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"Is Audiophile Snobbery Ruining our Hobby ?"
- Thread starter VintageFlanker
- Start date
Vict0r
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Hell, I don't know. That video is an hour long. You tell me. 
More importantly; is elitism ruining black metal?
More importantly; is elitism ruining black metal?
OP
- Thread Starter
- #3
Definitely. Done. 1 second talk.
Loathecliff
Senior Member
Mrs. Loathecliff innocently ruined a Frenchman's audio life recently when he heard 'Live at the Pershing' on our cobbled-together system by saying:- "It sounds better in mono doesn't it?"
Does that count?
Does that count?
solderdude
Grand Contributor
Is Audiophile Snobbery Ruining our Hobby ?
Does one let audiophile snobbery ruin one's hobby ?Audiophile snobbery has been present for as long as I can remember.
I, for sure, don't pay any attention to it any more but admit to desiring it when I was young but could not afford it and now do not want to buy any of it.
Tl;dw, sorry. (Don't know how others manage to sit out these Audioholics video chats. Perhaps they're just not my thing.)
Which doesn't mean I can't reflect on the thread title!
---
For me, it isn't ruining it at all. I'd even say it adds to the fun! Seeing how easy it is these days to recognise it, take it for what it is, and do better oneself.
Which doesn't mean I can't reflect on the thread title!
---
For me, it isn't ruining it at all. I'd even say it adds to the fun! Seeing how easy it is these days to recognise it, take it for what it is, and do better oneself.
DeLub
Active Member
No. I just ignore it and enjoy the music
For sure!
Vacceo
Major Contributor
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2022
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Isn't elitism part of the territory when dealing with Black Metal?Hell, I don't know. That video is an hour long. You tell me.
More importantly; is elitism ruining black metal?
Now, on topic: as long as there are Topping and similar down to Earth manufacturers, we're fine.
Loathecliff
Senior Member
Good question. Have you seen the results of the scratch tests?
Vict0r
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Isn't elitism part of the territory when dealing with Black Metal?
Exactly! You could argue it's inherently elitist. If it was inclusive, it wouldn't have existed in the first place. On the other hand, the elitism is so 1992.
Anyway, who cares. Back to the topic at hand! 
In my view, it's not elitism that's killing (killed?) the hobby, it's ignorance. Technically knowledgeable people wouldn't fall for the snake-oil behind so much expensive rubbish. Expensive equipment would have to perform audibly better than cheap stuff to justify its price, and as much cheap stuff is already quite Good Enough, there's little justification other than snobbery for the expensive stuff.
S
S
JSmith
Master Contributor
I'm drinking a glass of snake oil as I watch this...
I think they are correct in some ways, however agree with others it's nothing new. Elitism in audio does turn people off this hobby and I hope (think) that ASR is doing a good job at not only exposing poor products, but gradually reducing this elitism that the industry suffers from and allowing more people to identify and enjoy good measuring equipment.
I'm not done with the video as yet though.
JSmith
I think they are correct in some ways, however agree with others it's nothing new. Elitism in audio does turn people off this hobby and I hope (think) that ASR is doing a good job at not only exposing poor products, but gradually reducing this elitism that the industry suffers from and allowing more people to identify and enjoy good measuring equipment.
I'm not done with the video as yet though.
JSmith
JSmith
Master Contributor
Ok... bit pissed that Gene is taking a shot at ASR, suggesting all ASR care about is SINAD. Clearly he needs to read the reviews properly... either that or stop talking smack about ASR. Generally I respect Gene... that just took a small dive for now. Unsure what he doesn't get about the correlation of good measurements to excellent design and implementation. It's not always about audibility. Now he's having a go at blind testing... uh oh. I didn't see the need to mention ASR in this discussion... not liking the implication thus far.
JSmith
JSmith
Audio is like many mature technologies which have been commoditized. Most of the market moves on and enjoys the fact that they can enjoy whatever it is that the technology is intended to deliver without spending a lot or thinking about it too much, an ever shrinking fringe will retreat into voodoo and spending $$$$$$$$s on boutique stuff because they like to consider themselves blessed with special insight and discernment denied to the riff raff. This is no different than all sorts of things such as watches, cameras and smartphones.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #17
Honestly, we should face it: He is not entirely wrong about that.
ASR provides extensive measurements. Yet, many (many) readers (Edit: ≠members) here do seem a bit too lazy to read entire reviews and pay only attention to ranking between products, solely based on SINAD (1Khz/2V/4V/5W/4Ω) chart...
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JSmith
Master Contributor
My opinion is we have... many, many times. I mean how many threads have their been about SINAD and understanding measurements?
As we know that can be an exercise in folly... maybe new members need to seek to understand the full suite of measurements done. Generally most ranking metrics don't tell the whole story in general, not just in the audio world.
Anyway, I thought it was a bit unnecessary and a large oversimplification of what is done here, but then I was a bit cranky at work after a long day when watching too.
I really don't think ranking products by SINAD is creating audiophile snobbery... that has existed for a very long time.
JSmith
I think the graph with all the devices of each class ordered by sinad and with great-poor regions has something to do with that...Honestly, we should face it: He is not entirely wrong about that.
ASR provides extensive measurements. Yet, many (many) readers here do seem a bit too lazy to read entire reviews and pay only attention to ranking between products, solely based on SINAD (1Khz/2V/4V/5W/4Ω) chart...
yes. I am fed up with people saying to me 'My DAC is near the bottom of the ASR rankings but it sounds great. So measurements don't tell the whole story/ are meaningless.'
They don't see the SINAD rankings as anything different to the one, two, three, four, five stars system of magazines like 'What Hi-Fi.' That's what they are used to.
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