Introducing the Phono Cartridge Measurement Library

[mackat]

Signet MK111Ea

Just got this off USAM - the seller forgot my request to tape the stylus protector in place, so it was rattling around in the box

Cantilever was skewed, but luckily this is an AT so it was easily adjustable. Very nice gold-plated beryllium.

It was advertised as only having a few hours of use, but I think it's a fair bit more than that...

Crosstalk is more like -25 to -30 on the Fozgometer, I didn't further optimize.

 

[sqrl]

Signet MK111Ea

Just got this off USAM - the seller forgot my request to tape the stylus protector in place, so it was rattling around in the box

Cantilever was skewed, but luckily this is an AT so it was easily adjustable. Very nice gold-plated beryllium.

It was advertised as only having a few hours of use, but I think it's a fair bit more than that...

View attachment 533238
View attachment 533239
Crosstalk is more like -25 to -30 on the Fozgometer, I didn't further optimize.

Nicely done photo

 

[mackat]

Nicely done photo

Thank you! There are more to come - I’m starting to get the hang of this with the kind help of @USER

 

[melloncolliecat]

Thanks for that one @mackat ! Of special interest to me, since I have a retipped Signet Mk111E. (Don't know if there's any difference from the Ea?) Alas, I don't know anything about the retipping job, I got it cheap enough to take a chance. It seems to be a well executed retipping job, but the peak around 11-12 kHz is a couple of dB's higher than yours.

 

[mackat]

Denon DL-207

I purchased this one recently on eBay as NOS, but I'm not sure this is the case, primarily based on distortion measurements.

This has a boron cantilever like the DL-305, but uses a bigger diamond and has a higher effective tip mass of 0.25 mg.

My first thought is: why use boron at all with this frequency response? Not exactly flat.

What do you think this image shows regarding wear?

Another shot of the diamond:

 

[sqrl]

Denon DL-207

I purchased this one recently on eBay as NOS, but I'm not sure this is the case, primarily based on distortion measurements.

This has a boron cantilever like the DL-305, but uses a bigger diamond and has a higher effective tip mass of 0.25 mg.

My first thought is: why use boron at all with this frequency response? Not exactly flat.

View attachment 533719
View attachment 533720

What do you think this image shows regarding wear?

View attachment 533721

Another shot of the diamond:

View attachment 533722

Hard to tell on the wear - the highlights are a bit blown and the contacts not lit on the side view. You can try to light it at 45° from "below" the stylus (e.g. lie it flat on its back and light at 45° from above).

It looks like the expected FR looking at the rise from 5 kHz here.

 

[USER]

If you are using goose necks, dim them some more and put some tissue in front of them to soften the lights further. I use supplemental lighting as well so that the only job for the goose necks is to illuminate the wear. Part of it is also making sure the tip is fully in focus. My microscope has a light on the nose piece (that I dim) and I also have an light behind the set-up facing me. Something like this could work: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FBX65PNG

Here the wear is bright but not blown out and the stylus as a whole is illuminated by the other lights. It's a pain in the butt to set-up but once you have it it is easier.

 

[mackat]

If you are using goose necks, dim them some more and put some tissue in front of them to soften the lights further. I use supplemental lighting as well so that the only job for the goose necks is to illuminate the wear. Part of it is also making sure the tip is fully in focus. My microscope has a light on the nose piece (that I dim) and I also have an light behind the set-up facing me. Something like this could work: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FBX65PNG

Here the wear is bright but not blown out and the stylus as a whole is illuminated by the other lights. It's a pain in the butt to set-up but once you have it it is easier.

Thank you for the tips! I will have to play around with it a bit more to get the best lighting. I am using the goose necks with tissue, but I realized I never set up the ring light.

I'm also having an issue with the microscope moving when I press the button to take a picture. I need to figure out if there's a remote or delay function.

 

[Jimi Floyd]

Thank you for the tips! I will have to play around with it a bit more to get the best lighting. I am using the goose necks with tissue, but I realized I never set up the ring light.

I'm also having an issue with the microscope moving when I press the button to take a picture. I need to figure out if there's a remote or delay function.

I don't know if you use your phone or a camera to take pictures. If it is a phone you can buy for very few $/£/€ a remote bluetooth clicker button to shoot without touching.

 

[richjoh]

Here is Nagaoka MP200, the change is only the test records, CA-TRS-1007 and CBS STR120. They do measure same near 20kHz. The channel difference of the TRS-1007 was repeated to see if it was a tracking issue, I got same result. Is it software related, I have no idea.

Without any data to distinguish, I would side with CBS STR-120 only because its FR goes out to 50KHz.

Rich

View attachment 532743

View attachment 532745

The issue turned out to be the online plot "Standard" vs "Advanced" setup. The Standard result I get a 1.5dB delta between L & R channels of a cartridge (attached case is Nagaoka MP-150). No such delta occurs when I run the Advanced plot. This occurred with CA-TRS-1007 test record but also happens with the CBS STR-100 or STR-120 test record, any test record. I'll stick to using the Advanced setup when running the cartridge FR online plot. The correct test record on attached plots are TRS-1007 (20Hz-20kHz), they're mislabeled CBS-STR-120 which is 500Hz-50kHz.

 

[richjoh]

The issue turned out to be the online plot "Standard" vs "Advanced" setup. The Standard result I get a 1.5dB delta between L & R channels of a cartridge (attached case is Nagaoka MP-150). No such delta occurs when I run the Advanced plot. This occurred with CA-TRS-1007 test record but also happens with the CBS STR-100 or STR-120 test record, any test record. I'll stick to using the Advanced setup when running the cartridge FR online plot. The correct test record on attached plots are TRS-1007 (20Hz-20kHz), they're mislabeled CBS-STR-120 which is 500Hz-50kHz.

Two plots below, top is Clear Audio TR-1007 followed by CBS STR-120 test record. Notice the CA record shows a rising at 2500Hz out to 20kHz. The CBS STR-120 measured flat out to 20kHz. The only change is the test records. Which plot is correct?

 

[mackat]

The issue turned out to be the online plot "Standard" vs "Advanced" setup. The Standard result I get a 1.5dB delta between L & R channels of a cartridge (attached case is Nagaoka MP-150). No such delta occurs when I run the Advanced plot. This occurred with CA-TRS-1007 test record but also happens with the CBS STR-100 or STR-120 test record, any test record. I'll stick to using the Advanced setup when running the cartridge FR online plot. The correct test record on attached plots are TRS-1007 (20Hz-20kHz), they're mislabeled CBS-STR-120 which is 500Hz-50kHz.

When you’re running the advanced plot, you have absolute selected instead of relative

 

[sqrl]

Two plots below, top is Clear Audio TR-1007 followed by CBS STR-120 test record. Notice the CA record shows a rising at 2500Hz out to 20kHz. The CBS STR-120 measured flat out to 20kHz. The only change is the test records. Which plot is correct?

View attachment 534877

View attachment 534878

Use advanced. Under Normalization Mode, select Relative. Under End Frequency (Hz) enter 20000.
Also, the capacitance loading of 47 pF is just the selection on the phono amp. You can add the capacitance of your tonearm wiring and cables, if known. And 147 kOhm is a typo.

 

[richjoh]

Use advanced. Under Normalization Mode, select Relative. Under End Frequency (Hz) enter 20000.
Also, the capacitance loading of 47 pF is just the selection on the phono amp. You can add the capacitance of your tonearm wiring and cables, if known. And 147 kOhm is a typo.

147k Ohm is the setting on the Schitt Mani2 preamp. This value gives flattest response. What is relative mode in reference too? RIAA correction.

There is a difference in test records. Are you saying relative mode on both vinyl records will fix this issue due to software compensation?

 

[sqrl]

147k Ohm is the setting on the Schitt Mani2 preamp. This value gives flattest response. What is relative mode in reference too? RIAA correction.

There is a difference in test records. Are you saying relative mode on both vinyl records will fix this issue due to software compensation?

Schiit Mani2 Input Loading:

Selectable R: 47KΩ, 200Ω, 47Ω, or 38Ω
Selectable C: 47pF, 100pF, 150pF, or 200pF

47 kΩ is standard across the industry for MM phono amps.

Relative mode is selected under normalization, i.e. whether amplitude is normalized to 1 kHz for individual channels (relative) or for both channels (absolute). Selecting absolute means you can't tell if there is a consistent channel imbalance.

There is a difference in the frequency range of the test records. CA has an end frequency of 20 kHz and STR-120 has an end frequency of 50 kHz. There is little point in measuring the Nagaoka MP-200 to 50 kHz, as it only has a rated frequency response to 23 kHz. The other point I made earlier is that you are making it hard to compare the frequency response on the two records, because your zoomed scale on the TRS-1007 goes from +4.5 to -4.5 dB, whereas your zoomed scale for the STR-120 goes from +6 to -42 dB. The only reason it goes to -42 dB (automatically) is that you are measuring the cartridge output to 45 kHz, at which it has no useful output. If you set the End Frequency to 20 kHz under Advanced, you can compare the responses with a similar range on the zoomed scale.

 

[richjoh]

Schiit Mani2 Input Loading:

Selectable R: 47KΩ, 200Ω, 47Ω, or 38Ω
Selectable C: 47pF, 100pF, 150pF, or 200pF

47 kΩ is standard across the industry for MM phono amps.

Relative mode is selected under normalization, i.e. whether amplitude is normalized to 1 kHz for individual channels (relative) or for both channels (absolute). Selecting absolute means you can't tell if there is a consistent channel imbalance.

There is a difference in the frequency range of the test records. CA has an end frequency of 20 kHz and STR-120 has an end frequency of 50 kHz. There is little point in measuring the Nagaoka MP-200 to 50 kHz, as it only has a rated frequency response to 23 kHz. The other point I made earlier is that you are making it hard to compare the frequency response on the two records, because your zoomed scale on the TRS-1007 goes from +4.5 to -4.5 dB, whereas your zoomed scale for the STR-120 goes from +6 to -42 dB. The only reason it goes to -42 dB (automatically) is that you are measuring the cartridge output to 45 kHz, at which it has no useful output. If you set the End Frequency to 20 kHz under Advanced, you can compare the responses with a similar range on the zoomed scale.

Apologies on the pF and kOhms which I swap at times. 147pF (Mani2 switch) + 47pF (integrated) = 194pF total ~200pF.

I used the same MP200 wav files previously posted. Here's the comparison from 600Hz to 20kHz between CA TRS-1007 and the CBA STR-120. I choose 600Hz for the low since I have a anomaly happening at 500Hz with the CBS STR-120 (shown in prior post). Relative mode enabled.

 

[sqrl]

Apologies on the pF and kOhms which I swap at times. 147pF (Mani2 switch) + 47pF (integrated) = 194pF total ~200pF.

I used the same MP200 wav files previously posted. Here's the comparison from 600Hz to 20kHz between CA TRS-1007 and the CBA STR-120. I choose 600Hz for the low since I have a anomaly happening at 500Hz with the CBS STR-120 (shown in prior post). Relative mode enabled.

View attachment 535148
View attachment 535149

That's a bit clearer now. You can see the channel imbalance is about the same on both test records. It is <1.5 dB, which is the Nagaoka specification. If you haven't adjusted azimuth another way, you might be able to rotate the headshell slightly anti-clockwise in the collet at the end of the arm - there's usually a little give in the slot. You can experiment with very small rotations until you bring the right and left crosstalk traces closer together in the bass and midrange.

You can add 20 pF to the capacitance for the Technics tonearm wiring. You can look up the capacitance for your RCA cables and add that to find your total capacitance. Even with 3ft of low capacitance cable, you would probably be adding 45 pF. If you add 65+ pF, you can see your total is going to be 250+ pF, which is a bit above the specification of 150-200 pF.

You can also do the charts with the "Style 3 - Stacked Plots" option under "Plot Style". That makes it easier to compare the distortion traces. It's good if you can keep 2nd harmonic distortion below -30 dB at 5 kHz and below -20 dB at high frequency. You probably get distortion lower than it is and also crosstalk lower than it is, if you use a headshell shim. The VTA for the Nagaoka - and most other modern cartridges - is higher than the cutting angle at which the record was cut. If you can bring down the VTA by tilting the back of the cartridge down with a shim, this tends to improve distortion and crosstalk. You can use a shim of 2.5-3° for the Nagaoka body without the back of the cartridge starting to touch your records - 2.5° may be safer for warped ones. This allows you to change VTA whilst keeping the headshell and tonearm parallel to the record.

 

[Thomas_A]

I do not remember which STR record that had odd fr response, but @JP may know.

 

[sqrl]

Apologies on the pF and kOhms which I swap at times. 147pF (Mani2 switch) + 47pF (integrated) = 194pF total ~200pF.

I used the same MP200 wav files previously posted. Here's the comparison from 600Hz to 20kHz between CA TRS-1007 and the CBA STR-120. I choose 600Hz for the low since I have a anomaly happening at 500Hz with the CBS STR-120 (shown in prior post). Relative mode enabled.

View attachment 535148
View attachment 535149

Are you using the outer, middle or inner bands on the STR-120? The high frequencies drop off from the outer bands inwards.

 

[mackat]

Denon DL-60

Denon DL-60 + DSN-65 JICO SAS/B

This is actually the JICO SAS/B for the DL-65, which is red instead of white. I don't believe there's any actual differences in the cartridge bodies.

When I got it, the cantilever was not centered quite right.

Here's a measurement at typical loading:

I purchased this through a Japanese proxy, so I had no recourse. I decided to attempt to adjust the suspension in an effort to center the cantilever.

I'm no professional at this, but I figured I didn't really have anything to lose. I've done this once before with a VN5MR, but also ended up making it ride very low and screwing up crosstalk.

After some fiddling, the cantilever was sufficiently centered. I forgot to check before I adjusted it to see if this made it ride any lower, so I'm not sure.

I decided to play with loading to try to get it as flat as possible. Here are the results (this is on a different headshell):

It looks like 36k ohms at 500 pF is the winner!

Not sure why there's so much 2nd harmonic distortion variation in the measurements, especially in the right channel.

This stylus tracks 90 µm at 1.25 g and 100 µm at 1.5 g, which is very good.

It does produce some Barkhausen noise in the right channel when lifting the stylus, which I haven't heard in an SAS before.