Is the regular minidsp 2x4 adequate enough to use as a crossover?

[nat1]

I want to use the minidsp as an external crossover to high pass my Neumann KH80's with a subwoofer. I know the HD version will offer more options (higher output voltage, more delay/PEQ bands etc) but it's more than twice the price in the UK (regular 2x4 is £100, HD is almost £250). If I'm just using it to employ a basic crossover is there much difference in sound quality between the two? I don't care about the other features.

 

[sigbergaudio]

You will probably be fine with the regular version, but even the HD version isn't fantastic in terms of absolute sound quality (I think there was a review here at ASR at some point). Whether it's audible is another question.

But it's a great device for such an application, adding both crossover and EQ ability to a 2.1 system

 

[AnalogSteph]

You would probably want to use it with USB input, given that the ADCs in these always seem to be weaker than the DACs. Not sure what the finished 2x4s are using, but the kit appears to be based on an ADAU1701 which comes with integrated converters (see datasheet).

 

[FrantzM]

The output of the “regular “ 2x4 is anemic at .9v max. So much I had to use the HD for multi- subs, because after a few filters and EQ, the output wouldn’t drive the subs to respectable levels. Performance full range is ... meh ... I do love the flexibility of the plug-in and of those miniDSP units in general ... Go for the HD...

 

[nat1]

I know the output is low, but I don't think volume will be a problem in my case since my listening distance is less than 1m, and I don't listen loud.

 

[nat1]

You will probably be fine with the regular version, but even the HD version isn't fantastic in terms of absolute sound quality (I think there was a review here at ASR at some point). Whether it's audible is another question.

But it's a great device for such an application, adding both crossover and EQ ability to a 2.1 system

Whether it's audible is my dilemma. Searching on the internet, some people say it ruined their sound, others say there's no difference so yeah

 

[tw99]

Whether it's audible is my dilemma. Searching on the internet, some people say it ruined their sound, others say there's no difference so yeah

If there's one thing this forum teaches you, it's not to take any notice of what "people on the internet" claim to have heard...

 

[Berwhale]

I want to use the minidsp as an external crossover to high pass my Neumann KH80's with a subwoofer. I know the HD version will offer more options (higher output voltage, more delay/PEQ bands etc) but it's more than twice the price in the UK (regular 2x4 is £100, HD is almost £250). If I'm just using it to employ a basic crossover is there much difference in sound quality between the two? I don't care about the other features.

I have been wondering the same for a while. I'm also interested to know how the MiniDSP 2x4 would compare to the even cheaper Dayton Audio DSP-LF: https://www.soundimports.eu/en/dayton-audio-dsp-lf.html. I realize that the DSP-LF will not function as a cross-over, but how importants is that vs propper integration of the sub?

I'm considering treating my self to a pair of KH 80's for my birthday, what sub are you planning to use with them?

 

[win]

Side note, you don't really need to high pass your mains. Hoping you get more benefit than just a high pass by doing this.

 

[sigbergaudio]

Side note, you don't really need to high pass your mains. Hoping you get more benefit than just a high pass by doing this.

He don't need to, but the result will be better. Better integration, he can crossover the subwoofer higher, and get reduced distortion and increased headroom on his main speakers.

 

[win]

He don't need to, but the result will be better. Better integration, he can crossover the subwoofer higher, and get reduced distortion and increased headroom on his main speakers.

I guess it depends on how much he cuts off. I have to admit I high passed my mains, but primarily, as you stated, for better (and more predictable) integration. As an example, my left subwoofer has a deep notch at 90hz, and having it out of phase with the mains, and of course having a main play lower than 90hz, resolved that issue nicely.

I was going to mention the headroom issue, but it just seems unlikely for someone to be in the scenario where their mains are so stressed that offloading the LF content fed to them would 'save' them.

 

[sigbergaudio]

I was going to mention the headroom issue, but it just seems unlikely for someone to be in the scenario where their mains are so stressed that offloading the LF content fed to them would 'save' them.

Not save them as in preventing them from blowing up, but save them as in giving them significantly more breathing room is a completely normal scenario, which is why it's a common (and good) recommendation to highpass your speakers even when they are large towers.

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

I know the output is low, but I don't think volume will be a problem in my case since my listening distance is less than 1m, and I don't listen loud.

If you don’t care about the mini’s EQ etc. features and don’t listen at high volumes, I’d suggest that you don’t need the mini at all. I’ve been using a pair of Swans M200 speakers with a 10” Velodyne sub for many years. I run the speakers full-range, and the sub takes care of its own low pass filtering. I used REW to help determine the crossover frequency on the sub for the proper transition.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[nat1]

If you don’t care about the mini’s EQ etc. features and don’t listen at high volumes, I’d suggest that you don’t need the mini at all. I’ve been using a pair of Swans M200 speakers with a 10” Velodyne sub for many years. I run the speakers full-range, and the sub takes care of its own low pass filtering. I used REW to help determine the crossover frequency on the sub for the proper transition.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

I'll prob use PEQ for the sub to cut out peaks, won't use it on my mains. Also the sub I'm using (BK XLS200) has a very shallow low pass filter, 12db/octave or less, so I think the steeper slopes will be useful

I have been wondering the same for a while. I'm also interested to know how the MiniDSP 2x4 would compare to the even cheaper Dayton Audio DSP-LF: https://www.soundimports.eu/en/dayton-audio-dsp-lf.html. I realize that the DSP-LF will not function as a cross-over, but how importants is that vs propper integration of the sub?

I'm considering treating my self to a pair of KH 80's for my birthday, what sub are you planning to use with them?

BK XLS200

There is another option from thomann called the t racks mini 4x4, it's even cheaper than the minidsp 2x4 but I don't know how they compare

 

[AnalogSteph]

There is another option from thomann called the t racks mini 4x4, it's even cheaper than the minidsp 2x4 but I don't know how they compare

While analog in + analog out only (no USB out), that thing isn't bad at all apparently. Max in/out level +9.5 dBu with balanced I/O (no fussing around with unbalanced outputs in your case), and the measurements are looking just fine, too:
https://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum...ation/dsp-t-racks-4x4-mini-48k-t30105589.html
The converters alone (AK5386 + PCM5102, 2 each) are in another league. The ADC seems to be a closeout special with a status of NRND but >11000 still available at Digikey alone.

 

[nat1]

While analog in + analog out only (no USB out), that thing isn't bad at all apparently. Max in/out level +9.5 dBu with balanced I/O (no fussing around with unbalanced outputs in your case), and the measurements are looking just fine, too:
https://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum...ation/dsp-t-racks-4x4-mini-48k-t30105589.html
The converters alone (AK5386 + PCM5102, 2 each) are in another league. The ADC seems to be a closeout special with a status of NRND but >11000 still available at Digikey alone.

I was/am strongly considering the t racks 4x4, only thing that slightly put me off was the max 24db/octave slopes, whereas the minidsp can do 48db/octave, I suppose 4th order is enough for a sub though.

 

[sigbergaudio]

I was/am strongly considering the t racks 4x4, only thing that slightly put me off was the max 24db/octave slopes, whereas the minidsp can do 48db/octave, I suppose 4th order is enough for a sub though.

You'll be fine with 24db/octave, so don't see that as a reason to avoid it for your purposes.

 

[Juhazi]

Any dsp-xo will be wasted without acoustic measurements! For sub you can use any cheap mic eg. headset. And learn to use freeware REW.

 

[nat1]

I am leaning towards the t.racks 4x4 mini, will probably purchase it next week some time, mic + rew measurements will come much later. Thanks guys

 

[dougi]

Doesn't the KH80 have DSP, or is there a version of it without it? With the DSP version you can at least add a low shelf to help with sub integration/distortion reduction.