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Integrated amp upgrade from Technics 1500c

GearNostalgia

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Hi. I am currently using a Technics 1500c straight into my cinema amp that have no phono input. I consider getting a new dedicated integrated 2channel amp with a good phono stage that is clearly better than the built in riia in the Technics1500c to replace the cinema amp. Using MM cartrigdes and have no plans to go mc.

Anybody got good suggestions about what amps I should listen to?
 

Zek

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I consider getting a new dedicated integrated 2channel amp with a good phono stage
It seems to me that new integrated amplifiers generally do not have a turntable input, or if they do, it is a low quality RIIA part.
 

mike70

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Let me say that the internal phono stage in the Technics is not bad ... the major problem (in my opinion) is the high capacitance to use the Ortofon prefitted cartridge.

If you change the cartridge to AT (as an example), that cartridges requires a low capacitance.

The best is always an external MM phono preamp with capacitance settings. For decent stereo integrateds ... many options ... in class AB the budget Yamahas, NAD, Rotel (you can find some good used ones) ... in class D are many also.

If at some time you want to try MC, you can add a SUT / headamp before the MM preamp and everything you have still works.
 
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GearNostalgia

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Thank you @mike70 . Yes I think the phono in Technics is ok. But I need to get a new and better 2chan amp so I want to get one that also have a better phonostage in it. Looking at amps like Rotel RA-1592 and such. Hard to find accurate tests of the phono in them.
 

Wolf11Man

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When I was still using vinyl, we removed the MM/MC pre amp section from the amp and placed it inside the record player, as it audible improved the sound quality. Transformer was external, of course.
I don't know how good the Technics MM pre is, but an external one, may it be separate, inside an integrated amp or dedicated pre amp. may disapoint you.

If you want to try 2-channel, think about one of the many purist small amps that are around at any price range and connecting the phono directly. The reviews should give you an idea.
 

oceansize

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Thank you @mike70 . Yes I think the phono in Technics is ok. But I need to get a new and better 2chan amp so I want to get one that also have a better phonostage in it. Looking at amps like Rotel RA-1592 and such. Hard to find accurate tests of the phono in them.
Subjective review here praises RA-1592, but marks its phono stage down. Consider integrated amps from Rega and Cyrus that have decent phono stages, or consider an external seperate phono amp.
 

mike70

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Think about it ... If the amplifier have 1k price tag ... what is a reasonable cost for the internal phono preamp? 100 USD ... at best (parts + design)

So, you don't need a super external phono preamp to beat it ... Including the RFI affection you have inside the power amplifier case.

With a 200 USD preamp like the ifi Zen or the Cambridge Solo is more than enough.
 
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GearNostalgia

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Subjective review here praises RA-1592, but marks its phono stage down. Consider integrated amps from Rega and Cyrus that have decent phono stages, or consider an external seperate phono amp.
Thank you. Any special models from Rega/Cyrus where it starts to get good?
 
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GearNostalgia

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Think about it ... If the amplifier have 1k price tag ... what is a reasonable cost for the internal phono preamp? 100 USD ... at best (parts + design)

So, you don't need a super external phono preamp to beat it ... Including the RFI affection you have inside the power amplifier case.

With a 200 USD preamp like the ifi Zen or the Cambridge Solo is more than enough.
I was think about the same about the riia part of the Technics1500c. Guess it is maybe a 100$ affair that they surely must be an amp with a bettet solution built in if the amp is around 2000-3000$.
 
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GearNostalgia

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Think about it ... If the amplifier have 1k price tag ... what is a reasonable cost for the internal phono preamp? 100 USD ... at best (parts + design)

So, you don't need a super external phono preamp to beat it ... Including the RFI affection you have inside the power amplifier case.

With a 200 USD preamp like the ifi Zen or the Cambridge Solo is more than enough.

I need to buy a new integrated amp so a pure phono amp will not do it. And I prefer to a have a clean setup with one good amp with good phono in it. Separates are not what I am looking for.
 

Steven Holt

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It seems to me that you have two choices. You can go vintage, in which case I urge you to look at the Advent Model 300. It had one of the best phono preamps that I ever used. Short of that, the vintage Marantz receivers have a pretty good phono preamp too. Or you can go modern, in which case I urge you to look at the Yamaha AS series. Good Luck!
 

AaronJ

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I’ve not heard a 1500C’s built in phono stage. I do own a 100C which is $200 less and comes with a cart (AT-VM95C) that is about $50 less than the Ortofon 2M Red that comes with the 1500C. Otherwise it’s the same TT without the phono stage. Take that remaining $150 price difference for what you will. I’d bet it’s fine when compared to other $100-200 phono stages and also probably comparable to the phono pre in any $1k-$2k integrated.
 
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GearNostalgia

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Thank you @Steven Holt for your suggestions. I really dig the looks of the Advent, but it a seems a little too weak. Any models of vintage Marantz? I like the looks and specs of the Yamaha A-S series. Wonder if the bigger Yamaha models have better phono or if it the same as in the cheaper models. Have you had any opportunity to listen to the Yamaha models yourself?
 
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GearNostalgia

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I’ve not heard a 1500C’s built in phono stage. I do own a 100C which is $200 less and comes with a cart (AT-VM95C) that is about $50 less than the Ortofon 2M Red that comes with the 1500C. Otherwise it’s the same TT without the phono stage. Take that remaining $150 price difference for what you will. I’d bet it’s fine when compared to other $100-200 phono stages and also probably comparable to the phono pre in any $1k-$2k integrated.

Yes. I agree in my experience the phono stage in the 1500c is about as good a 200$ phonostage that I have compared with. So the stage in my next amplifier needs to do better than that.
 

Steven Holt

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Thank you @Steven Holt for your suggestions. I really dig the looks of the Advent, but it a seems a little too weak. Any models of vintage Marantz? I like the looks and specs of the Yamaha A-S series. Wonder if the bigger Yamaha models have better phono or if it the same as in the cheaper models. Have you had any opportunity to listen to the Yamaha models yourself?
True, the Advent does not have a lot of power, but the phono stage is splendid. Probably best used as a preamp for your purposes. I myself have a Marantz 2220 that I use as a preamp with my Topping PA3s. We have a fellow member, restorerjohn, who know a lot about this than I do, look him up and send him a message if you like, but I think that anything in the 22/2300 series would do the job. The AS 301/501/701/801 differ only in power and inputs, not quality. Now : have I had a chance to listen to Yamaha? I'm a gearhead, of course I have. I have the RX397 sitting on a shelf in my basement. A good friend of mine has the AS501, I've heard that one. It is clean, transparent, and dead quiet from the bottom to the top. Please, keep this in mind : Yamaha has been in this game a long time, they know what they're doing. Good luck and happy listening!
 
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GearNostalgia

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True, the Advent does not have a lot of power, but the phono stage is splendid. Probably best used as a preamp for your purposes. I myself have a Marantz 2220 that I use as a preamp with my Topping PA3s. We have a fellow member, restorerjohn, who know a lot about this than I do, look him up and send him a message if you like, but I think that anything in the 22/2300 series would do the job. The AS 301/501/701/801 differ only in power and inputs, not quality. Now : have I had a chance to listen to Yamaha? I'm a gearhead, of course I have. I have the RX397 sitting on a shelf in my basement. A good friend of mine has the AS501, I've heard that one. It is clean, transparent, and dead quiet from the bottom to the top. Please, keep this in mind : Yamaha has been in this game a long time, they know what they're doing. Good luck and happy listening!

Thank you. Yamaha as1200/2200 have the power I would like to drive my old big speakers and they look cool. Yes Yamaha is a brand with a long legacy. I used to lust for their gear as a kid in the 80ies. Maybe it is a suitable 50 anniversary gift to myself.
 

mike70

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The Yamaha series of integrated amps with VUs is so cute :)
 

mash

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If you can live with industrial modern design......another one you might look at is the Schitt Ragnarok (fully loaded). It doesn't have the power of the Yamahas (Schitt = 60/100) but it has a phono section based on the Mani and comes in at $1,700. I haven't heard it, so I can't directly vouch for it but Schitt publishes test reports for it under the spec tab/section of their web page and it was received pretty favorably by the subjective reviewer crowd (FWTW).
 
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CrustyToad

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Subjective review here praises RA-1592, but marks its phono stage down. Consider integrated amps from Rega and Cyrus that have decent phono stages, or consider an external seperate phono amp.
Rega has been tested here and proven to be a terrible amp, best to avoid


A simple phono pre-amp will be cheaper and more versatile
 

oceansize

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Rega has been tested here and proven to be a terrible amp, best to avoid.


A simple phono pre-amp will be cheaper and more versatile
The OP was "Looking at amps like Rotel RA-1592 and such", not the Rega Io and such.
 
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