asked Rel for help with dual Subwoofers setup with my speakers and Dirac and got this response. I've also watched a few YouTube videos on the Rel subs (TX7) and creators have mentioned they preferred without Dirac.

Anyone else confirm? should I stay away from Dirac?

:)
"
Honestly - i got better results doing a manual set up and not using Dirac. You need to set the speaker to large and use Hi level plus LFE as i think we mentioned, and then you dial in manually so that the stereo side is set first

Then for LFE its just a case of turning up the LFE volume on the REL to balance. Far more open and lifelike without Dirac.

If you use Dirac it will do what it thinks is correct with the bass - which normally means it sets it to the wrong level. You need to go back and set the sub up after Dirac really. Dirac is good for setting distances though "
It may be so for REL since their subs are integrated into systems differently from almost all others. I would not take their advice to apply generally.
 

abdo123

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Dirac does not do bass management without Dirac Bass control. So if that is the case, then Dirac is not in charge of the crossovers.
 

diablo

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I use standard Dirac on my MiniDSP systems and it does a perfectly good job of handling the subs.

I gave up on high level sub management a long time ago. Didn't give any audible benefit.
 
OP
A

Audiochap786

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I have a Nad T778 I don't think that does bass management. Should I look into a miniDSP?

:)
 

morpheusX

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Well, REL insists that their Subwoofer cable is special, for only £399 as the starting price.

REL subwoofers are vastly overpriced, and their marketing BS tries the most to perpetuate old audiophile BS.

But don't take my word for it: buy a CS calibrated Umik-1, which is at least 3 times cheaper than their BS cable, and try the following:
1) configure the REL as their marketing suggest, via High level connection, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).
2) configure the REL as any rational person will do on 2022, run DIRAC, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).

Compare both, looking at metrics such as Frequency Response, Distortion, Impulse Response, Decay, etc.
Post results here.

Or, just discard REL BS, and proceed directly to 2.

This is what Dirac does to 2 18" monsters:

Raw Frequency Response
coDdCRX.png


After Dirac (old configuration, now i have it configured to be flat from 15Hz and not from 8Hz as bellow)
D9qkGsR.png


Audiophile question : which sounds better
- There is no comparison, Dirac wins every time, and i can pick one from the other in a blind test 10/10)
 
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Audiochap786

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I think I'm over thinking things... Bass control is on the remote where I can adjust the bass up or down?

If so, that's so obvious
 
OP
A

Audiochap786

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Well, REL insists that their Subwoofer cable is special, for only £399 as the starting price.

REL subwoofers are vastly overpriced, and their marketing BS tries the most to perpetuate old audiophile BS.

But don't take my word for it: buy a CS calibrated Umik-1, which is at least 3 times cheaper than their BS cable, and try the following:
1) configure the REL as their marketing suggest, via High level connection, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).
2) configure the REL as any rational person will do on 2022, run DIRAC, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).

Compare both, looking at metrics such as Frequency Response, Distortion, Impulse Response, Decay, etc.
Post results here.

Or, just discard REL BS, and proceed directly to 2.

This is what Dirac does to 2 18" monsters:

Raw Frequency Response
coDdCRX.png


After Dirac (old configuration, now i have it configured to be flat from 15Hz and not from 8Hz as bellow)
D9qkGsR.png


Audiophile question : which sounds better
- There is no comparison, Dirac wins every time, and i can pick one from the other in a blind test 10/10)
Thanks for your amazing input, greatly appreciated! :)
 

GurvanBHC

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Well, REL insists that their Subwoofer cable is special, for only £399 as the starting price.

REL subwoofers are vastly overpriced, and their marketing BS tries the most to perpetuate old audiophile BS.

But don't take my word for it: buy a CS calibrated Umik-1, which is at least 3 times cheaper than their BS cable, and try the following:
1) configure the REL as their marketing suggest, via High level connection, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).
2) configure the REL as any rational person will do on 2022, run DIRAC, and take a few REW sweeps for the subwoofer, at several SPLs levels (75db, 85db, 95db).

Compare both, looking at metrics such as Frequency Response, Distortion, Impulse Response, Decay, etc.
Post results here.

Or, just discard REL BS, and proceed directly to 2.

This is what Dirac does to 2 18" monsters:

Raw Frequency Response
coDdCRX.png


After Dirac (old configuration, now i have it configured to be flat from 15Hz and not from 8Hz as bellow)
D9qkGsR.png


Audiophile question : which sounds better
- There is no comparison, Dirac wins every time, and i can pick one from the other in a blind test 10/10)
Do you have a waterfall screenshot before and after please ? I want to see if it does a good job to reduce the decay time.
Thank you in advance
 

GurvanBHC

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I'll have to search them, those measures were taken a some time ago :)
can I ask your opinion on bass control management, does having multiple subwoofers working separately to eliminate modal resonances mean that in the end only 1 subwoofer has to give all the power to reach the reference SPL of a movie because the other works "against it"
 

Everett T

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can I ask your opinion on bass control management, does having multiple subwoofers working separately to eliminate modal resonances mean that in the end only 1 subwoofer has to give all the power to reach the reference SPL of a movie because the other works "against it"
A even bass response will be more satisfying then hitting reference levels IMO (most people never listen that loud anyway). The hard part is ultra low bass at ref level, and having headroom through the low bass 32-100hz as that's where the demand is.
 

morpheusX

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can I ask your opinion on bass control management, does having multiple subwoofers working separately to eliminate modal resonances mean that in the end only 1 subwoofer has to give all the power to reach the reference SPL of a movie because the other works "against it"
If you are referring to Dirac Bass Control, its not available for my receiver (NAD T758).
I run both subs as a cluster using a Y cable, so Dirac sees them as one.
 
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