Is it possible to create a DSD recording on a Realtek-based DAC/ADC which uses Realtek ASIO?

[Saidera]

My idea has not changed in 3 years:
To create a Realtek DAC which uses Realtek ASIO, preferably sth equivalent to ALC1220 for recording DSD for example, and with good specs, and unlike the gaming motherboards (ALC1220) and Rhodium DAC (ALC5686) measured on ASR. Also, the DAC can be fed any source but its output will always be DSD – software must be included which allows for this conversion to take place using low to high precision no of taps depending on how much attention you are paying to the music…it should have a dedicated mic jack, or even professional mic jacks. I must enlist Sony’s help in terms of SBM Direct, or at least be able to get Ayataka Nishio’s help. Software to record DSD must also be included.

There are problems in this plan. It is flawed. Firstly, nobody will cooperate. Secondly, I don’t have the necessary engineering skills and developing them is near impossible. Thirdly, even if it could be manufactured in 1k units there would be no market for this sort of thing.

Besides, I no longer subscribe to the DSD bandwagon which was in rage in Japan for some time. A DSD recorder for hire might exist in exclusive places connected to one of KORG, TEAC or Sony, but a portable recorder can only be found in PCM-D100. Actually a lot of the gaming motherboards (ALC1220) CAN record in DSD, except most people don't have the software. For what purpose? Digitise LP Records again? Probably, Japanese people are bored of all that VAIO Sound Reality DSD/SSMS and KORG MR-2 and PCM-D100 stuff.

If anyone relates to this sort of idea of a cheap DSD ADC I would like to hear your thoughts.

 

[AnalogSteph]

I mean, you could record in 24/192 and convert to DSD in software (maybe via an intermediate DXD), and nobody would be the wiser...

 

[Saidera]

Thanks. You're totally right. It will not be possible to bring back the VAIO DSD Recording system, because I don't think these new Realtek chips use Sony's designs for ALC889DSD.

 

[Ron Texas]

Nearly all DSD music is recorded in PCM because doing anything to DSD other than playing it back is too difficult. My understanding is it was designed as an archival format. Probably, it is relatively resistant to damage.

 

[Saidera]

Before we even start discussing whether cheap DSD recorders should become the norm, it is clear that portable PCM recorders at present are only satisfactory, and each company's product will record sound in a different way ('imparting a house sound'). Further, they're too expensive. I anticipate that by implementing a cheap Realtek ADC and marketing it as capable of recording pure DSD for up to $50 only, people will be able to record in DSD and then convert to PCM. There are supposedly subjective benefits in recording DSD from analog which trickle down to the later PCM conversion. I seriously doubt all this, but there is a minority of people who may still want to digitise vinyls in DSD. I know that no recorder companies want to entertain this unoriginal boring idea.

 

[L5730]

I never got DSD to record using ALC1220 on an AsRock TaiChi X370.
I tried that VinylStudio program, but it just crashed when trying.
Playback worked sort of OK, though the Topping D10 was much better behaved when switching DSD/PCM sources in a Foobnar2000 playlist.

 

[Saidera]

So you installed Realtek ASIO?

Do you have Sound It! 8 Pro or sth to record DSD via ASIO? Dunno about VinylStudio though.

 

[L5730]

Yes, I installed Realtek ASIO.

Vinyl Studio Pro should record DSD if configured to do so. However, I couldn't get it to work with Realtek ASIO.
https://www.alpinesoft.co.uk/VinylStudio/dsd.aspx

I only tried VinylStudio because someone I knew had a licence for me to try it. I didn't like the program and had no real use for it, apart form trying DSD recording.

Not sure how large the trial of SoundIt! 8 Pro is. Installer is 323 MiB. The trial is limited to only 3 days and:
"Several functions (Save / Batch Processing / Exporting to DDP / INASIO Audio Driver) are limited in this demo version."
What does that mean? Is the trial crippled and won't allow DSD recording? Sorry, I can't be bothered to install that and find out.

KORG's AudioGate requires KORG hardware, else it won't work.

TASCAM HiRes editor is an editor and playback program, not a recorder.

Sony HiRes Audio Recorder might work, but also might only work with the Sony hardware.

 

[Saidera]

Man, you're really on top of these things!

Yeah. Thanks for proving for me that Realtek's DSD claims are very much doubtful - even its playback may not be native, since its chips have historically favoured the 48kHz sampling rate and its 44.1kHz is done via a cheat method. IVX is one of the doubters of Realtek 44.1kHz capabilities.

DSD for Realtek was simply for Sony's VAIO, and after that I'm sure they just dropped it.

Yet I have ALC4042,4050,5686 on dongles ... and mucked around years ago trying to overcome the 24/48 limit on my ALC3268 (Thinkpad) using Realtek confidential software tools - I could only get 24 bit recording to be unlocked, but DSD Mode didn't work.

 

[L5730]

I think it's more of an old issue where by Realtek (and Creative among others) only did 48 kHz and just did a nasty job at resampling. ASIO4ALL has an option for those kinds of badly implemented hardware, so that resampling is done in software for a better result.

There definitely is an increase in frequency response when recording the analogue output of the Realtek ALC1220 onboard into another (HiRes) ADC, and using test files at HiRes sample rates. This suggests that it does indeed work at those sample rates, and is not just limited to 24 kHz (48 kHz SR).

Playback of DSD also worked, as far as the software was concerned (what the chip actually did inside, I don't know). But it's buggy and much better handled by the Topping D10 or even the Tempotec SHDPro.

ALC3268 certainly should, according to literature, work with higher sample rates. Oh well.


As far as the topic of actually recording DSD goes, seeing as there isn't much in the way of editing ability, my preference would be for PCM, even if it [DSD recording] did work.