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Is it possible to make a solid-state amp sound like a tube amp? PC>DAC>Speakers setup

murkr

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So I'm looking to get a new PC speaker setup.

I currently have:
  • Focal Aria 906 speakers
  • ADI-2 DAC fs
These aren't really near-field speakers but I could try to make them work (2-3 feet away from me).
I really like the sound of tube amps. I was considering buying a willsenton R8 to pair with these speakers but since these will be my PC speakers (on 8+ hours everyday) I feel like I would burn through tubes too quickly.
My question is: if I buy a solid-state amp is there a way to use some kind of filter or plugin to make it sound like a tube amp? Since this will be connected to my PC>DAC>AMP>Focal speakers.

or, would it be better for me just to save these speakers for my living room and buy some cheaper PC speakers like Klipsch ProMedia Heritage 2.1 or some kind of bookshelf speakers with an internal amp.

I'll be listening to Rap and EDM on Spotify and YouTube videos. So the source quality won't be the best.
 

DVDdoug

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I really like the sound of tube amps.
Not all tube amps sound the same. So you might like the sound of one tube amp but not another. Some (hopefully most) are high-fidelity and just like a good solid state amp have no particular sound of their own. Some "interact" with speaker impedance so their frequency response is different with different speakers.

Tube amps do tend to soft-clip when overdriven. That's one reason guitar players tend to prefer tube amps... They like the way they sound when driven into distortion. But for audio reproduction we usually want to avoid clipping altogether and it would be kind-of crazy trying to adjust the volume for "just the right amount of clipping" and listening at that same volume all of the time.

There are VST plug-ins that simulate tube distortion but then you need a VST host. That's usually a DAW (Digital Audio Workstation) application used for production/mixing but there are some stand-alone VST hosts that you can use with a computer.

I was considering buying a willsenton R8 to pair with these speakers but since these will be my PC speakers (on 8+ hours everyday) I feel like I would burn through tubes too quickly.
Tubes can last for decades. When I was young we had tube radios and tube TVs and I even had a couple of tube audio amps when I was in high school (pretty much outdated by that time but someone gave them to me). I remember a couple of tube died (I think in our TV) but I never had to replace a tube in my amplifiers. I even had a 1950s car with an AM tube radio but I don't think it ever needed a tube replacement. They do eventually wear out and drug stores & hardware stores had tubes and DIY tube testers but tubes were everywhere and it's not like we were replacing a tube every month... Probably not even one a year in our household.

I'm NOT a fan of 1950s technology... It's cheaper & easier to make an amplifier with modern electronics... With ICs it's super easy to get flat frequency response, low distortion, and low noise. And solid state amps are more energy efficient, especially class-D amps.
 
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Blumlein 88

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Theoretically the right VST could do the trick. I'm not sure one fully replicates the sound, but I've not tried that many.

One approach might be to get a vacuum tube headphone amp and use it as a pre-amp to feed your power amp. I've done that before using a xmfr coupled triode headphone amp. Works nicely and the tubes in those usually last quite a long time.

I'm not currently up to date on what available tube phone amps would be fit for the job. Something transformer coupled and maybe capable of a watt or so would do it. If they just use a tube in the middle which they buffer with a transistor output then it won't give you the tube sound.
 

VintageFlanker

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These aren't really near-field speakers but I could try to make them work (2-3 feet away from me).
No, these aren't. Very bad move, IMHO.
Wide directivity of 906s is hardly compatible with such a short listening distance. I personally tried these nearfield quite a few times and they really sucked at it.
 

HarmonicTHD

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Foobar also hosts VSTs so not necessarily a DAW needed. (But I never tried it as I have a DAW anyhow).
 

Keith_W

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In general there are two types of tube amp emulation via VST. There are those that try to simulate tube clipping, and there are those that add harmonic distortion to make the sound seem "fatter" and more "saturated". Here are some examples of the former and here are some of the latter. The one that I use is Temper. You can find out more about it here and download it here. It is free, and can be hosted in any VST enabled playback software like JRiver or Foobar (which is also free).

Although it is quite effective, I don't think it sounds quite as natural as my tube headphone amp. I have to admit that I have only had it installed for a couple of weeks and I haven't played with it very much to find the best settings yet though.
 

Waxx

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I use a class D amp with a tube preamp in one audio set and a tube amp in another one. And as long as the speakers are not made for low damping factors (you're focals ain't) the tube preamp/class D amp does the trick. The tube preamp adds the harmonic distortion, while the amp itself is clean and very efficient with power.

My tube preamp is a heavy customised (by myself) chinese one, but that requires electronic skills and the dare and care to work on high voltage systems (my preamp runs on 300V B+). But there are relative cheap tube headphone amps that can be used as preamp also, like the Line Magnetic LM-Mini-84IA that cost (here) about 800€ and sounds great for a tube system. And you can also use it as a 3W SE amp if you would want it...

Basicly you need a single tube voltage gainstage (preferable followed by a buffer, but that does not has to be tube) to get the tube colouration. Mine is full tube, but i've heared others work also that way where only the voltage gain was tube, and the buffer was an opamp. Those colour also.

With vst, i never heared one that can do a convincing tube amp emulation for hifi. I checked Temper, but next to the real thing it sounds very artificial. I would love that they crack that code (and they probally will in the future), but i'm not convinced yet. But each to his own off course....
 

ZolaIII

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@VintageFlanker including bandwidth adjustment for which I use it more than anything other.
 
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HarmonicTHD

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In general there are two types of tube amp emulation via VST. There are those that try to simulate tube clipping, and there are those that add harmonic distortion to make the sound seem "fatter" and more "saturated". Here are some examples of the former and here are some of the latter. The one that I use is Temper. You can find out more about it here and download it here. It is free, and can be hosted in any VST enabled playback software like JRiver or Foobar (which is also free).

Although it is quite effective, I don't think it sounds quite as natural as my tube headphone amp. I have to admit that I have only had it installed for a couple of weeks and I haven't played with it very much to find the best settings yet though.
Guitar (tube) amps (so called Modelling Amps), which admittedly have an entire different purpose, are modeled very very convincingly by now. Be it via VST or built into hardware directly. Just a matter how much effort one wants to spent and if there is a market for it.
 
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solderdude

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Emulating a tube is one thing.
Emulating the harmonic spread of a tube amp (including feedback) is another thing.
Emulating the transformer(s) is another thing
Emulating the output resistance is a practical change and if that is frequency dependent it yet becomes another thing.
Emulating the clipping and output power aspects of 'tube amps' also not easy to do/possible.
Hifi amps are quite different from guitar amps.

So an exact emulation is not possible but one can emulate tube harmonics.
 

Mnyb

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I don't believe you get tube sound without the transformers.
Guitar (tube) amps (so called Moddeling Amps), which admittedly have an entire different purpose, are modeled very very convincingly by now. Be it via VST or built into hardware directly. Just a matter how much effort one wants to spent and if there is a market for it.
Possibly with these kind of guitar amp modelling software .
But no one designed transfer functions for popular hifi amps and then you also need to add the function of the speaker in the model , to emulate impedance (transformer ) interaction.
Modeling Amps do they work with a know speaker cab ? Then you can model the fr deviations caused by tube output transformers ?
 

HarmonicTHD

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Possibly with these kind of guitar amp modelling software .
But no one designed transfer functions for popular hifi amps and then you also need to add the function of the speaker in the model , to emulate impedance (transformer ) interaction.
Modeling Amps do they work with a know speaker cab ? Then you can model the fr deviations caused by tube output transformers ?
Yes you can select from different speaker cabinets sound models. Plus the positioning of the pickup mic. Afik. Simply speaking they model the impulse/ fr response of the real thing.

This gives an overview but development is constantly evolving:
 

computer-audiophile

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The approximate digital simulation of the sound of vintage guitar Tweed-Amps amps including their speakers works so well because they are very different from hi-fi precision. Their strong distortions can be easily reproduced. I have used such functions myself for my electric guitars. The finer characteristics of very good hi-fi tube amps are so subtle that I don't think they can be fully captured and recreated.

Although I have been involved in the design of tube amplifiers for decades, I can't say for myself exactly what their pleasant sound characteristics are in each and every aspect. But they are perceptible, and I know how to reach outstanding results.

(Please don't start a shitstorm now, I know that many ASR members don't want to know about it).
 
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Mnyb

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Yes you can select from different speaker cabinets sound models. Plus the positioning of the pickup mic. Afik. Simply speaking they model the impulse/ fr response of the real thing.

This gives an overview but development is constantly evolving:
Incredible :) cool
 

Mulder

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Not an answer to the question, but one can generally wonder what the market for tubes and tube amplifiers will look like in the future since tubes are largely manufactured in Russia. Electro-Harmonix for example, which basically supplies all tube guitar amps, as far as I know has all the manufacturing in Russia.
 

fpitas

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I don't believe you get tube sound without the transformers.
That can be a large part of it. Especially with a SET where you need a large gap and have high leakage inductance etc. But even the best push-pull transformers have a bit of hysteresis. I'm sure that DSP can simulate all of that.
 
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murkr

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No, these aren't. Very bad move, IMHO.
Wide directivity of 906s is hardly compatible with such a short listening distance. I personally tried these nearfield quite a few times and they really sucked at it.
Well that's a bummer. I have heard of people using the 906's nearfield and liked them. But I guess that's not "ideal" conditions for these speakers. I can probably get them 3-4ft away from me if I put them behind my desk. Would that make that much of a difference?
 

computer-audiophile

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China also does some tube manufacturing...
... in very good quality.

For example, they make reissues of the Western Electric 300B tubes, which have received good reviews.
I currently use Linlai 300B and 211 tubes in my amplifiers and am very happy with them.

There are also JJ Tubes from Slovakia, with which I have had good experiences.
 
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