Introductions anyone?

[Wombat]

There really hasn't been any "bombastic" steps forward in High Fidelity reproduction in many decades, they have all been very minute and extremely subtle steps. About the closest we came was the introduction of digital recording and playback at the consumer level.
Welcome!

Interesting exercise - cross-out the adjectives in a marketing blurb.

 

[stunta]

^^^

Anyone with a Calvin & Hobbes avatar definitely gets a welcome to the forum from me!

And I thought I was unique, just like everyone else

Just found this thread so I’ll introduce myself. Born in India, came to the US in Y2K to get my masters in CS.
I am a software engineer at a rather large company. I lead a team that takes machine learning (AI) models and operationalizes them into something that actually works end to end at scale (very large scale). Sometimes it turns out to be useful for the users.

My wife thinks I am in the wrong industry and that I should have gone into the financial sector. She is probably right. I do spend quite a bit of time reading financial blogs and know how to make investments work for us. I want to retire early so I can do whatever I want whenever I want.

Traveling the world is the uktimate goal. I am at about 20 countries so far which feels far too less given my age but is a lot more than I imagined 10 years ago.

Photography was once a hobby but now I just take the best camera that is portable. No zoom, nothing fancy, just a sharp fast prime lens will do.

Hifi has been a passion for the longest time. I am not technical in this area though and am more of an enthusiast. Early on I sucked into a lot of snake oil by hanging out with a bunch of guys who are good people but a really bad influence with hifi. I bought and sold some really expensive stuff because I was never happy with any of it for more 6 months. As I started to learn a few basics about Dacs, amps, speakers etc. I started to get disgusted by this industry. I am used to data-driven development at work and we go to extreme lengths to measure and evaluate our features on a constant basis. If someone tells me they “feel” like it works correctly, one of us has to leave. Luckily that hasn’t happened with the team I am in. The world of hifi has a terrible signal to noise ratio. There are far too many manufacturers producing shiny things and paying off spineless reviewers. Everything sounds airy with a massive soundstage that is larger than any stage.. everything punches way above its weight class. I am supposed to take some random person’s word for it and shell out thousands of dollars? It’s amazing the extent to which cognitive dissonance drives this industry; most people can’t admit they bought crap and paid a crapload of money for it.

This website is exactly what I was looking for. I have a lot to learn.. my work schedule and intensity leaves me with very little mental bandwidth to learn new things outside of it, which is another reason to want to ramp down on the day job. I optimistically purchased a few books on audio, electronics etc. but they are gathering dust. However, I think I now understand just enough to make an educated decision based on graphs with explanations like Amir does..

I hope I can also contribute in some way.

If you read this far, you probably caught this last line while reading the post below.

 

[Thomas savage]

And I thought I was unique, just like everyone else

Just found this thread so I’ll introduce myself. Born in India, came to the US in Y2K to get my masters in CS.
I am a software engineer at a rather large company. I lead a team that takes machine learning (AI) models and operationalizes them into something that actually works end to end at scale (very large scale). Sometimes it turns out to be useful for the users.

My wife thinks I am in the wrong industry and that I should have gone into the financial sector. She is probably right. I do spend quite a bit of time reading financial blogs and know how to make investments work for us. I want to retire early so I can do whatever I want whenever I want.

Traveling the world is the uktimate goal. I am at about 20 countries so far which feels far too less given my age but is a lot more than I imagined 10 years ago.

Photography was once a hobby but now I just take the best camera that is portable. No zoom, nothing fancy, just a sharp fast prime lens will do.

Hifi has been a passion for the longest time. I am not technical in this area though and am more of an enthusiast. Early on I sucked into a lot of snake oil by hanging out with a bunch of guys who are good people but a really bad influence with hifi. I bought and sold some really expensive stuff because I was never happy with any of it for more 6 months. As I started to learn a few basics about Dacs, amps, speakers etc. I started to get disgusted by this industry. I am used to data-driven development at work and we go to extreme lengths to measure and evaluate our features on a constant basis. If someone tells me they “feel” like it works correctly, one of us has to leave. Luckily that hasn’t happened with the team I am in. The world of hifi has a terrible signal to noise ratio. There are far too many manufacturers producing shiny things and paying off spineless reviewers. Everything sounds airy with a massive soundstage that is larger than any stage.. everything punches way above its weight class. I am supposed to take some random person’s word for it and shell out thousands of dollars? It’s amazing the extent to which cognitive dissonance drives this industry; most people can’t admit they bought crap and paid a crapload of money for it.

This website is exactly what I was looking for. I have a lot to learn.. my work schedule and intensity leaves me with very little mental bandwidth to learn new things outside of it, which is another reason to want to ramp down on the day job. I optimistically purchased a few books on audio, electronics etc. but they are gathering dust. However, I think I now understand just enough to make an educated decision based on graphs with explanations like Amir does..

I hope I can also contribute in some way.

If you read this far, you probably caught this last line while reading the post below.

Thanks for this it’s great..,

I think many of us have followed the ‘learning curve’ you detail here , I know I have.

Thanks also for taking the time to tell us about yourself, personally I find it beneficial to read a little about members and their motivations. It helps establish a base that enriches further communication, helps contextualise us in a way that can very helpful.

 

[Ron Party]

Two Calvin & Hobbes avatars! This site just keeps getting better and better!

 

[Cosmik]

There really hasn't been any "bombastic" steps forward in High Fidelity reproduction in many decades, they have all been very minute and extremely subtle steps. About the closest we came was the introduction of digital recording and playback at the consumer level.

Things could have gone backwards, too. There has been recent mention of R.E. Greene. One of his interests is in how speakers have changed shape from wide boxes to today's slim-fronted versions and how this is detrimental to the sound. Mr. Putzeys also talks about this with his paper on the design of the Grimm LS1 and why he designed it the way he did.

Another change over the years has been the disappearance of sealed woofers, with near-universal adoption of bass reflex instead. This changes the way the speaker interacts with the room, plus other arbitrary side effects. The recent crop of DSP-based active speakers are being built with sealed boxes and thus correcting this retrograde step.

DSP and active amplification seem to be changing the designers' mindset from random trial-and-error to, finally, designing speakers with purpose to do the pretty simple job they are required to. The biggest danger, IMO, is that they go DSP-happy and begin imagining they can 'correct' the room.

@Sylafari mentions his general disappointment with the hi fi that he often hears. Unless he is being sucked down the valves and vinyl rabbit hole, I am sure that this disappointment will be primarily due to the speakers, not the other electronics. People are powerless to do anything about it: they obviously can't do much to change the sound of an existing passive speaker, and if it's DSP-based it can still be just as much an inaccessible black box. And it can sound even worse than a conventional speaker; I have heard some terrible setups, particularly if the salesman has allowed the system to 'optimise' itself with a room measurement phase. Prospective customers go away thinking "I have heard DSP, and it's rubbish" when of course they have just heard another badly designed speaker. I am lucky because my system is DSP-based, and I am able to fiddle with the software if necessary - I have a system that is "as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler".

I would like to see the future of the hi fi hobby being one of speakers supplied without crossovers, and a box of electronics capable of downloading preset crossover files (Devialet has already begun to go down this route) plus the ability for the user to refine the system from very simple, intuitive, limited ways (e.g. the depth of baffle step compensation applicable to their room being adjusted by ear) through to advanced setups if they felt the need. Instead of useless FUD like believing that power cords and DACs sound different, they really would be able to make audible changes and would be 'empowered' to set the system up to perfection.

 

[Sal1950]

I would like to see the future of the hi fi hobby being one of speakers supplied without crossovers, and a box of electronics capable of downloading preset crossover files (Devialet has already begun to go down this route) plus the ability for the user to refine the system from very simple, intuitive, limited ways (e.g. the depth of baffle step compensation applicable to their room being adjusted by ear) through to advanced setups if they felt the need. Instead of useless FUD like believing that power cords and DACs sound different, they really would be able to make audible changes and would be 'empowered' to set the system up to perfection.

We have started to take some very positive steps down that road. From the speaker approaches like D&D and Kii to JBL's monitor line and the big M2's.
We'll see if or how long before the audiophool ad driven media start to really give proper credit and respect. After all, this approach is "NOT good for commerce" in their little HiEnd boys club.

 

[Jorj]

Hi everyone! What a great forum. I've learned more here over the last few hours than I have in months lurking on other sites. @amirm & @Cosmik , you've both got my respect, and to the others I did not mention, thanks to you also.

I'd recovered from my audiophilia some years back. Car audio was my poison, simply because of where I lived and how many relentless hours it took to get anywhere. Grocery store? An hour each way. Movie? Skip it, too far. Delivery pizza? What's that? As I got older and had a few kids, dollars for hobbies became harder to come by, so I weaned off and....recovered. Whew.

Now that I'm on the east coast, I don't own a car. I bike everywhere. I also now work from home, but my condo is small, and I have neighbors. A nice stereo seems kinda rude. What's the harm in looking into a good set of headphones? I have this really nicely curated library of FLAC files that I'm not doing justice. (Please don't start on me with vinyl, records don't work in cars, so I did not bother.) A friend who is smart and thoughtful turned me onto some gear that sounded better than what I was using, and dollars are quite a bit more available, so I picked up some odds and ends. Nothing expensive, just getting back in the pool. JDS Labs Element. Oppo PM-3. Not Beats. Schiit stack. HD650. Uhhh....what just happened? Who are these schiitbois?

A bit of browsing brought me to SBAF, and at first, I thought it might be OK. Then I read a few threads, and I got a little scared. It rapidly got so bad that I now regret owning a couple of little silver boxes, although they really are not too bad. It's just the taste in my mouth....kinda leaves a reptilian aftertaste....is that snake oil? Not sure, but it feels that way.

Anyway, here I am, looking to learn, so I'll be mostly quiet, and will try very hard to not ask questions that are insufferably stupid or detract from the conversations.

 

[amirm]

Warm welcome to the forum Jorj. And thanks for the kind words.

Speaking of turntables and cars, one of the most fascinating things in my youth was my dad buying a car that came with a turntable! It was a tube based affair on full suspensions. It still jumped but if you went on smooth roads, it sort of worked. It was a marvel of engineering. This being 1960s....

 

[Sal1950]

I'd recovered from my audiophilia some years back

Welcome Jorj.
Recovery can be a long hard road and beware cause relapses are epidemic.
Watch out for that headphone gear addiction, it can be a monster. LOL

 

[stunta]

Anyway, here I am, looking to learn, so I'll be mostly quiet, and will try very hard to not ask questions that are insufferably stupid.

I could use some company in that department although a ban might be imminent if I keep it up for.too long.

Welcome.

 

[MysteriousPrism]

Hello everyone!

I'm so glad this community exists! Over the past half decade or so I've developed more and more of an interest in audio and music, but was always unnerved by the snake oil readily devoured by most "audiophiles". I'm a college student, I initially pursued electrical engineering, I've since switched to a music degree with a computer science/IT minor, so I think I'll fit in well here even if I'm not as learned as most. I like messing around with Linux and electronics, so maybe someday I'll get a scope and begin performing tests of my own. Objectivity and rationality have always been important to me, so its wonderful to find a place that shares those values.

As a broke millennial I'm also appreciative that you all take the time to prove that some of the cheaper options out there can outperform stuff many times its price. As a bed to practice my recording skills this Christmas I was very lucky to get a pair of JBL LSR305s and a Behringer UMC204HD. Looking into the UMC204HD is how I found this site and I'm very glad my musician/IT guy dad picked it, as I was originally planning to buy a Schiit stack. I'm glad I can save that money. My little setup is more than enough for my dorm (I currently don't know where to put the monitors there's such little usable space). I'm glad I'm too broke (and I like to think too smart) to fall into the trap of audiophilia, although I'm sure I'll have to control myself in the future

Like Jorj before me, I'm here to listen, learn, and contribute what I can.

 

[Sal1950]

Like Jorj before me, I'm here to listen, learn, and contribute what I can.

Ah, another youngling for the group it is.
Welcome to the light side of the force MP!

 

[svart-hvitt]

And I thought I was unique, just like everyone else

Just found this thread so I’ll introduce myself. Born in India, came to the US in Y2K to get my masters in CS.
I am a software engineer at a rather large company. I lead a team that takes machine learning (AI) models and operationalizes them into something that actually works end to end at scale (very large scale). Sometimes it turns out to be useful for the users.

My wife thinks I am in the wrong industry and that I should have gone into the financial sector. She is probably right. I do spend quite a bit of time reading financial blogs and know how to make investments work for us. I want to retire early so I can do whatever I want whenever I want.

Traveling the world is the uktimate goal. I am at about 20 countries so far which feels far too less given my age but is a lot more than I imagined 10 years ago.

Photography was once a hobby but now I just take the best camera that is portable. No zoom, nothing fancy, just a sharp fast prime lens will do.

Hifi has been a passion for the longest time. I am not technical in this area though and am more of an enthusiast. Early on I sucked into a lot of snake oil by hanging out with a bunch of guys who are good people but a really bad influence with hifi. I bought and sold some really expensive stuff because I was never happy with any of it for more 6 months. As I started to learn a few basics about Dacs, amps, speakers etc. I started to get disgusted by this industry. I am used to data-driven development at work and we go to extreme lengths to measure and evaluate our features on a constant basis. If someone tells me they “feel” like it works correctly, one of us has to leave. Luckily that hasn’t happened with the team I am in. The world of hifi has a terrible signal to noise ratio. There are far too many manufacturers producing shiny things and paying off spineless reviewers. Everything sounds airy with a massive soundstage that is larger than any stage.. everything punches way above its weight class. I am supposed to take some random person’s word for it and shell out thousands of dollars? It’s amazing the extent to which cognitive dissonance drives this industry; most people can’t admit they bought crap and paid a crapload of money for it.

This website is exactly what I was looking for. I have a lot to learn.. my work schedule and intensity leaves me with very little mental bandwidth to learn new things outside of it, which is another reason to want to ramp down on the day job. I optimistically purchased a few books on audio, electronics etc. but they are gathering dust. However, I think I now understand just enough to make an educated decision based on graphs with explanations like Amir does..

I hope I can also contribute in some way.

If you read this far, you probably caught this last line while reading the post below.

If you think work-leisure balance is wrong where you live, go to Switzerland or Scandinavia/the Nordic region. There’s a recent thread on it.

If you’re a software expert and audio is your big interest, why not go into audio? Even Apple tries to do something in that space these days. And modern cars are full of high tech audio.

 

[Thomas savage]

I could use some company in that department although a ban might be imminent if I keep it up for.too long.

Welcome.

Objectively one can observe my continued presence and deduce no such ban will or arguably could be reasonably imposed..
No question is stupid , it’s just often there’s more to it so the seemingly simple inquiry is not that simple . Can be frustrating but in fact it’s just a door opening to further understanding, it’s also a door shutting in your face too though , just make sure your facing the right way to limit the pain

 

[Wombat]

Objectively one can observe my continued presence and deduce no such ban will or arguably could be reasonably imposed..
No question is stupid , it’s just often there’s more to it so the seemingly simple inquiry is not that simple . Can be frustrating but in fact it’s just a door opening to further understanding, it’s also a door shutting in your face too though , just make sure your facing the right way to limit the pain

I think it depends on the current Avatar.

 

[Jorj]

Speaking of turntables and cars, one of the most fascinating things in my youth was my dad buying a car that came with a turntable! It was a tube based affair on full suspensions. It still jumped but if you went on smooth roads, it sort of worked. It was a marvel of engineering. This being 1960s....

I'm a car guy (yes, who does not own one) and really dig that oddball stuff. Do you recall the make & model? I have seen the photos of the Chrysler solution that pulled out of the dash on drawer slides.

BTW, I forgot to mention what I'm into. I worked 10 years in distribution power manufacturing (read, transformers, big-n-small), then in plant engineering (pipes, pumps, tanks, controls) and now I've added software development. My CD catalog is ripped and verified in FLAC (I prefer EAC for ripping duties due to the variability of CD transports), and obsessively cataloged, ReplayGain valued, DR valued, proper album art metadata....urp, now I'm making myself sick. I'm very excited about adapting AI into the software tools we're working on. Thinking very hard about moving so I can buy something like the Devialet Phantom Golds...the idea of no cables, cords, fuss and still having great sound....what took so long, and is anyone else doing it this well?

I'm an avid cyclist, prolific reader, a skeptic and (so I'm told) patient to a fault.

Finally, I'm an objectivist. Boo hiss. The foundation of every good thing humans have ever done (and more than a few bad) has been the result of looking at our universe objectively, quantifying it, establishing the rules by which it works, and adapting our approach to work within the confines of those rules. IE, no freaking magic. This view, of course, does not pertain as strictly to artistic endeavors, which is why audio science is so much fun. We are hammering works of art into boxes that always damage the art. I <love, like, disregard, dislike, hate> the art subjectively, but always respect the effort of the artist and want to understand how best to place it in a box with the hope that I can experience it over and over again and it will elicit the same feelings in me as though I were right there when it was being created. It is this wonderful blend of objectivity and subjectivity, but let's be clear....the objectivity part comes first when it comes to building boxes.

 

[amirm]

I'm a car guy (yes, who does not own one) and really dig that oddball stuff. Do you recall the make & model?

We have a bunch of other car guys here too.

On the brand, I want to say it was Blaupunkt or some German brand like that.

 

[amirm]

Hello everyone!

Hello there and welcome to the forum! We are definitely a bunch of cheap bastards looking for bargains in audio.

 

[Thomas savage]

Hello there and welcome to the forum! We are definitely a bunch of cheap bastards looking for bargains in audio.

We need a “cheap bastard of the month” award.., this month it’s @Cosmik for the amplification he uses and all that self done software he seems to do.

Cheap as , well done.

@RayDunzl and @Sal1950 thought they had cheapskate all locked down, a win for the yanks but Cosmik is keeping the limey end up in spectacular fashion .

I’m a bit of a let down but I’m using £30 interconnects now on everything, a late charge.

 

[Cosmik]

We need a “cheap bastard of the month” award.., this month it’s @Cosmik for the amplification he uses and all that self done software he seems to do.

Cheap as , well done.

@RayDunzl and @Sal1950 thought they had cheapskate all locked down, a win for the yanks but Cosmik is keeping the limey end up in spectacular fashion .

I’m a bit of a let down but I’m using £30 interconnects now on everything, a late charge.

Thanks for the award, Thomas! I am a worthy recipient.

It's not that I absolutely have to be a cheapskate, but I take great pride in it. If you build your own speakers using vintage donor enclosures, you can choose from hundreds of really stylish, well made designs and get them from eBay for £20. Throw in some low cost drivers (that have a very easy job to do), a fanless PC based on the same chipset as a tablet, a multichannel DAC that musicians would use, and the aforementioned AV amp and you've got 'high end' for about £500. You can control it from your phone or iPad, say.

The lack of stress in such an approach is immense. If it fails totally (not that it can, really) you've at least done a few interesting experiments and not wasted 27000 euros. If it succeeds and actually sounds really good, then you may just have learned a small secret of the universe.

For me, though, it's the look of the speakers. I don't think you can do better than have some 1970s speakers in your living room...