Is it work getting a DAC (and advice on what)

[Mitch2000]

Hi all,

I'm trying to figure out if a DAC would noticeably improve the fidelity of my system.
This is my current setup:

PC running Win 10 and Foobar -> USB Behringer UCA 202 -> Optical out to Yamaha RX-A740 -> Classic full size Polk 9 speakers (from the 1980s).

My receiver is functioning as the DAC, with the Behringer just serving as a pass through. I know the Yamahas is a decent mid-ranger receiver, the speakers are allegedly first rate. I also believe the Yamaha's DAC is superior to the Behringer's which is why I don't output RCA from it to the receiver.

If I were to replace the Behringer with a DAC and then output to the receiver via RCA would there be a noticeable (all things considered) improvement in fidelity?
I know there’s a massive range in DACS and one can spend $50 or $1000. Let's assume I'd spend up to $200.

My music is all lossless 16/44.1 or 16/48 in FLAC. I don't listen to hi res (24/96, etc) at all though my receiver can handle 26/192.

Thanks!

 

[staticV3]

Hi @Mitch2000! Welcome to ASR.

If I were to replace the Behringer with a DAC and then output to the receiver via RCA would there be a noticeable (all things considered) improvement in fidelity?

IMO and IME: No. Sound quality would remain unchanged.

The best ways to improve sound quality, in no particular order are:

-new speakers
-add subwoofers
-add room treatment
-measure and apply room correction

 

[Karmacoma]

Hi, welcome to ASR.
We don't have measurements for your interface, however it is very, very unlikely that a 2006 USB interface from Behringer doesn't degrade your sound, even if you use it as a USB/optical converter. It is also very unlikely that the Yamaha's internal dac has state of the art performance.
If you type the key words '' dac review '' you will find usb dacs with top performance from prices as low as 90€/$, you don't need to spend more than that, it will be an improvement, now will you hear it? No idea, but for 200€ max that's the best improvement you'll get for your system.
lossless 16/44.1 or 16/48 in FLAC is great, you won't hear any difference with Hi-res.
Hope it helps.

 

[Mitch2000]

Hi @Mitch2000! Welcome to ASR.


IMO and IME: No. Sound quality would remain unchanged.

The best ways to improve sound quality, in no particular order are:

-new speakers
-add subwoofers
-add room treatment
-measure and apply room correction

Why would I need to replace the Polk 9 speakers? They’re excellent and from what I understand vintage speakers are always in high demand.

 

[Mitch2000]

Hi, welcome to ASR.
We don't have measurements for your interface, however it is very, very unlikely that a 2006 USB interface from Behringer doesn't degrade your sound, even if you use it as a USB/optical converter. It is also very unlikely that the Yamaha's internal dac has state of the art performance.
If you type the key words '' dac review '' you will find usb dacs with top performance from prices as low as 90€/$, you don't need to spend more than that, it will be an improvement, now will you hear it? No idea, but for 200€ max that's the best improvement you'll get for your system.
lossless 16/44.1 or 16/48 in FLAC is great, you won't hear any difference with Hi-res.
Hope it helps.

So even though all the Behringer does is pass on the signal it degrades it? I once compared it using a PC that had an optical out and I didn’t hear anything.
As for the Yamaha, yeah I figured the DAC was good but could be improved upon. Aside from price, I wouldn’t even know where to begin in choosing one.
For instance, I’ve noticed some have Bluetooth. I often stream music via airplay to the Yamaha when I’m listening to Apple Music on an iPad. Would a DAC with Bluetooth (or even better, airplay) be desirable, since it would be doing the conversion rather than the Yamaha.
Another responsoder said changing the DAC wouldn’t matter and that I should consider new speakers and subwoofers. I was under the impression that the Polk 9s are high quality and in high demand.

 

[Chrispy]

Why do you think the dac is some sort of choke point?

 

[staticV3]

Why would I need to replace the Polk 9 speakers? They’re excellent and from what I understand vintage speakers are always in high demand.

Nobody said anything about a need.

But modern loudspeakers designed with tools like FEA and the Klippel NFS, undeniably have greater fidelity.

 

[solderdude]

When you want to change 'sound quality' you can best do that with changing speakers and/or room acoustics is what is meant.
Not that you need other speakers.

Do you hear a big difference between the UCA202 analog out and that of the internal DAC (other than possible level differences) ?

I suggest you don't get fooled by the many 'this DAC sounds so much better' reviews and posts everywhere.

When you need BT functionality or other inputs that your receiver lacks it may be worth buying something that provides that.
Don't buy the cheapest crap out there is a good rule in general.

 

[Power Pop 23]

Why would I need to replace the Polk 9 speakers? They’re excellent and from what I understand vintage speakers are always in high demand.

I am unfamiliar with the sound of the Polk 9. There may be no need to replace them. Consider that newer loudspeakers can take advantage of advances in the way they are designed and measured.

 

[Karmacoma]

I quote you '' what would be the best improvement for 200$ ''.
My answer is '' a DAC, but not sure if you'll hear the difference ''
Anything else will turn out to be a lot more expensive.
Vintage speakers aren't better than recent speakers, I'm not sure where you got this idea but it's wrong.

 

[Chrispy]

So even though all the Behringer does is pass on the signal it degrades it? I once compared it using a PC that had an optical out and I didn’t hear anything.
As for the Yamaha, yeah I figured the DAC was good but could be improved upon. Aside from price, I wouldn’t even know where to begin in choosing one.
For instance, I’ve noticed some have Bluetooth. I often stream music via airplay to the Yamaha when I’m listening to Apple Music on an iPad. Would a DAC with Bluetooth (or even better, airplay) be desirable, since it would be doing the conversion rather than the Yamaha.
Another responsoder said changing the DAC wouldn’t matter and that I should consider new speakers and subwoofers. I was under the impression that the Polk 9s are high quality and in high demand.

What is a Polk 9?

 

[VMAT4]

What is a Polk 9?

Here's a link: Polk Model 9.

 

[Karmacoma]

What is a Polk 9?

I figured he was talking about the Polk LS/9, I was wrong. I'll delete my post

 

[Mitch2000]

Why do you think the dac is some sort of choke point?

Because I know the Yamaha is multi-purpose and the DAC in it is very good, but not superior. I thought that ab independent DAC would do a better job by design.

 

[Power Pop 23]

Hi all,

I'm trying to figure out if a DAC would noticeably improve the fidelity of my system.
This is my current setup:

PC running Win 10 and Foobar -> USB Behringer UCA 202 -> Optical out to Yamaha RX-A740 -> Classic full size Polk 9 speakers (from the 1980s).

My receiver is functioning as the DAC, with the Behringer just serving as a pass through. I know the Yamahas is a decent mid-ranger receiver, the speakers are allegedly first rate. I also believe the Yamaha's DAC is superior to the Behringer's which is why I don't output RCA from it to the receiver.

If I were to replace the Behringer with a DAC and then output to the receiver via RCA would there be a noticeable (all things considered) improvement in fidelity?
I know there’s a massive range in DACS and one can spend $50 or $1000. Let's assume I'd spend up to $200.

My music is all lossless 16/44.1 or 16/48 in FLAC. I don't listen to hi res (24/96, etc) at all though my receiver can handle 26/192.

Thanks!

Welcome to ASR ,

Assuming a budget of $200.....

Consider keeping all you have and inserting a $149 WiiM Pro streamer between the optical output of the Behringer and the optical input of the Yamaha. The WiiM Pro can apply room correction and Parametric EQ to your listening space. Room correction can be run from the microphone of gear running iOS. WiiM owners using gear running Android may need to budget for an external microphone.

 

[Karmacoma]

Welcome to ASR ,

Assuming a budget of $200.....

Consider keeping all you have and inserting a $149 WiiM Pro streamer between the optical output of the Behringer and the optical input of the Yamaha. The WiiM Pro can apply room correction and Parametric EQ to your listening space. Room correction can be run from the microphone of gear running iOS. WiiM owners using gear running Android may need to budget for an external microphone.

Yes, this.
By the way I believe the name of his speakers is Polk Monitor Series Model 9. I wouldn't expect them to be good.

Are they these ones ?

 

[Power Pop 23]

Because I know the Yamaha is multi-purpose and the DAC in it is very good, but not superior. I thought that ab independent DAC would do a better job by design.

The DAC in the Yamaha is older and a newer DAC can measure better.

You may not perceive a difference between the two in double-blind testing.

 

[Karmacoma]

Been looking around for the polk monitor series model 9.
You need to change those brother... I don't think you realise how much better it can get.
Save your money for loudspeakers, really.

 

[Chrispy]

Because I know the Yamaha is multi-purpose and the DAC in it is very good, but not superior. I thought that ab independent DAC would do a better job by design.

So you expect an audible difference, tho? I seriously doubt such. Having used many similar setups.

 

[VMAT4]

Hi @Mitch2000, your speakers are about 40 years old? They are the weak link in your system. Do you live near any brick and mortar HiFi Shops?
If you do, go listening.

While your A/V receiver is about ten years old, I wouldn't under estimate it. It gives you the ability to add a subwoofer or two if you want that much bass.