Is a Toroidal Transformer In A Power Line Conditioner A Bad Thing?

[dman777]

Disclaimer: This is not a post on 'if I should buy this' or if it 'would make my audio sound better'. I am not looking to save money or any advice on how I should spend my money, which seems to be how all my posts on here get hijacked to. This is a tech. question. If it bothers you that I like this power controller in any manner, please just don't reply.

I am looking to acquire the McIntosh MPC1500 Power Line Conditioner. It has a large toroidal isolation transformer.

McIntosh MPC1500 Power Controller

The MPC1500 Power Controller provides total isolation, low noise, and clean, consistent power to your home audio system, enabling it to deliver its best possible sonic performance.

www.mcintoshlabs.com

However, in this video this audiophile mentioned not to get a power line conditioner with a toroidal transformer because it will suck the power away from the amplifier and make it sound less open. Is this true with a toroidal transformer in a power line conditioner?

 

[Speedskater]

Just stop watching dumb videos like that.

 

[DVDdoug]

I really don't know the advantages/disadvantages.... There are trade-offs in almost every design of anything and the manufacturer will usually tout the trade-offs and design decisions as features or advantages. It MIGHT just be form-factor... Allowing a large transformer in a lower-profile box. (Not low-profile but lowerer profile. )

However, in this video this audiophile mentioned not to get a power line conditioner with a toroidal transformer because it will suck the power away from the amplifier and make it sound less open. Is this true with a toroidal transformer in a power line conditioner?

I didn't watch the video but that's nonsense! I'm guessing he didn't test it...

Of course there is efficiency loss in anything like this but as long as the output voltage holds-up while drawing the necessary power/current, that doesn't affect the amplifier or anything connected. i.e. If the amplifier is consuming 500W, the power conditioner might be consuming 50W internally and consumin 550W from the wall outlet.

...That's just a made-up number but 90% efficiency wouldn't be unreasonable at higher power output. At lower power it's probably less efficient and at no load (not powering anything) it will still consume some power and at that point it's zero-percent efficient.

It's not delivering less power to the amplifier (or whatever) unless it's stressed beyond it's specs/limits. But it's pulling extra power out of the wall.

 

[antcollinet]

Disclaimer: This is not a post on 'if I should buy this' or if it 'would make my audio sound better'. I am not looking to save money or any advice on how I should spend my money, which seems to be how all my posts on here get hijacked to. This is a tech. question. If it bothers you that I like this power controller in any manner, please just don't reply.

I am looking to acquire the McIntosh MPC1500 Power Line Conditioner. It has a large toroidal isolation transformer.

McIntosh MPC1500 Power Controller

The MPC1500 Power Controller provides total isolation, low noise, and clean, consistent power to your home audio system, enabling it to deliver its best possible sonic performance.

www.mcintoshlabs.com

However, in this video this audiophile mentioned not to get a power line conditioner with a toroidal transformer because it will suck the power away from the amplifier and make it sound less open. Is this true with a toroidal transformer in a power line conditioner?

His problem is he is starting from the false premise that the power conditioner can alter the sound at all.

It can't, for reasons that have been discussed and measured here frequently enough

That statement applies both positively and negatively - in that the sound can be neither improved nor impaired (assuming sufficient power is provided, and it basically works correctly), regardless of what transformer is in it.

Plus what @Speedskater said.

 

[SIY]

However, in this video this audiophile mentioned not to get a power line conditioner with a toroidal transformer because it will suck the power away from the amplifier and make it sound less open.

This should be a clue to never listen to anything this ignoramus has to say.

 

[EERecordist]

I am an electrical engineer and I work on the electrical grid.

If you are in the USA or a developed country, you don't need that. The technical term is power quality.

If you like, you can power your system through an inexpensive Eaton Isobar. They are available new or used. Sola makes large transformers, sometimes found used.

The theory of isolation transformers is that there is upstream noise. Transformers are a low pass filter. So upstream of your pole or pedestal transformer is noise which is not passed. You share local noise with shared transformer people. The power transformer in your equipment deletes that. After that the rest of the power supply and gain stage filtering dumps noise to ground.

Many ASR experts will say spend money on REW then sound conditioning for your room and on speakers with REW. Best with your audio journey!

 

[voodooless]

This is a tech. question

Is it?

it will suck the power away from the amplifier and make it sound less open.

… clearly not!

What do you expect that this device does for you?

 

[Speedskater]

I would go with McIntosh engineering knowledge & skill over someone that makes U-tube videos.

 

[Punter]

You don't mention what model/brand of equipment you intend to power from this "conditioner" but if those units are of a relatively expensive nature I would expect that the power supplies in those units would be able to supply clean DC power to the operational circuits.

Toroidal transformers have two main properties that distinguish them from "E" core transformers. One is aspect ratio, toroidal transformers are "low profile" and allow more compact packaging for a given device and secondly, they exhibit higher "inrush" current than an "E" core transformer. This often requires a "mute" relay be included in the circuit of a power amplifier to avoid a "pop" when the unit is powered on.

The continuing mythology around AC power and its "cleanliness" ignores the fact that the DC powering your equipment is the result of the AC mains waveform being completely altered and filtered by the power supply built in to the equipment. Any supply using an "E" core or toroidal power transformer includes isolation as an intrinsic property of the transformer itself. Adding another transformer, supposedly wound in a 1:1 ratio, is completely unnecessary.

If the quote you mentioned is from the individual who has made the YouTube video, he is exposing his complete ignorance of electrical theory and is merely parroting something a salesman has fed him.

 

[egellings]

Just stop watching dumb videos like that.

Does he give a plausible explanation as to why a toroidal transformer might do this?