Is SINAD important? - "Myths" about measurements! [Video YT]

[Thomas Savage]

One has to be careful not to wonder into the realms of pedantry, once one walks it's path a deep lake of spurious nothings awaits trapping all who stride towards it , the poor souls, their minds lost forever to its maddening eternal depths . Beware the seductive lure of the pedant , change course while one still can , Save yourselves .

 

[amirm]

All YouTube audio reviewers want to make money.

Nope. Some do it as a hobby. Some do it with sincerity. None of this matters. What matters is whether their opinion is based on decades of audio research, or a layman waking up one day and deciding they should tell others how the world turns in audio.

Anyone who wants to make money is not to be trusted.

Nope. They could make millions or zero. Neither makes their opinion more or less valid in that regard.

It is just that when it is obvious they are trying to appease to manufacturers as to get more gear to test, that you should be on guard.

Therefore,
All YouTube audio reviewers are not to be trusted.

As a youtuber myself, I take offense to that. There are a ton of great youtubers in every field and product reliable and trusted information. You just have to know how to determine that and you don't seem to have that knowledge right now and going by gut and lay feelings. We exist because of the very thing. The world of audio had almost completely shifted to anti-science in popular domain. Our work is recognized by many now, putting is in top ranking of all audio sites. If you want to go by lay opinion, think of why so many audiophiles now trust our opinion vs those you listed.

 

[D2013]

The feedback I've received today in this thread suggests to me that this community may tend toward prejudice toward YouTube audio reviewers...they all want to make money, they're not to be trusted, their emotional experience/opinions are not valid for others. Is that how you feel, Amir? Seems unfortunate and cynical to me. But that's just my opinion.

Imo, any reviewer who is not providing verifiable data is worthless (to be blunt). Without unbiased data, all you are getting is someone's mental/emotional, physical, and environmental biases/preferences.

 

[amirm]

No one is omniscient, so yeah, if you're human, you're gonna get burned.

My job is to sharply reduce the chances of that in your audio hobby. What you are stating results in the opposite.

Remember, measurements were invented because we don't trust humans when it comes to evaluating things. We could ask you how tall a stick is. Then ask someone else and easily get two different answers for the same thing. Yard sticks were invented to eliminate the human opinion and get to a trusted answer. Don't try to justify staying confused with word arguments.

 

[amirm]

Amir, You've quoted me, but those thoughts are not originally mine, they are a summary and challenge to what another posted (see the thread). I'm glad you chimed in to challenge their point of view, but for future reference, please quote them directly if you disagree with them.

??? You were summarizing our views ostensibly and I answered that you did so incorrectly. Please don't try to do that if you don't understand what we are saying and why.

 

[D2013]

Amir, You've quoted me, but those thoughts are not originally mine, they are a summary and challenge to what another posted (see the thread). I'm glad you chimed in to challenge their point of view, but for future reference, please quote them directly if you disagree with them.

If they aren't you words, you should be quoting them, either by directly linking to the post, or using the quote functionality.

 

[Jimbob54]

No I wasn't Amir. I was summarizing Purite Audio/Keith, one of your Grand Contributors, who posted this:

Quote,
‘YouTube audio reviewers...they all want to make money, they're not to be trusted,’
Spot on.
Keith

My post was to clarify his logic (in syllogism form), which framed his premises as obviously false. So don't quote me out of context, as if they were my ideas and not my challenge to those ideas. I'm not sure how to more simply explain it.

Well this is a strange argument . And sophistry at its worst . It's almost like you're not here in good faith . This is all very familiar . And tiresome .

Your actual point seems to be : measurements seen here and elsewhere can't be tied to actual listening pleasure . Evidence being some YouTube reviewers rave about some badly measuring kit (think you said tube amps ). Is that it?

The rest has just been poor attempts to twist others words .

Pack it in.

 

[Thomas Savage]

If there's a genuine interest in audio engineering and the science of , we've a ton of threads here dedicated to that one can read and learn from . A search around the forum would be more efficient than this current exchange, that's if there's a genuine interest in the subject matter rather than a sporting interest in debate for the sake of it .

Have a look around @O Danny Boy , there's also the entire resources of mankind ( more or less) avaliable in the wider realm of the Internet .

Have a look , come back having clearly done this and then I believe we all will end up going in a more constructive direction.

Welcome BTW

 

[krabapple]

What's it called when a garrulous, uninformed poster tries to suck up all the oxygen in a thread with 'every answer spawns another question' schtick?

A. a Gish gallop
B. sea-lioning
C. a red flag to the moderators
D. just plain boring
E. all of the above

 

[BDWoody]

What's it called when a garrulous, uninformed poster tries to suck up all the oxygen in a thread with 'every answer spawns another question' schtick?

A. a Gish gallop
B. sea-lioning
C. a red flag to the moderators
D. just plain boring
E. all of the above

You forgot JAQing off.

The answer is 42.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

I am surprised by the mass and patience of replies to every new member with such a posting pattern, in one of my languages there is a saying, "don't jump over every stick that is held out to you", as this usually really doesn't bring anything.

Especially since this particular discussion is going nowhere. I initially fell for their first comment, which came across as sincere, humble, and quite different from the ones that followed.
At this point, I’m calling them out as a subjective audiophile troll with occasional sealioning -I haven't seen anything to convince me otherwise.

 

[solderdude]

The answer is 42.

isn't it always ?

 

[JSmith]

isn't it always ?

But what is the question?


JSmith

 

[Mort]

The question is 'Why does it take so much more time to debunk misinformation than it does to create it?" (Brandolini)
Answer '42'

Sounds about right.

But what is the question?

 

[Jimbob54]

I am surprised by the mass and patience of replies to every new member with such a posting pattern, in one of my languages there is a saying, "don't jump over every stick that is held out to you", as this usually really doesn't bring anything.

I think established members jump in because to ignore might lead newer members to mistake this for a genuine debate. Which of course it isn't. Its someone's idea of entertainment with the usual thin veneer of naivety over what amounts to juvenile debating techniques, twisting of words etc etc.

 

[D2013]

The question is 'Why does it take so much more time to debunk misinformation than it does to create it?" (Brandolini)

Articulating an argument, and organizing and presenting supportive evidence in a clear concise way, is a lot harder and time consuming than pulling something out of your backside.

 

[ahofer]

Articulating an argument, and organizing and presenting supportive evidence in a clear concise way, is a lot harder and time consuming than pulling something out of your backside.

Speaking of which, did you know that colorectal health improves sound quality? Measure that, gearheads!

 

[DonH56]

Articulating an argument, and organizing and presenting supportive evidence in a clear concise way, is a lot harder and time consuming than pulling something out of your backside.

Speaking of which, did you know that colorectal health improves sound quality? Measure that, gearheads!

So, are y'all saying a lot of folk have their heads up their a...?

 

[Thomas Savage]

So, are y'all saying a lot of folk have their heads up their a...?

Don't knock till you've tried it .

 

[DonH56]

Don't knock till you've tried it .

I'll just acknowledge your superior experience and slink out quietly with the recognition that I do not in fact know, nor want to know, everything.