Hypothetical Question - Best speaker for equal to or less than $15K USD

[Pearljam5000]

 

[kemmler3D]

Actually one of my hobbies is designing studio control rooms, I've done a few

Not to derail, but any tips for someone with a bare bedroom / office, genelecs and subs, and no treatment? I was at least able to place everything symmetrically but there doesn't seem to be a firm consensus on what kind of treatments are best even if you have good measurements of the in-room response.

Just hints on what to read, or what to avoid reading, would be a big help.

Note: I'm planning on putting up a big 4'x4' QRD diffuser on the back wall, I know it's not the state of the art but I think they look cool. I am far enough away for the design frequency.

 

[gabo4au]

Not to derail, but any tips for someone with a bare bedroom / office, genelecs and subs, and no treatment? I was at least able to place everything symmetrically but there doesn't seem to be a firm consensus on what kind of treatments are best even if you have good measurements of the in-room response.

Just hints on what to read, or what to avoid reading, would be a big help.

Note: I'm planning on putting up a big 4'x4' QRD diffuser on the back wall, I know it's not the state of the art but I think they look cool. I am far enough away for the design frequency.

Yes, start here.. https://ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

Ethan has a lot of practical info about how to get started and debunks a lot of myths, and also digs a bit deeper for those who want to do more. That page is quite old and will look very dated, but the physics of sound has not changed so it's all good!

The simple rule is to start with corner traps in your room, and probably add some panels at the first reflection points. The QRD on the back wall is a reasonable idea too. Making some simple improvements is pretty straight forward, doing a full blown studio control room is a lot more involved.

Also, some times when reading, it's hard to separate what is being done for "sound isolation" vs what is being done to "improve the sound." Study these carefully. If you live in a relatively quiet environment (keeping sound out) and don't have noise issues with neighbors (keeping sound in), then you don't need to worry as much about "sound isolation."

 

[Mikig]

In principle what has been tested as good, works, and could work well almost everywhere.
you could even venture a few names, but then each room and each system adds so many variations that you don't always get close. Furthermore, there are so many valid speakers even in the second-hand world that the value of 15,000 eur/dollar becomes purely a subjective question.

 

[kemmler3D]

Yes, start here.. https://ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

Ethan has a lot of practical info about how to get started and debunks a lot of myths, and also digs a bit deeper for those who want to do more. That page is quite old and will look very dated, but the physics of sound has not changed so it's all good!

The simple rule is to start with corner traps in your room, and probably add some panels at the first reflection points. The QRD on the back wall is a reasonable idea too. Making some simple improvements is pretty straight forward, doing a full blown studio control room is a lot more involved.

Also, some times when reading, it's hard to separate what is being done for "sound isolation" vs what is being done to "improve the sound." Study these carefully. If you live in a relatively quiet environment (keeping sound out) and don't have noise issues with neighbors (keeping sound in), then you don't need to worry as much about "sound isolation."

Cool! I'm familiar with Winer's stuff, it's great and for a long time I considered it as authoritative as anything you could find online. But over time I've become uncertain because there are apparently schools of thought about NOT absorbing first reflections, only second... and then apparently there are more advanced forms of LEDE out there now, and on and on. Clouds vs. back wall vs. front wall, etc.

Realistically I should think about building some membrane bass traps, but for home mixing duties I can probably get away with EQ and headphones for checking the bass.

 

[gabo4au]

Cool! I'm familiar with Winer's stuff, it's great and for a long time I considered it as authoritative as anything you could find online. But over time I've become uncertain because there are apparently schools of thought about NOT absorbing first reflections, only second... and then apparently there are more advanced forms of LEDE out there now, and on and on. Clouds vs. back wall vs. front wall, etc.

Realistically I should think about building some membrane bass traps, but for home mixing duties I can probably get away with EQ and headphones for checking the bass.

Membrane traps only serve specific frequencies. EQ can help on peaks but does nothing for nulls. You need to get your head around the Schroeder frequency, everything above that should be treated more like reverb and you need to get the decay times correct across all the frequencies. That can be done with absorbing or diffusion or a combination. But the most important thing is to get decay down in an appropriate range across all the frequencies above Schroeder. Even with little bass treatment, that will make your room "sound good." Below Schroeder, broadband bass trapping is the first thing to do. Once you do that you might be ok.. If you want to chase perfection, at that point you do tests and find the specific frequencies you need to control and build your membrane traps and set up your EQ for those. I wouldn't touch a membrane trap until I did all the general things and EQ.

But I digress... Speakers under 15K, lots of good info here, I need to do more research and see if I can find places to listen to a few things.

 

[kemmler3D]

Membrane traps only serve specific frequencies. EQ can help on peaks but does nothing for nulls. You need to get your head around the Schroeder frequency, everything above that should be treated more like reverb and you need to get the decay times correct across all the frequencies. That can be done with absorbing or diffusion or a combination. But the most important thing is to get decay down in an appropriate range across all the frequencies above Schroeder. Even with little bass treatment, that will make your room "sound good." Below Schroeder, broadband bass trapping is the first thing to do. Once you do that you might be ok.. If you want to chase perfection, at that point you do tests and find the specific frequencies you need to control and build your membrane traps and set up your EQ for those. I wouldn't touch a membrane trap until I did all the general things and EQ.

But I digress... Speakers under 15K, lots of good info here, I need to do more research and see if I can find places to listen to a few things.

I've toyed with the idea of building a tunable membrane trap with MLV and some kind of mechanism to tighten / loosen it for specific frequencies... broadband for bass is out of the question since the room is pretty full as it is. I think some 4" rockwool at key reflection points would be a good place to start, but anyway, we're way off topic now.

Definitely looking forward to your impressions if you manage to demo any of the speakers mentioned ITT.